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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 3:31 pm 
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bellingerga wrote:
I don't get why people are so pissed at Breno. As far as I remember, he got beat... once, maybe twice but I only remember once. I don't even remember hearing about him the entire rest of the game except when dude got frustrated and punched him in the face......

I will rewatch the game on NFL Game Rewind, but this sounds to be like the haters are just looking for a reason to dislike Breno.

Dude going off on him is a victory for Breno--getting into a mofo's head out there, pushing him around.

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 3:41 pm 
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Cartire wrote:
Jville wrote:
CALIHAWK1 wrote:
How do they come up with these ridiculous numbers?


Nobody outside of PFF knows the answer.

The Pro Football Focus rating system is built on subjective judgments. Suggestions that it rubs up against science or math are designed to facilitate subscription sells and build site traffic. PFF has, to my knowledge, never completed a meaningful public disclosure of methods or algorithms.



IF you read it, its a play by play analysis. And its actually pretty smart and simple. You get a + point for doing something amazing. You get a zero grade for doing your job normally, and you get a - point for missing your assignment. Pretty simple and smart if you ask me. then they just take your number of plays and divide for the average. There is a small amount of subjectiveness, but as its been stated, if the evaluator cant tell if you played your assignment correctly, then you just get a 0 (which does nothing to effect your grade). AND lets say your lynch, and you get stuffed behind the line, but it was obvious that its because a lineman missed his block and a defender crashed down on you, you will just get a 0 and not a - point because it wasnt your fault.

I actually like it very much, because its quite simple but accurate in measuring your average play throughout the game.


Good post. The only thing I question is if their grades are based on the All-22 tape or the TV feed. I always assumed it was from the All-22 tape, but these grades seemed to come out before that was made available to the media (or do they have super early access?).


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:14 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:

Good post. The only thing I question is if their grades are based on the All-22 tape or the TV feed. I always assumed it was from the All-22 tape, but these grades seemed to come out before that was made available to the media (or do they have super early access?).


Its suppose to be the All-22 because they grade every player, every play. Which would be impossible without All-22. I'm not sure if/how they get it early.

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:41 pm 
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Earl got a negative score? Didn't he force the fumble? Or did they credit Sherman?

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:42 pm 
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Cartire wrote:
Jville wrote:
CALIHAWK1 wrote:
How do they come up with these ridiculous numbers?


Nobody outside of PFF knows the answer.

The Pro Football Focus rating system is built on subjective judgments. Suggestions that it rubs up against science or math are designed to facilitate subscription sells and build site traffic. PFF has, to my knowledge, never completed a meaningful public disclosure of methods or algorithms.



IF you read it, its a play by play analysis. And its actually pretty smart and simple. You get a + point for doing something amazing. You get a zero grade for doing your job normally, and you get a - point for missing your assignment. Pretty simple and smart if you ask me. then they just take your number of plays and divide for the average. There is a small amount of subjectiveness, but as its been stated, if the evaluator cant tell if you played your assignment correctly, then you just get a 0 (which does nothing to effect your grade). AND lets say your lynch, and you get stuffed behind the line, but it was obvious that its because a lineman missed his block and a defender crashed down on you, you will just get a 0 and not a - point because it wasnt your fault.

I actually like it very much, because its quite simple but accurate in measuring your average play throughout the game.


I've read it. They have a simple point assignment convention used in conjuction with a limited collection of subjective judgements. It certainly doesn't exhaust all grading considerations or weights or styles of play. Its attraction is its simplicity.

They also glance over other considerations ... to avoid confusion and keep their presentation simple.

What I am attempting to convey is that PFF is not the definitive authority.


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:49 pm 
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Jville wrote:

I've read it. They have a simple point assignment convention used in conjuction with a limited collection of subjective judgements. It certainly doesn't exhaust all grading considerations or weights or styles of play. Its attraction is its simplicity.



We get, yada yada. It is simple, but a valid grading system to judge how a player played in a particular game. Not necessarily his skill compared to the rest. And honestly, its fine. Because guess what, the top dogs try and make their own rating systems that factor every aspect of everything, and it still gets scrutinized and ridiculed. And why? Because Football is very hard to quantify with Sabermetrics. The variables are so vast, and the amount of data available for each conceivable situation is so small, that it just cant be perfect. QBR and DVOA I think have great return for their numbers. Yet they are scrutinized constantly.

So lets get off the high-and-mighty horse and appreciate someone even taking the time to systematically record every down, for every player, in a timely manner and assign a grade. I watch the All-22, and rewatch games like a champ. Ive seen sundays game 4 times now, and have watched 5 others games as well. And I can tell you that I have not studied every single player on every single play. So I appreciate when someone takes the time too.

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 4:59 pm 
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I think many place far too much weight on PFF numbers as a starting point for inferences.

However, PFF and this site exist for entertainment purposes only.

From time to time we all lose track of that fact. LOL


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 6:10 pm 
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minormillikin wrote:
Earl got a negative score? Didn't he force the fumble? Or did they credit Sherman?


The Seahawks credited Earl Thomas with the forced fumble. He also lead both teams in tackles during the Carolina game. NFL.com numbers: 8 tackles, 2 assists, 1 force fumble.

Don't know about how PFF arrived at that negative number for Earl. :229031_shrug: Since it comes from an entertainment site, it just might be a tiny bit suspect. LOL


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:08 pm 
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Jville wrote:
minormillikin wrote:
Earl got a negative score? Didn't he force the fumble? Or did they credit Sherman?


The Seahawks credited Earl Thomas with the forced fumble. He also lead both teams in tackles during the Carolina game. NFL.com numbers: 8 tackles, 2 assists, 1 force fumble.

Don't know about how PFF arrived at that negative number for Earl. :229031_shrug: Since it comes from an entertainment site, it just might be a tiny bit suspect. LOL


Chances are, on all those plays, he got high marks. But remember, ET plays every down, so its very reasonable to believe that he may have screwed up on plays where it didnt matter.

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 1:51 pm 
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Cartire wrote:
Jville wrote:
minormillikin wrote:
Earl got a negative score? Didn't he force the fumble? Or did they credit Sherman?


The Seahawks credited Earl Thomas with the forced fumble. He also lead both teams in tackles during the Carolina game. NFL.com numbers: 8 tackles, 2 assists, 1 force fumble.

Don't know about how PFF arrived at that negative number for Earl. :229031_shrug: Since it comes from an entertainment site, it just might be a tiny bit suspect. LOL


Chances are, on all those plays, he got high marks. But remember, ET plays every down, so its very reasonable to believe that he may have screwed up on plays where it didnt matter.

I can understand how PFF loyalists and subscribers might cling to such a notion.
After all, it was on the internet. And anything on the internet must be true. LOL


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:13 pm 
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Jville wrote:
Cartire wrote:
Chances are, on all those plays, he got high marks. But remember, ET plays every down, so its very reasonable to believe that he may have screwed up on plays where it didnt matter.

I can understand how PFF loyalists and subscribers might cling to such a notion.
After all, it was on the internet. And anything on the internet must be true. LOL


Im neither a loyalist or a subscriber. But Im also a realist. And so far, your only argument is to make fun of it. Sound rebuttal there. You have given no facts, data, or even your own analysis, but you sure seem determined to devalue something because you dont like its outcomes.

You are just like a lot of people though. You make up your own analysis over your own assumptions, and then ridicule anything that disagrees with that. You should take the time yourself and show us your grades. I would love the chance to pick apart everything you have said and laugh at you, cause you know, its on the internet.

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:24 pm 
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Cartire wrote:
Jville wrote:
Cartire wrote:
Chances are, on all those plays, he got high marks. But remember, ET plays every down, so its very reasonable to believe that he may have screwed up on plays where it didnt matter.

I can understand how PFF loyalists and subscribers might cling to such a notion.
After all, it was on the internet. And anything on the internet must be true. LOL


Im neither a loyalist or a subscriber. But Im also a realist. And so far, your only argument is to make fun of it. Sound rebuttal there. You have given no facts, data, or even your own analysis, but you sure seem determined to devalue something because you dont like its outcomes.

You are just like a lot of people though. You make up your own analysis over your own assumptions, and then ridicule anything that disagrees with that. You should take the time yourself and show us your grades. I would love the chance to pick apart everything you have said and laugh at you, cause you know, its on the internet.

The subject wasn't about you or me.


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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:34 pm 
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minormillikin wrote:
Earl got a negative score? Didn't he force the fumble? Or did they credit Sherman?


Didn't Earl miss the tackle at first but caught up to Williams and stripped it but only after Sherman had already hit Williams?..

I've seen them on twitter when discussing Earl, they don't rate him as high because of his bad tackling. They had him ranked 39th out of all safeties, which is why I don't take they're grading seriously..
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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:08 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:
OFF:

Coleman 2.4
Russell Wilson 2.2
Baldwin 2.0
Giacomini 1.8

Tate 0.8
Rice 0.7
Kearse 0.0
Ware 0.0
Turbin -0.2
Person -0.9
Okung -1.2
Unger -1.3
Miller -1.4
Stephen Williams -1.6
Sweezy -2.0
Luke Willson -2.0
McQuistan -2.2
Carpenter -2.3
Lynch -3.1


So yeah, Carp didn't play too well. McQ, however, was basically just as bad. Rough day for the O-line overall (except Breno).

DEF:

Bryant 2.0
Maxwell 1.9
Sherman 1.8

D'Anthony Smith 0.7
Chancellor 0.6
Malcom Smith 0.5
Maragos 0.0
Mayowa 0.0
McDaniel 0.0
Mebane -0.1
Thomas -0.3
Schofield -0.5
Bennett -0.6
Morgan -1.0
Wagner -1.6
Thurmond -2.0
Wright -2.9


Link?

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 Post subject: Re: PFF Week 1 Seahawks Grades
 Post Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 4:15 pm 
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Sturm wrote:
Link?


Someone posted the bare numbers on Twitter. You need a subscription with ProFootballFocus to get their full analysis of the game. Here's their more general recap of the game if you're interested.


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