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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:27 pm 
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Well, yes, I'm sure in Sacrmento there is competition for pro sports dollars.

But, that competition is diluted enough by; number of teams (Raiders or 49ers) and whether they follow it at all. Or, to put it in simpler terms, there's far more DIE HARD Kings fans in Sacramento than there is die hard any other type of fans. Sure, there may be die hard Raiders fans, but not more than the cities ONLY pro sports team, the Kings. The Raiders, 49ers, whomever will never get the equal number of die hard fans.

I'm sure there's plenty of Seahawks fans in Portland. But, there's not more than diehard Blazer fans.

Not sure if that makes sense?


Last edited by pehawk on Thu May 23, 2013 7:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:28 pm 
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Nope

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:33 pm 
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Hawk Strap wrote:
Nope


Well, fair enough.

I still think the NBA will always prefer a market like Portland, OKC, San Antonio, etc. Pink and I disagree on the reasons why they do. Maybe Sacramento's a poor choice to illustrate that belief (even though I still believe its a one-horse market)?


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:33 pm 
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No, it does make sense. I just think the whole aspect of "diehard fans" amounts to more civic and political pressure to get buildings, but that the other teams seeing more support might mean that more revenue from TV, merchandise, etc., is going to the other leagues from Sacramento rather than to the NBA, while subsidy for buildings and gate revenues might favor the smaller markets (right now I believe both football teams have more season ticket holders in Sac than the Kings do, but in general, I think gate revenues favor the hometown team). The thing is, gate revenues from the regular joes aren't a primary focus of any of the leagues (besides the NHL still), which is why I keep coming back to the public subsidies. I mean, think how much money is gifted from cities to a league's owners by putting $300m+ into a building that's going to increase revenue streams on-site far more than it's going to add to the local economy. If owners' only big expenditures are payroll and the initial lump sum of buying the team, and they basically get a free ride for buildings, life's a piece of cake.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:42 pm 
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I do agree with you on Kohl, it'll take some serious events to get him to ruin the family's political future. And, that's what is on the line there. So, its very unlikely.

I have nothing to base this on, but I think expansion has already been promised and committed to.

Oh, and, while Sactown MAY HAVE been a bad example, I still think its bonkers to NOT align the Packers to Milwaukee. That’s just crazy-talk.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:24 am 
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Smelly McUgly wrote:
Hawkfan77 wrote:
Wow 2 hours?? No one would ever drive that far to see an NFL game... :sarcasm_off:


In that case, let's just adopt the Blazers, a team only a bit farther away from Seattle, as our NBA team! Sarcasm also off and such.

Ok, let's adopt a team in a different state that was a rival when we we had the sonics. What a perfect example...oh wait no it wasn't even a good example.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:26 am 
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pehawk wrote:

Hmm, I didn't know that. I'll let the rest of Wisconsin know they aren't Packers fans.

Should we tell Tacoma they're out of the Seahawks fan club?

This is exactly my point.

Smelly is actually trying to say that fans of the brewers and bucks aren't fans of the packers because Green Bay and Milwaukee are 2 hours away from each other...laughable

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 2:20 pm 
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pinksheets wrote:
I don't quite agree with your take, pe. It's not that the NBA wants small markets because they are one horse towns. They want small markets that are one horse towns (because they're small markets) because those are the cities they can most hold hostage in exchange for huge public funds. You want to lose your only sports team? You want us to scar your civic pride a bit and head to a "real" city? Oh, we'll do it, bitches.

It's a horrible business model that I think is unsustainable. It's parasitic, which means moving from city to city, sucking up public money until they're sick of it, then moving onto the next. Eventually you'll run out of reasonable targets or they'll be enough cities say "hell no" that the NBA is going to lose a huge source of cash influx and foundation building (through gifting arenas). They'll have shaky reputations in big markets who make sense simply because of the money and audience in the market, and be stuck in the small towns that don't have the advertising revenues, the spending power, or local economics that can push money into their league through traditional, stable means.


That's the Stern model, it's not necessesarily the NBA model--thank GOD Stern is getting out.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 3:23 pm 
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Throwdown wrote:
I don't know if it'll be relocation or expansion, I do believe we will have a team in the next 2 years though.

Milwaukee isn't as easy as people are trying to make it seem, 6 year lease, owner is pretty adamant about not wanting the team to go to an out of towner. Charlotte is about to change their name back to the Hornets, they have a world class arena already, it might just be a case of the Bobcats brand not catching on.

Who else is there? We aren't getting the Pacers, and they aren't going to move a team from Atlanta to Seattle, Memphis just got a new owner who seems committed to to staying there, Minnesota already said no, I'm running out of teams that would be even remotely possible.

Rebranding is a desperation move for a crap franchise. Isn't that Michal's team? Pink is right - they ain't selling to HBN

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 3:46 pm 
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re: the PP debate - even if there's fifty teams in a market, if it's a huge market like LA there's the POTENTIAL revenue stream if the team gets good--not just in ticket sales either. Big markets are just better. The Stern model is asinine and inverse logical - the dude does it for evil power-grasping thrills, not for the good of the NBA--the NBA grew under the dwarf midget's watch, it is true, but it would be much bigger and better with even an adequet, non-evil commissioner.
P.S. Yeah I know I misspelled adequiet. What's yror point?

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:45 am 
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"the PP debate"? Really? That's hurtful.

That's MR PP, to you.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:59 am 
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Lords of Scythia wrote:
re: the PP debate - even if there's fifty teams in a market, if it's a huge market like LA there's the POTENTIAL revenue stream



Like the NFL?


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 12:11 pm 
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Well lets say this, Seattle and Portland were not mega metropolis's when we both originally got our teams, we have since grown, I wanna say that Seattle was like in the 40's back then and Portland farther yet as far as media markets go. That was in the late 60's. So there were many other locations of higher population density at that time. We both still got teams though. Granted the ABA was trying to get a foothold as well so some of the other markets were already competing then.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 12:44 pm 
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pehawk wrote:
"the PP debate"? Really? That's hurtful.

That's MR PP, to you.

haha - got it.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 5:02 pm 
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Hansen was on Softy's show today... I liked his attitude and he makes it sound like he's going to stick it out. Wish I had that kind of self control.

http://www.sportsradiokjr.com/pages/softy_page.html

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 5:12 pm 
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Love the group, but IMHO they are playing too nice! I think the only language the clowns in the NBA understand would be getting their asses sued off! If the Sonics come back before the MOU runs out then I'm wrong... Just see Seattle being used as a pawn for the next 10 years by the twits in the NBA. Hope I'm dead wrong.......

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 6:21 pm 
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I think if they thought that was the case they'd be going that route. They probably have a better idea of what's going on than us. I'd have backed going nuclear, but I also just trust that they're moving int he right direction.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Tue May 28, 2013 7:49 pm 
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pinksheets wrote:
I think if they thought that was the case they'd be going that route. They probably have a better idea of what's going on than us. I'd have backed going nuclear, but I also just trust that they're moving int he right direction.


I hope you are right, as I'm sure we are not getting the full story.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 8:11 pm 
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Probably just an error, as its only seen on the mobile version of the site, but check it out.

http://m.espn.go.com/nba/teams

And I case it got fixed...


Attachments:
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image.jpg [ 74.81 KiB | Viewed 429 times ]

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 8:32 pm 
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The reason Chris Hansen has been so calm...?


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 1:39 am 
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*strokes chin whiskers intently*

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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Seattle and St Louis. Great. There goes my Christmas


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:10 am 
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I don't know why everyone assumes St. Louis, IF this is something to even have a discussion about.

It could be a number of other cities, Louisville, Kansas City, Vancouver, Pittsburgh, Hell maybe New Jersey can get back in the NBA?

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:02 am 
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Yeah, that list is sorted alphabetically ("TBD" coming after 'S'), so the real "TDB" team names could start with any letter.

That said, does anyone realistically think the NBA would expand twice in the immediate future? I really doubt it. So I think this is just an accident.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:54 am 
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Just throwing this out here, so take it for what it's worth. If the NBA does expand, don't they have to do at least two teams keep the conferences even?

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:11 am 
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sc85sis wrote:
Just throwing this out here, so take it for what it's worth. If the NBA does expand, don't they have to do at least two teams keep the conferences even?


Found this on SBNation.

http://www.sbnation.com/2013/1/17/3886324/nba-expansion-team-seattle-supersonics-sacramento-kings
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But you'd have to add two teams, meaning more dilution and potentially a weak East Coast market to keep things even.

A. Dilution is not a serious concern. See above.

B. The league absolutely does not have to expand by two teams. The NBA has regularly had spans with an odd number of teams, including from 1970-74 (17 teams) and from 1980 (when expansion to Dallas brought the league to 23 teams) through 2004 (when the Bobcats made it 30). During that span, the league added teams in twos and fours when adding them as single teams or in threes would have given the NBA conference balance. Guess what: the NBA traditionally hasn't cared too deeply about conference balance!

So it's totally reasonable to believe that the NBA could expand only to Seattle, giving the West 16 teams, and likely giving the Northwest Division a sixth team.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 1:04 pm 
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Actually, I wouldn't mind St Louis. But give me Syracuse over Seattle, without question.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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Hawk Finn wrote:
Actually, I wouldn't mind St Louis. But give me Syracuse over Seattle, without question.


Why Syracuse over Seattle?

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 2:03 pm 
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Yeah NY needs another team, isn't that why Buffalo Braves are now the Clippers.

KC Omaha has a Arena ready to go also, St Louis possibly in that general area could if negotiated use that if they have something in the works.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 2:32 pm 
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Did I read here that NBA officials we're scoping Omaha?

Maybe it was from Simmons...but Omaha makes alot of sense in the NBA model.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 3:46 pm 
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chris98251 wrote:
Yeah NY needs another team, isn't that why Buffalo Braves are now the Clippers.


Right, cause Cali needs a dozen teams. Upstate has nothing. Syracuse would serve as a beacon of hope for every citizen north of the Hudson.

C'mon, like you wouldn't buy a Syracuse Chill jersey. Pfft


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 3:54 pm 
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Please tell me nobody is stupid enough to think that both teams must be in the late S's/early T's based on their placement. They're in alphabetical order and the TBD TBD is lined up where it should be...ya know....based on the alphabet.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:10 pm 
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Not sure at whom that comment was directed, but I'll assume that it's me since I'm the only one that made what was a fairly obvious tongue-in-cheek comment simply for the sake of being an ass. Please tell me nobody is stupid enough to think that it was serious. Oh wait, it's far too late for several of you. I'm not mad, though.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:15 pm 
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Get your filthy tongue out of my cheek.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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Take it!!!


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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I'm totally for real about 'Cuse, tho. We Upstaters need more than the Bills and Sabres in our local sports lives.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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Well then you could hang Dave Twarsik's Jersey again, can't for sure remember his spelling, Elgin Baylor played for the Braves also if memory serves.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:25 pm 
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Pstark3 wrote:
The reason Chris Hansen has been so calm...?


plus the reason why PJ has been declining job offers...?

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:39 pm 
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Maybe Hansen has been told expansion has been coming, but I'll tell you that ESPN has not been told by the NBA "hey, we're expanding, we just wanted to let you know so you could get your mobile app ready ASAP, just don't tell anybody."

That whole thing is meaningless.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:09 pm 
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pinksheets wrote:
Maybe Hansen has been told expansion has been coming, but I'll tell you that ESPN has not been told by the NBA "hey, we're expanding, we just wanted to let you know so you could get your mobile app ready ASAP, just don't tell anybody."

That whole thing is meaningless.


Lol, yeah. If it were on the NBA website, however, that would be another thing.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:09 am 
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pinksheets wrote:
Maybe Hansen has been told expansion has been coming, but I'll tell you that ESPN has not been told by the NBA "hey, we're expanding, we just wanted to let you know so you could get your mobile app ready ASAP, just don't tell anybody."

That whole thing is meaningless.


Pretty much, but it was fun to dream for first 5 minutes then you realize it's probably just a screw up on ESPN

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
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http://live.wsj.com/video/stern-kings-s ... CDF4814498

Stern says the $30M deposit is "non-refundable"


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 08, 2013 9:25 pm 
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Pstark3 wrote:
http://live.wsj.com/video/stern-kings-suitors-never-got-their-30m-back/29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498.html#!29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498

Stern says the $30M deposit is "non-refundable"


It always was, more so the Maloofs couldn't back out. That doesn't change the fact that Stern is an absolute worthless human being. I really wish Hansen would have nuked it. I wanted Stern's final year to be as miserable as possible.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 4:44 pm 
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JOz56 wrote:
Pstark3 wrote:
http://live.wsj.com/video/stern-kings-suitors-never-got-their-30m-back/29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498.html#!29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498

Stern says the $30M deposit is "non-refundable"


It always was, more so the Maloofs couldn't back out. That doesn't change the fact that Stern is an absolute worthless human being. I really wish Hansen would have nuked it. I wanted Stern's final year to be as miserable as possible.

Yeah, I wish Hansen got a little dirty and made Stern deal with a lawsuit in his last year.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:31 pm 
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Hawkfan77 wrote:
JOz56 wrote:
Pstark3 wrote:
http://live.wsj.com/video/stern-kings-suitors-never-got-their-30m-back/29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498.html#!29840C18-F728-41D4-B332-E8CDF4814498

Stern says the $30M deposit is "non-refundable"


It always was, more so the Maloofs couldn't back out. That doesn't change the fact that Stern is an absolute worthless human being. I really wish Hansen would have nuked it. I wanted Stern's final year to be as miserable as possible.

Yeah, I wish Hansen got a little dirty and made Stern deal with a lawsuit in his last year.


The fact that he hasn't is the main reason I think we have been promised an expansion team.....*sigh*

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:47 pm 
* Capt'n Dom *
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I saw some tweets today from the sonics rising guys that they are talking expansion for Seattle. Obviously this is the reason we backed down and didn't fight harder for the kings. A team is coming our way in the next year to two. Book it.

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:52 pm 
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Lots and lots of talk about the Coyotes coming to Seattle today. Obviously there are problems with our arena situation, as the Key is not ideal, but still, seems like the NHL is open to just going ahead with it.

And then this:

Sonics Arena ‏@sonicsarena 12m
Back to work.


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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 5:59 pm 
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*squeal*

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 Post subject: Re: NBA returning to Seattle?
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 6:16 pm 
* Capt'n Dom *
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http://www.komonews.com/sports/Report-NBA-Chris-Hansen-in-productive-talks-for-Seattle-expansion-team-211272931.html?m=y&smobile=y

Chris Hansen and Steve Ballmer, the principal investors in the prospective Seattle basketball ownership group, have reportedly started "productive" talks with the NBA for securing an expansion team.

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