Gun control laws will solve events like today's like drug control laws stop drugs.

As a first line of defense, I believe a few well trained and armed teachers would be a comfort to parents and also serve as somewhat of a deterrent to would be shooters. As it is now, any nut who wants to shoot up a school can be pretty certain that no one there has a gun.

I agree with that.

I just think it's a little disingenuous to draw comparisons between what happened in Connecticut and the knife attack in China. Politics on both sides be damned... the fact is that guns make it a hell of a lot easier to kill lots of people in a short timeframe.

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Okay, so maybe that pass rush is still an issue. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Just to make myself clear, my intention wasn't to compare the two attacks. Hell I didn't even know about the shooting in Connecticut when I posted the link about China.

My sole intention was to show that people that want to hurt/kill people badly enough will find a way to do it.

Also, I am not accusing your post as being directed at me. Just thought I would put this out there.

Truth be told, I am upset that I even posted the link now.

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Agreed Gun Control does not work, we have tried it , assault weapon bans and it was all for no effect. I think the best course is make schools hard targets, metal detectors , training on what to do for teachers. Security guards that are armed would be a good idea too.

I've been seeing a ton of anti-gun rhetoric, and I think we'll see something drastic happen this time around regarding control and banning and such. It's going to happen. Private and government sentiment are largely for it. Take away our toys because we can't play with them right. And then guard our schools like Fort Fuckin' Knox, make the lil' guys like complete prisoners inside. And then when it happens again, what?

Fuck all is being said about why folks like this are going completely unnoticed until they explode, only to hear afterward that, yea, they had some serious issues nobody wanted to say shit about. God forbid we actually try to unfuck people. We're all special snowflakes, all different and unique in our own sometimes very twisted ways, and that's alright. Except that it's not.

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I agree that there's more of a mentality problem than a gun problem. Either way, something needs to be addressed. "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" is a do-nothing stance and America's gun behavior is not acceptable.

I would go a step further and say in a lot of ways, America's behavior is not acceptable.

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Can we perhaps agree to a 24-hour moratorium on the overall gun debate in here? Or something? Just out of respect.

This thread is bizarrely prescient and it's not Roland's fault that he posted it 15 hours before the shooting, but people are already starting to edge back into the debate and we're all doubtlessly carrying a ton of emotion right now.

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Should we have put a moratorium on the Oregon mall shooting? They seem to be occuring in 24 hour cycles now. As long as violence continues, the debate should be put on hold? Absolutely not.

Very true. We see this with all kinds of stuff unrelated (at least on outward appearances) to this. We're a horribly selfish society. We don't know how to lose well or win well. If things don't go our way, we come unhinged. Black Friday stampedes, road rage, brawls everywhere from kids' soccer games to the NFL, you name it. Grow the fuck up. It ain't the end of the world if you don't get what you want every time. That's one thing I'm happy to report my kids are learning well.

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Changed the title to this, by the way. Didn't think it was really appropriately named, all things considered.

Also, let's do our best to keep this topic open by being civil and thought driven, rather than reactionary and based on emotions, which are running high at a time like this.

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Gun control won't stop the psychopaths from commiting these evil acts. It reallys seems though that the 'gun culture' in our country is so far gone that it will be near impossible to put the genie back in the bottle.

I'd venture to say that 99% of gun owners have no malicious intent at all (depends on what you consider hunting I guess) and are top notch citizens. It really is all about social,mental health issues and developing a society that breeds less psychopaths (as hard as that may seem).

Contrast is an interesting thing though. I am 2 years removed from living in Vancouver for grad school (UBC) and even though I am as proud of an american as anyone, it just felt "safer", "more civilized" and "saner". The culture didn't feel violent or threatining at all, yet there was little noticeable police presence anywhere I went. I'm not sure how as country we can get going in that direction, but it would be nice to try. As ambiguous a term as "culture" is, I think it is a significant and tangible thing.

It's funny how your definition of standard fits your own post.

Not a bad idea. I'd also like to just throw out there that I started this thread BEFORE this shooting happened, and there was a page+ of replies before the shooting. In case anyone comes in here, sees the first page of replies, and thinks we're all a bunch of heartless pricks.

1. Read up on Bath Michigan and the school bombing. 120 killed the whole school was blown up with homemade bombs. Look at the Middle East they just use Suicide bombers. Granted guns maybe easier , but its not too hard to find other methods.

2. Violence ? Read Grossman's On Killing. He makes a strong case for a correlation between violent Video Games, Movies etc. and desensitization to violence. Video it is how we teach soldiers today in a lot of things

3. How do these situations end? Much of the time by a cop with a gun. The person that wields it is the one that makes its use good or bad. It is not bad itself just a tool

OK what to do? What we should have done a long time ago
1 harden the schools
2 guards that are armed
3 metal detectors
4 locks on class room doors. Real dead bolt locks not little push button ones
5. Teach the Staff what to do! Some things that have worked in School Shootings

Barricades.. Desks up against the door etc
Swarm attacks that overwhelm the shooter

This teacher in the shooting did it right, and no children were injured in her class:
2:48 p.m.: Hero teacher Kaitlin Roig tells ABC News that she barricaded her first grade students in classroom bathroom and locked the door when she first heard gun shots. “The kids were being so good. They asked: ‘Can we go see if anyone is out there? … I just want Christmas… I don’t want to die, I just want to have Christmas.’ I said, you’re going to have Christmas and Hanukkah.. I tried to be positive.”"



I don't like the guns don't kill people , people kill people line as it is a jingle more that anything. We tried the AWB and it didn't work. We tried very restrictive license in Chicago , New York and they are leaders in crime.

It is time we went after the sickos that kill children and don't give them non stop press that is just want they wish...to go down and be remembered forever for what they did

No reporting of names. Just Shooter #1 etc. that way they never can be famous for evil

Gah. I didn't want to get into this today, but then the "video games cause violence" debate was put up, and I couldn't stay away. HOW many countries are filled with terrorists, pirates, smugglers, etc. that have never seen a video game console in their life that kill people every day? Yeah. Please, do not even attempt to justify this garbage as it relates to video games.

Every school teacher should carry a pistol at all times and be extensively trained on its use, and you should have to pass a customized small arms training program to be eligible to even apply for a teaching certificate. That way the next time this happens, as soon as shooting starts, the teacher in the next room can come in and blow the asshole's head off.

Protecting your students should be about all forms of protecting them, not just giving them advice about drugs, alcohol, and sex. Include bodily harm and let's get shit done.

I feel safer abroad anywhere I go rather than in my own country and that is a sad statement.

That's what a resource officer is for.

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Too bad that's a ridiculous notion. Thailand has a higher murder rate than the U.S.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate