Archie Manning

Jazzhawk

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Watching "The Book of Manning" on ESPN and they are currently chronicling Archie Manning and showing highlights of his college career. I tell you what, his style of play would have been perfect for the current Seahawks team. Dang. Much more athletic than his sons, with the ability to avoid the rush and run the ball, not to mention his ability to huck the ball all around.
 

Vetamur

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Its all the rage now for people to say Archie is "over rated" when people say he was a great QB stuck on a horrible team for a over decade. I hate that. I hate people not understanding football was very very different in the 70s and 80s.. and so looking at stat lines and making horrible conclusions.

Manning was excellent.
 
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Jazzhawk

Jazzhawk

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I did not see him as a college player, but I did have the privilege of seeing him play in the NFL with my own eyes. I concur with your last statement.
 

The Radish

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I disagree completely about father Manning.

I think NO had some success in those years DESPITE Archie Manning!

He was at best barely average. Always dinged up, always whining (which he did a great job of passing on to his sons).

Never EVER accepted responsiblity for his mistakes, always blamed them on someone else or some other part of the team.

I suppose there are people here that think he should be in the hall of fame and I agree, but we differ in what his participation should be. Being a janitor in the building would just about complete the description of his abilitys would be.

:roll:
 

DTexHawk

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The Radish":2ufk9ctk said:
I disagree completely about father Manning.

I think NO had some success in those years DESPITE Archie Manning!

He was at best barely average. Always dinged up, always whining (which he did a great job of passing on to his sons).

Never EVER accepted responsiblity for his mistakes, always blamed them on someone else or some other part of the team.

I suppose there are people here that think he should be in the hall of fame and I agree, but we differ in what his participation should be. Being a janitor in the building would just about complete the description of his abilitys would be.

:roll:

Don't have time to go look it up, but you have already been proven wrong with your memory of Archie. Something about how SF always kicked his a**, and then when you pull the record it's clear no such thing happened.

Keep on rolling your eyes, they may be the only thing still working in your head.
 

hidn

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DTexHawk":2ccqa4js said:
The Radish":2ccqa4js said:
I disagree completely about father Manning.

I think NO had some success in those years DESPITE Archie Manning!

He was at best barely average. Always dinged up, always whining (which he did a great job of passing on to his sons).

Never EVER accepted responsiblity for his mistakes, always blamed them on someone else or some other part of the team.

I suppose there are people here that think he should be in the hall of fame and I agree, but we differ in what his participation should be. Being a janitor in the building would just about complete the description of his abilitys would be.

:roll:

Don't have time to go look it up, but you have already been proven wrong with your memory of Archie. Something about how SF always kicked his a**, and then when you pull the record it's clear no such thing happened.

Keep on rolling your eyes, they may be the only still working in your head.


You remind me of Cersei Lannister from game of thrones.
 

hawker84

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I didn't see him play college and barely remember him from the NFL, but looking at the game film from the show last night, he looked pretty darn good to me.. Did anybody else think watching him play, that Eli is the spitting image of him on the field.. throwing motion and his body language. really caught my eye. I think eli has a better arm, but it looks like Archie was much more mobile than either of his two sons...
 

SalishHawkFan

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I watched Archie Manning play and he was always one of my favorite players. Great Qb stuck on the 'aints team whose fans wore paper bags over their heads.
 

onanygivensunday

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Being 65 y/o ad a fan of the NFL since I was about 10, I watched Archie play as well.

Imo, he's far from being HoF material.

He was fun to watch but he never "tilted the field" as Pete as John like to say.

He was okay... but so were hundreds more before him and after him.

And, he was a whiner as The Radish has pointed out.
 

TeamoftheCentury

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Archie Manning was and is an exemplary, class individual. I applaud his commitment to being a family man first and a football player second. Whether or not he is HOF material isn't going to define him. But, he was a heck of a player.
 

MizzouHawkGal

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The Radish":2n4mg66j said:
I disagree completely about father Manning.

I think NO had some success in those years DESPITE Archie Manning!

He was at best barely average. Always dinged up, always whining (which he did a great job of passing on to his sons).

Never EVER accepted responsiblity for his mistakes, always blamed them on someone else or some other part of the team.

I suppose there are people here that think he should be in the hall of fame and I agree, but we differ in what his participation should be. Being a janitor in the building would just about complete the description of his abilitys would be.

:roll:
Obviously I am around 25-30 or so years younger than you so I agree with AGM's assessment more than yours.
 

RolandDeschain

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Archie was before my time, and I don't pretend to know anything about him. However, watching what he helped Eli do in terms of getting traded after he was drafted, I automatically strongly dislike him regardless of what his skill set was like in the NFL during his day.
 

TeamoftheCentury

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RolandDeschain":174t86l3 said:
Archie was before my time, and I don't pretend to know anything about him. However, watching what he helped Eli do in terms of getting traded after he was drafted, I automatically strongly dislike him regardless of what his skill set was like in the NFL during his day.
You're entitled to your opinion. Allow me to offer something to ponder. Yeah, there seemed to be something unusual about that as it was all reported at the time. Does anyone have the complete story on what went down with that? I don't think any of us do. But, we have opinions, for certain.

Archie and the Manning family wasn't about to get detailed about their reasons, but there must have been a strong enough reason for them to take such a strong stand. Perhaps something in interviews with Chargers management, etc. I don't know. But, I applaud a parent and a Patriarch sticking his neck out - even for his adult kid. There's a mentality today that once someone reaches the age of 18... they need to just make their own decisions as if it's an indication of maturity. Advice and guidance from wise elders is not necessary nor desired. I don't think it says anything about lack of maturity in Eli in this matter. On the contrary, it showed maturity beyond his years to take advisement from his parents on the matter. Too, Archie wasn't acting as some dictator of the family. He was standing quietly strong with their family decision. I understand that this isn't the way we tend to think these days fearing it would be some infringement to our personal independence. Not so (but, that's a longer conversation.)

This is no digression from the subject matter and very much what was going on in that instance. I think we all wish we were so valued by our elders that they would care to advise and we would care to listen and heed wise counsel. I understand that everyone isn't in that position, but there is something good and right about what we saw. The deal is, though... it's so foreign to our thinking today that many didn't like it - especially how it was portrayed in the media. (The media could have chosen to applaud a family decision, but they simply did not.) I think the Mannings tried to keep it as discreet as possible (I know, the first pick overall is going to get press. The press wasn't about to allow something so wholesome as the jurisdiction of a family to control the perceived jurisdiction of a football organization. Nothing the Mannings did was stating a disrespect for the NFL empire. They just stood strongly to their terms. It was a principled stand.) The Mannings didn't go public with a lot of details and maybe their reasons would not be satisfactory to us anyway. Even if the Mannings just were being attention hungry and wanted Eli to play in the media capital of the world (none of that sounds like the Mannings)... it was their family decision. I not only respect it... I admire it for said reasons.

This response wasn't directed at you personally, Roland. I think your comment represented commonly held viewpoint of what went down and my reason for taking the time to write on this was only to try to represent a different perspective. I'll admit that I even had some of those thoughts at the time. We're conditioned to think that way - and the opinion gets stronger and untouchable because no one wants to dare defend what most are attacking.

I hold the jurisdiction of the family in high regard... even if it means one misses out on the praise of the world or if it means one "misses out" on some personal advancement opportunity (which, I grant, wasn't apparently the case for the Mannings either way with the Chargers or Giants. Still, they felt strongly that it was best for Eli not to play with the Chargers organization.)
 

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Players should not be able to get re-drafted because they don't like the first team that drafted them. End of story. (Yes, I know he was traded, but he forced himself to get onto another team.)

If a rookie sits out like that, the NFL should put an automatic two-year suspension on the player, barring them from playing with any team. Nobody would ever do it, then.
 

pehawk

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RolandDeschain":3hci6sa4 said:
Players should not be able to get re-drafted because they don't like the first team that drafted them. End of story. (Yes, I know he was traded, but he forced himself to get onto another team.)

If a rookie sits out like that, the NFL should put an automatic two-year suspension on the player, barring them from playing with any team. Nobody would ever do it, then.

Really? Its that black and white? I don't see it like that.

As much as I want to dislike the Manning's, I can see their side of the argument on this. I have a choice where to work. You have a choice where to work. And, how do we know if there wasn't good information showing the Chargers maybe aren't the best in terms of medical facilities. If you were a parent, would you get warm fuzzies sending your child to the Browns or Tampa, knowing full well only sharing needles increases your chance for MRSA more, than there? Also, we're talking about potential paralysis anytime the players step on the field, that gives them a little discretion and input, IMO. ESPECIALLY in a league that always comes kicking and screaming to the negotiation table on retirement, medical, or even contract fairness and guarantees.

It's really easy to say "but they make lots of money to play a game...so they should do what's asked". But, that's equal in laziness and bias, IMO. People say that, almost 100% of the time, because they want the money the ball player makes. Any of us would want the best and most secure scenario for our family's long-term financial health, yet, not for the player in scenarios like this.

It's baseball, but a great insight into the players viewpoint is a film called "Sugar". No one wears a cape in it, and it's subtle, so no one on this sites watched it. But still, it tells a great story from a players perspective.

This needs to be viewed through relative terms. If we were in Eli's situation, would we want what's best for us? Einstein developed the theory of relativity for scenarios like this.
 

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I don't get all the hate on the Mannings for what they did about the draft. Elway did the same damn thing and no one really ever brings that up.

Also I get Rolands point but at the same time if a team is clearly dysfunctional and you are a player with that type of leverage, why not use it? Teams use every ounce of leverage they have every chance they get.

I also remember Arian Foster pretty much told us he didn't want to play here. He doesn't get any heat for it.
 

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I hate Peyton because I played with his type growing up. I played with some douche coaches son all through pop warner, who like Peyton blamed others and cried after losses. I know I'm right in saying he's THAT kid. I hated those types. I just did.

And, I hate all of you. Especially KCHawkgirl and FlyingGreg...master trolls they are. That's beside the point though.
 

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Disagree about your point of view, Pehawk. A far more apt analogy is that the NFL is an employer in a particular field (playing football) that is the absolute best, and nothing else remotely compares. You're good enough to get hired on at that company, and the first thing you do is say the position you were assigned to isn't good enough for you, and you refuse to work it until you are given a different one.

The choice of different employers - your example - is "Go play in the CFL", which you totally can do, but it'd be stupid, of course.

Why should Archie Manning's ego for his sons to be 1a and 1b of the greatest QBs of all time trump the NFL? It's BS. For a league so (rightfully) concerned with parity, no rookie should be able to do it. You wait and get your shot in free agency like everyone else, or you don't play in the league. That would be my vote if I was an owner. What if DangeRuss had pulled this crap with us? I highly doubt you'd be alright with it if you watched us HAVE to trade him to someone else and he has the rookie year he had with us.
 

pehawk

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RolandDeschain":274yg1lt said:
Disagree about your point of view, Pehawk. A far more apt analogy is that the NFL is an employer in a particular field (playing football) that is the absolute best, and nothing else remotely compares. You're good enough to get hired on at that company, and the first thing you do is say the position you were assigned to isn't good enough for you, and you refuse to work it until you are given a different one.

The choice of different employers - your example - is "Go play in the CFL", which you totally can do, but it'd be stupid, of course.

Why should Archie Manning's ego for his sons to be 1a and 1b of the greatest QBs of all time trump the NFL? It's BS. For a league so (rightfully) concerned with parity, no rookie should be able to do it. You wait and get your shot in free agency like everyone else, or you don't play in the league. That would be my vote if I was an owner. What if DangeRuss had pulled this crap with us? I highly doubt you'd be alright with it if you watched us HAVE to trade him to someone else and he has the rookie year he had with us.

No, I wouldn't. I'm pretty consistent in my views on personal freedoms and the NFL being shady as an organization. Until they get a good CBA, I'll always side with the players, period. Roland, you've complained about not being able to pirate NFL stuff on your youtube channel, yet you'd be okay with risking your body for an employer you think's incompetent? Really?

Look at this CBA. By design it's meant to not give big money on 2nd contracts. The players got took at the negotiating table, period, end of story. By design its meant to chew up the players and spit them out.

I think its MESSED up Russell isn't getting paid more. And, if he we're to break his neck Sunday, he'd never get that 2nd contract. "Tough luck"?
 
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