Hawks have all the stat masters scratching their heads

tom sawyer

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LOL

I love it. We win in spite of stats, we are rewriting the whole dynamics of football stats.

:th2thumbs:
 

rideaducati

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This team reminds me of the stealer teams of the past decade. They get outplayed all game long, but with their defense keeping them in games, they find ways to win anyway.
 

Polaris

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tom sawyer":1jdysg4a said:
LOL

I love it. We win in spite of stats, we are rewriting the whole dynamics of football stats.

:th2thumbs:

Actually (and this is even more amazing), other than the turnovers and Time of Possession, Seattle clearly won the stats battle as well when the game was over.

Given that statistically (as well as by the score) Seattle was being beaten like a rented mule at half-time, that shows you just how dominant Seattle was starting in the second half. When I was watching the game, I started sensing this (really started sensing it very late in the first half actually), but it didn't really show up until the fourth quarter.
 
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tom sawyer

tom sawyer

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The Hawks really never showed any signs of "break", bent all over the place, but they just kept playing and ignored the scoreboard. This is what makes them great! And subsequently 8-1!!
 

MidwestHawker

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Meh. We were still #2 in the league in DVOA after the St. Louis game (behind Denver), and I doubt this game drops us too much. We might be a win above pythag at this point, but we're not "redefining stats" at this point by any means.
 

Mtjhoyas

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Fantasy sports and advanced metrics (disguised as objective) have really ruined the concept of Ws and Ls, as the most important stat and have hugely undermined the importance of the "team."

Now, every win or loss is caveated with "yea, but he threw for 400 yards or didn't throw for many yards." Remember when you were happy that your team won and pissed when they lost? I swear I have friends that will not root for the Seahawks because nobody outside of Marshawn Lynch is "good in fantasy."

Furthermore, do any of us need PFF to tell us that Sweazy scored a -5.3? Or do your eyes tell you, "Sweazy has struggled with pass pro but has some very good run blocking skills"? Is RW really having a sophomore slump? Or do your eyes tell you he is overcoming a lot of poor protection and that we probably don't have even close to 8 wins without him?

Stats are fun, but they are not gospel, especially in a team sport in which:

a) 11 guys need to function as a unit to succeed
b) 11 guys have specific assignments (do you know exactly what the coaches asked them to do?)
c) Perhaps the philosophy (publicly), doesn't jive with the new age stat people (run/defense first).

Do we need to play better? Of course we do. But let's recognize that we have 3 integral pieces on offense do back soon that should drastically change how we function on that side of the ball. We know the defense will adjust to the recent run game snafus.
 

MidwestHawker

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Advanced metrics don't belong anywhere near fantasy sports in categories that skew how sports are viewed. Fantasy sports are completely irrelevant. Advanced metrics have significant predictive value and assessment value. Agree that none of them are gospel because all of them have their individual flaws, but they shouldn't simply be hand-waved away by any stretch of the imagination.
 

PlinytheCenter

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Down 21 - 0 and lost the turnover battle. You don't see too many victories resulting from those stats. We have the talent, it's just it getting all together at the same time. At this point I'm happy with the wins no matter how they come, but I believe we have the most complete team in the league so it is a bit frustrating to watch. Not to mention bad for your heart.
 

Popeyejones

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tom sawyer":3kuj8h8d said:
LOL

I love it. We win in spite of stats, we are rewriting the whole dynamics of football stats.

:th2thumbs:


Not really. Stuff like this happens all the time. In fact, it's expected to happen. Statistically-minded folks see stuff like this and don't even blink, they just expect regression to the mean (e.g. if you keep getting outplayed over time you will lose more than you win; over time if you keep being in close games you'll end up losing as many as you'll win). It's a funny thing in that in the standings all wins and losses are created equal, although in terms of predicting future performance W/L is pretty noisy. The NFL plays such a short season that a couple of these random coin flips can end up REALLY mattering much more so than in other professional team sports.
 

Weadoption

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Put another way, you could quite easily be 5-4.
 

Popeyejones

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Weadoption":f65xh6hb said:
Put another way, you could quite easily be 5-4.

Yeah. But to TBF, the other implication is that put another way, the Hawks could have quite easily won the division and gone to the Super Bowl last year, which is why 90% of the bragging and magical thinking that goes on among either fanbase is pretty silly.
 

RolandDeschain

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Popeyejones":d4hckz8d said:
Weadoption":d4hckz8d said:
Put another way, you could quite easily be 5-4.

Yeah. But to TBF, the other implication is that put another way, the Hawks could have quite easily won the division and gone to the Super Bowl last year, which is why 90% of the bragging and magical thinking that goes on among either fanbase is pretty silly.
Popeye, thank you for being level-headed and clowning your homer 49ers brethren.

Most 49ers fans think we're incredibly lucky to have more than 4-5 wins. Well, without some weird habit this season of making major critical mistakes every freaking game, most of our opponents are lucky we didn't win by 3+ scores. Look at it however you want.
 

plyka

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Mtjhoyas":6y8ec5wh said:
Fantasy sports and advanced metrics (disguised as objective) have really ruined the concept of Ws and Ls, as the most important stat and have hugely undermined the importance of the "team."

Now, every win or loss is caveated with "yea, but he threw for 400 yards or didn't throw for many yards." Remember when you were happy that your team won and pissed when they lost? I swear I have friends that will not root for the Seahawks because nobody outside of Marshawn Lynch is "good in fantasy."

Furthermore, do any of us need PFF to tell us that Sweazy scored a -5.3? Or do your eyes tell you, "Sweazy has struggled with pass pro but has some very good run blocking skills"? Is RW really having a sophomore slump? Or do your eyes tell you he is overcoming a lot of poor protection and that we probably don't have even close to 8 wins without him?

Stats are fun, but they are not gospel, especially in a team sport in which:

a) 11 guys need to function as a unit to succeed
b) 11 guys have specific assignments (do you know exactly what the coaches asked them to do?)
c) Perhaps the philosophy (publicly), doesn't jive with the new age stat people (run/defense first).

Do we need to play better? Of course we do. But let's recognize that we have 3 integral pieces on offense do back soon that should drastically change how we function on that side of the ball. We know the defense will adjust to the recent run game snafus.

This post just has the feel of fake outrage at a non-existent problem, or perhaps an old man's rant --i use to walk uphill both ways to school in the snow, barefeet, through glass, when i was a kid.
 

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