For Ninerbuff... You're just wrong.

rideaducati

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I don't get all of the Kaepernick love. Sure, he's big with a strong arm, but he stares at one spot on the field after taking the snap and doesn't throw the ball until the WR is open.

Just watch him on every play. He walks up behind the center, turns his head side to side too fast to really see anything (like he learned to look at the defense but doesn't quite understand why). He then takes the snap and looks at one part of the field and doesn't turn his head away for anything. If the receiver is covered, he just stands there staring at that same receiver until the receiver is open and then guns the ball in or he runs.

Kaepernick reminds me a lot of Tarvaris Jackson except Tarvaris wouldn't run and would take the sack.


I've got nothing for you. You've already made your mind up. If you'd like to be proven wrong, please see...

First Start:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights
at 1:41, he throws Mario Manningham open for a huge gain
at 2:00, finds 3rd receiver in progression (Crabtree) for TD

At New England:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights
at 1:51, finds 3rd receiver in progression (Walker) for TD
at 3:45, Kaep throws a dart between double coverage for a TD
at 5:47, Kaep adjust the play at the line, recognizing single coverage on Crabtree, TD ... it's doesn't show his presnap read, but other highlights do (unfortunately I can't find any that NFL.com hasn't taken down)

Arizona - Needed a Win to Secure Bye
http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/201212301 ... &tab=recap
at 0:09, avoids the rush, finds finds 2nd receiver (Crabtree) for long TD over Patrick Peterson
at 0:24, finds Crabtree again, with Peterson in great position, throws Crabtree open for the TD.

First Playoff Game:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights
at 1:01, avoids rush, finds Gore in a broken play, beautiful touch for a big gain
at 3:19, throws a bullet to only where Crabtree can get it. TD
at 5:41, throws a great touch pass to Vernon for a big gain, pump fake + 2nd read
at 6:48, throws Walker open on a big 3rd down play

NFC Championship away, down 17
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights
at 2:53, throws into double coverage, throws open Vernon Davis
at 3:03, 3:29, throws nice touch passes to Vernon
at 4:28, throws open Delani Walker
at 5:05, finds 2nd option Vernon with a sweet touch pass
at 6:40, there aren't too many QBs in the league that can make that throw!

Super Bowl, down 22
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-high ... highlights
at 1:15, good touch pass to Vernon in between coverage
at 6:38, good double clutch pass to Vernon
at 6:48, again good pass in coverage, Crabtree finishes play with TD
at 9:33, finds 2nd option Moss for big gain
at 11:05, throws a dart inbetween multiple defenders

Obviously, these are only highlights, and there are a lot of dink/dunk plays too, but I can gather from your comment that you haven't watch much, if any 49ers other than the Seattle game.

First start: Actually, Manningham makes a spin move on a slant route to avoid a tackle and gains a lot of yards. Kaep threw a slant route and did not throw anyone open.
Crabtree touchdown: Congrats, this is one of the times he makes it past his first read.

Patriots: Kaep always looks at one spot on the field during his dropback and then goes to first read. At MOST, second read. Congrats MAYBE another where he makes it past his first read.
Touchdown to Crabtree: He was the FIRST read and he was open. Whooptie doo.
Other touchdown to Crabtree: Really? Crabtree was open before Kaep threw the ball and then Crabtree spun out of a tackle. Crab was the first read. Adjusting the play at the line of
scrimmage? No. He let Crabtree know he was going to him...maybe. Once again...FIRST READ.

Arizona: Touchdown to Crabtree: Crabtree was open by 7 yards BEFORE Kaep STEPPED UP in the pocket with minimal rush and was FIRST READ. Not impressed.
Second touchdown to Crabtree: Peterson was in good position? WTF were you watching? Peterson was beat by at least four yards BEFORE Kaep threw to his FIRST READ Crabtree.

First Playoff game: Congrats to the broken play big gain by Gore. Another of the FEW where Kaep makes it past his first read, albeit on a broken play.
Touchdown to Crab: Kaep stares Crabtree down and makes a throw where Crabtree has inside position. Still not impressed.
Big gain to VD: Kaep looks at one spot on the field during dropback then goes to where he knows he is throwing the ball all along. Good pass but not past first read. He knew
where he was going all along.
Delaney Walker catch: Threw him open? NOT... Kaep threw the ball AFTER he was WIDE OPEN and actually throws the ball BEHIND Delaney taking away extra yardage.
How you can see that as "throwing him open" is silly.

NFC Championship game: Throws Vernon open? I don't think so. He guns the ball into his first read. Luckily for Kaep that the Falcon defensive backs aren't very good.
The "nice touch passes to Vernon" are both WIDE OPEN passes on first reads.
Throws open Delaney Walker? I know you have absolutely NO understanding of what "throwing open" means. Delaney is WIDE OPEN before Kaep throws the ball.
"2nd option Davis"? Kaep looked at one player and one player only and that player was Davis. Davis was also open BEFORE Kaep threw the ball.
Nice throw by Kaep to his first and only read. A good DB would have broken that up. Not many QBs "would" make that pass, it was risky.

Superbowl: "Touch pass to VD"... He was WIDE OPEN. ANY NFL QB could have made that throw. Once again, first read.
Double clutch pass to VD... Again, WIDE OPEN. Most QBs in the league make that throw. First read again.
TD to Crabtree. First read to a WIDE OPEN receiver. Crabtree makes a good play after the catch.
Moss was WIDE OPEN and it looks to me that Kaep never looked anywhere else.
In between "multiple" defenders? Crabtree had nobody within 5 yards between himself and Kaep. The coverage was behind him and tackled him immediately. Again, FIRST READ.

Like I said, Kaep RARELY makes it past his first read and QBs that do that don't usually make it in this league. I have watched EVERY snap that Kaep has taken in the NFL and I am impressed with his arm, but I am very unimpressed with his progressions and decision making. I think he will struggle this year without his only good WR.
 

loafoftatupu

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I personally think Papaki is a great QB. Yeah, he does throw at his first read a lot, but it seems to work for the guy. The only Niner game I didn't see Papaki play in was the first Rams game.

It just seems to me that the guy doesn't spend a lot of time making decisions, that he has made it quickly and either uses it or just takes off. In any case, he seemed to make it work.

I spend some time making fun of Papaki and well, the Niners in general, but I think the guy is miles better than Alex Smith and that the Niners are every bit as good as the Hawks are as a team.

The downside I personally see is that Papaki kind of took the Niners away from their identity. They got away from their bread and butter because Harbafreak was trying to turn them into the Montana Niners, rather than the team that won 13 games in 2011.

Alex Smith was the master of the 12 play, 56 yard drive that turned into a FG. It wore teams down, kept the defense on the sidelines and scoring low. The switch to Papaki created a bunch of short drives, some 3 and outs and put the defense in a much tougher role. This is part of the reason the Niner defense started showing holes and gave up both passing and running yards.

The cost was absorbed because the Niner offense could score quickly and it carried them to the Super Bowl, but it also allowed for more turnovers to happen at bad times and made it tough on a defense that didn't rotate players much.

I think Papaki will probably improve his one look habit, but I just feel that it worked for him and Crabtree especially.

Oh yeah, that guy is out for the season isn't he?
 

NinerLifer

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Who cares really?

Kaepernick is a superior type of athlete (freakish really), and wins games. What else matters?
 

JSeahawks

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Kaepernick is a good, exciting QB. If he were a Seahawk we'd be giving him the same love and respect we give Wilson.
 

Scottemojo

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I have watched every snap he took about 10 times. He is a very capable QB who will tear up most teams. He has flaws. Who doesn't?
 

kearly

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Kaepernick is, IMO, the most physically talented QB in the NFL. Griffin/Vick are the only QBs are who are faster but neither of them are as strong nor as big/durable. He also has at least arguably the most zip on his passes of any NFL QB.

Right now, that's enough to dominate. As defenses adjust, it may not be. Seattle hasn't had too much trouble from Kaepernick, mostly because their defense is designed to counter QBs just like him. Right now the entire league is trying to copy Seattle. If enough teams successfully emulate our defense, Kaepernick will be in for a challenge.

That said, who says that Kaepernick can't grow? He's not a dummy, and he's not lazy. If he can learn to progress through reads and be more of a pure passer, he could be among the elite QBs of the league and end up in Canton.

I've always liked Kaepernick, even if he is a bit different and flawed. I can't remember a draft pick that was more of a dagger to the gut than when SF traded up for Kaepernick in 2011.
 

heyu123

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loafoftatupu":3pg2s2z8 said:
Alex Smith was the master of the 12 play, 56 yard drive that turned into a FG. It wore teams down, kept the defense on the sidelines and scoring low. The switch to Papaki created a bunch of short drives, some 3 and outs and put the defense in a much tougher role. This is part of the reason the Niner defense started showing holes and gave up both passing and running yards.

The cost was absorbed because the Niner offense could score quickly and it carried them to the Super Bowl, but it also allowed for more turnovers to happen at bad times and made it tough on a defense that didn't rotate players much.

Since when is scoring touchdowns quickly not preferable to long field goal drives?
 

chris98251

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I think we have at least two QB's in the West that will be talked about for a long time, Kaep may have flaws but I bet a off season they get worked on and somewhat corrected, just as Wilson said he has to learn more and make improvements, funny Bradford who was going to be the marquee QB of the division a few years ago has now become an after thought when people talk about the NFC West QB situations as far as playoffs and contenders.
 

NinerLifer

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chris98251":3bsrfstv said:
I think we have at least two QB's in the West that will be talked about for a long time, Kaep may have flaws but I bet a off season they get worked on and somewhat corrected, just as Wilson said he has to learn more and make improvements, funny Bradford who was going to be the marquee QB of the division a few years ago has now become an after thought when people talk about the NFC West QB situations as far as playoffs and contenders.

It's how Bradford turned out after his first season why I have a hard time making any guarantees about either of our young QB's after only their first season, 10 games in Kaeps situation.
 

RolandDeschain

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I'm kind of surprised no one has actually tried to click the links in this thread, yet. They are all broken, the forum is truncating them prematurely. You're going to have to manually enter them in the [ url = Actual URL]Text you want to show as the link[ / url ] format with no spaces.
 

Marvin49

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loafoftatupu":102gr75b said:
I personally think Papaki is a great QB. Yeah, he does throw at his first read a lot, but it seems to work for the guy. The only Niner game I didn't see Papaki play in was the first Rams game.

It just seems to me that the guy doesn't spend a lot of time making decisions, that he has made it quickly and either uses it or just takes off. In any case, he seemed to make it work.

I spend some time making fun of Papaki and well, the Niners in general, but I think the guy is miles better than Alex Smith and that the Niners are every bit as good as the Hawks are as a team.

The downside I personally see is that Papaki kind of took the Niners away from their identity. They got away from their bread and butter because Harbafreak was trying to turn them into the Montana Niners, rather than the team that won 13 games in 2011.

Alex Smith was the master of the 12 play, 56 yard drive that turned into a FG. It wore teams down, kept the defense on the sidelines and scoring low. The switch to Papaki created a bunch of short drives, some 3 and outs and put the defense in a much tougher role. This is part of the reason the Niner defense started showing holes and gave up both passing and running yards.

The cost was absorbed because the Niner offense could score quickly and it carried them to the Super Bowl, but it also allowed for more turnovers to happen at bad times and made it tough on a defense that didn't rotate players much.

I think Papaki will probably improve his one look habit, but I just feel that it worked for him and Crabtree especially.

Oh yeah, that guy is out for the season isn't he?

Glad to see some rare support for Kaep from a Seattle fan.

Its true that Kaep often throws to his first read...but that is VERY often because his first read is OPEN. Why move on to the second read if the first one is there?

Kaep is not a finished product. He came into the league exteremely raw and he's just getting better and better with every start. He has some young Qb clock management issues (especially in THIS offense that does so much pre-snap movement) and he is still learning to work through the progressions. He has shown the ability to do so.

People who are calling for him to fall flat are just suffering from wishful thinking.
 

Marvin49

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kearly":31uh49np said:
Kaepernick is, IMO, the most physically talented QB in the NFL. Griffin/Vick are the only QBs are who are faster but neither of them are as strong nor as big/durable. He also has at least arguably the most zip on his passes of any NFL QB.

Right now, that's enough to dominate. As defenses adjust, it may not be. Seattle hasn't had too much trouble from Kaepernick, mostly because their defense is designed to counter QBs just like him. Right now the entire league is trying to copy Seattle. If enough teams successfully emulate our defense, Kaepernick will be in for a challenge.

That said, who says that Kaepernick can't grow? He's not a dummy, and he's not lazy. If he can learn to progress through reads and be more of a pure passer, he could be among the elite QBs of the league and end up in Canton.

I've always liked Kaepernick, even if he is a bit different and flawed. I can't remember a draft pick that was more of a dagger to the gut than when SF traded up for Kaepernick in 2011.

Wow...even more positive Kaep talk from Seattle fans. :) I feel like I'm in the Twilight Zone. ;-)

Pretty much agree with everything you said. He came into the League RAW as all hell. He still has alot to learn and more importantly, he KNOWS he still has alot to learn. He is succeeding on scary athletic talent. Its not just taking about the running either. Its not just the arm strength. At least once or twice a game he throws a pass that just makes my jaw drop. The first one I saw him make was actually very early in the season when he spelled Alex for a play. It was a flea flicker to Moss that Moss flat dropped in the endzone. PERFECT pass. When he started his first game, he had another one to Kyle Wilson for a big game...right over the shoulder in perfect stride. One to Vernon in the GB game. Another to Crab in the SB that Crab couldn't hold onto. I could go on and on. He just makes these insane throws that tell you once he figures it all out.....LOOK. OUT.
 

pehawk

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This is great. We haven't had a Kaep thread in awhile.
 

pehawk

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Marvin49":2h447mtl said:
pehawk":2h447mtl said:
This is great. We haven't had a Kaep thread in awhile.

Hey man...I don't start em'. ;-)

Oh, I know sweetie.

For whatever reason there's ALOT of Seahawks fans obsessed with convincing themselves and others Wilson's better than Kaep. I dont understand it, really. For the 1st time ever in OUR franchise's history, we have an elite, top 5, inevitable champion, type QB. Personally, that evokes an opposite response in me, I'm very quiet. I have zero need to convince anyone or myself how great Wilson is. I no longer fret over other teams FA pickups or transactions, because, well, we have Wilson.

Before Wilson, I could spin logical yarns ending with the Seahawks holding a Lombardi. Any year, any QB, any coach, I've done it my entire life. I just dont need to do that anymore...it's very odd and refreshing.
 

RolandDeschain

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Pe, if I had to guess, I think all the talk of Kaepernick's "tools" is largely what spawns some of the ire people feel in defending Wilson over Kaepernick.

Someone could donate a $500,000 auto garage to me and I'd have all the tools to open my own Firestone, but that doesn't mean I know what to do with them. Wilson seems ahead of Kaepernick mentally by a considerable margin, to me, so it's annoying to hear about all these fabulous pretty "tools" Kaepernick has in practically every article that mentions him.

QB is like 80% between the ears. Physical tools don't carry a QB, unless that QB is playing against Dom Capers and his Green Bay defense.

I can't speak for everyone, obviously, but all these friggin' articles talking about Kaep's "tools" have gotten annoying. It's starting to sound like a cop-out, like "We can't talk about his head for the game, so we'll talk about his physical tools, instead." Who cares if someone can throw the ball 80 yards in the air? The number of times a QB will likely be asked to do that in an entire NFL career: 0. Even if it's once or twice, congrats, one or two games out of a couple hundred. Totally important. :roll:
 

pehawk

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Some of it is us fans having a QB like Wilson for the first time ever. We dont know how to react.

At least, thats a IMO.
 

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