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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 5:39 pm 
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I'm happy about this. TJ can go .500 with this team easily if called on, if Pete/JS think Quinn can do better, then Quinn will be the guy instead. Nothing but upside here.


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 10:36 pm 
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There really seems to be two points in this argument:

Group A thinks Tarvaris Jackson is the perfect BACK UP QB, despite his pedestrian stats he has familiarity within Bevell's system (he has been in Bevell's system in all but 1 season), T-Jack garnered mad respect of his Seahawks teammates during his 2011 season as the Seahawks starting QB , so much so, that the Seahawks had to trade him in order to move the chain of command to either Wilson or Flynn. While Jackson has pedestrian stats, he is still better than Quinn.

Group C thinks Tarvaris Jackson isn't the answer and never will be. They have argued points against him as if he will become the starting QB. Stating that he has slow drop back and an even slower read. Argued against Quinn is that Quinn has never been on good teams and still has a considerable amount of upside. (Which is almost fruitless because T-Jack was drafted in 2006, Quinn in 2007). T Jack couldn’t also survive the Buffalo Bills. So he’s worthless. Except for the facts that T-Jackson had to endure 3 changes of scenery in 3 years, 1) Vikings to the Seahawks in a lock-out shortened year 2) Seahawks to Bills in a trade in which he had to learn a new system for the first time in his career 3) Coaching change, FO change, meant another new system on the only team that spent a 1st round pick on a QB.

Simply to say Jackson isn’t worthwhile or worthless because he didn’t do jack squat with the Bills is a very cheap and ill formed statement.

However, the camp in Group A and the camp in Group C need to conform to the logical reason to those of Group B:

1) Tarvaris Jackson, although signed, isn’t going to be handed the back-up job, he’s going to have to compete for it with Quinn and Johnson

2) That fans can think and say whatever they want, but it’s the Seahawks that have the final decision as to who will make this team, they’ll pick the best guy they feel is best fit to backup Russell Wilson.

3) Whether that guy is Jackson, Quinn, or even Johnson… the best way to find out who will be that guy behind Wilson is competition…give the QB who probably thinks he’s in comfortable space a reason to watch his back, make the QB who is fighting for a chance feel like he has an even slimmer chance, and give another opportunity to a QB that deserves another opportunity to be part of this team but guarantee him nothing…. One of these guys will come out on top and likely better than they were going in.

It is not about “Who your favorite?” or “Who deserves it?” or “Who has the most upside?”… It’s about constructing the best 53 players out of 90 or so players and winning some damn football games to hoist a Lombardi.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 11:03 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:09 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:15 am 
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So how much are they paying for TJak?

It is Quinn money it is a fantastic deal. If they are paying him double that I am not going to be so upbeat.


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:23 am 
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Why does it matter how much he's making?

Now people wanna count the mans money, some of you are pathetic.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:32 am 
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T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:35 am 
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Cartire wrote:
T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.


Welcome to .Net where we can make a big deal out of anything.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:35 am 
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Cartire wrote:
T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.

Interesting, I don't believe anyone's brought that up yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:37 am 
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ClumsyLurk wrote:
Cartire wrote:
T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.

Interesting, I don't believe anyone's brought that up yet.

As a poster, I think you have no upside.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:38 am 
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Scottemojo wrote:
ClumsyLurk wrote:
Cartire wrote:
T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.

Interesting, I don't believe anyone's brought that up yet.

As a poster, I think you have no upside.

The feels

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:39 am 
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Scottemojo wrote:
ClumsyLurk wrote:
Cartire wrote:
T-Jack is back, its a fact.

Oh btw, this is for the backup spot. I dont remember so much controversy over a backup position.

Interesting, I don't believe anyone's brought that up yet.

As a poster, I think you have no upside.


Yes but his floor is really low.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:09 am 
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It's' not counting his money. If he is getting paid twice what Quinn is it could be a factor in whether he stays or not. Our cap is real important coming into the near future.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:39 am 
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Wow, 16 pages over the return of a potential backup QB.

All I'll say is what I told Leif the other day. It feels good, for a change, to be able to discuss the merits of multiple tragically flawed quarterbacks as the Seahawks BACKUP QB. I'm so used to these discussions about a QB's limitations, flaws, etc. being about the Seahawks starting QB. It's nice to finally have that Franchise guy leading the way, one who the rest of the league will envy at season's end if they don't already.

That's what I'm taking away from these 16 pages of gloriousness. Where the names Tarvaris Jackson, Brady Quinn, and Jerrod Johnson have been dropped more than their families would probably even care to admit.

Oh, and who else is hyped for TJack on the Real Rob Report?! I know I am!

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 7:46 am 
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RichNhansom wrote:
It's' not counting his money. If he is getting paid twice what Quinn is it could be a factor in whether he stays or not. Our cap is real important coming into the near future.


The only way getting paid double Quinn would affect his staying or not would be the possibility of him going. We know we have our starter, so they aren't going to go out and overpay the backup. Quinn is scheduled to make $715,000 this year, I'd expect Jackson's salary to be perhaps slightly more, but in a similar ball park.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:50 am 
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he's back

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:53 am 
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Does anyone know what Jackson resigned for in Buffalo before he was released?

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:07 am 
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RichNhansom wrote:
Does anyone know what Jackson resigned for in Buffalo before he was released?


He was still on the contract that he signed with Seattle during his time with the Bills. He signed a two year, 8 million dollar deal with the Hawks in 2011, with him earning 2 mil in 2011 and 4 mil in 2012 (with Buffalo. Great move looking back on it when you consider cost/production/draft pick that turned into Harvin). If you're wondering, the additional two million were individual/team performance incentives available.

http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/08/26/mcintyre-a-closer-look-at-hawks-contracts-2/

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The first unrestricted free agent the Seahawks added was quarterback Tarvaris Jackson, who agreed to a two-year, $8 million contract that immediately drew comparisons to Charlie Whitehurst’s deal from last March. While Whitehurst’s contract was technically a one-year, $6.8 million extension – Whitehurst had signed a one-year restricted free agent tender worth $1.176 million before the trade – the structures of the deals for the two quarterbacks are nearly identical.


Whitehurst received a $2 million roster bonus and $2 million base salary in 2010, with a $4 million base salary in 2011 and $1 million in incentives in each year of the contract. Jackson received a $1.5 million signing bonus and will receive a $500,000 roster bonus if he’s on the 53-man roster for Week One. Jackson has base salaries of $2 million in 2011 and $4 million in 2012, with $2.05 million in individual and team performance incentives available between the two years ($1 million in 2011, $1.05 million in 2012).

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:12 am 
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He was scheduled to make a $1.25m base salary from Buffalo. They also paid him a $500,000 signing/workout bonus, which he has already pocketed.


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:13 am 
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NYCoug wrote:
RichNhansom wrote:
Does anyone know what Jackson resigned for in Buffalo before he was released?


He was still on the contract that he signed with Seattle during his time with the Bills. He signed a two year, 8 million dollar deal with the Hawks in 2011, with him earning 2 mil in 2011 and 4 mil in 2012 (with Buffalo. Great move looking back on it when you consider cost/production/draft pick that turned into Harvin). If you're wondering, the additional two million were individual/team performance incentives available.

http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2011/08/26/mcintyre-a-closer-look-at-hawks-contracts-2/

Hold on to your clipboards! Charlie Whitehurst sighting coming up! Kudos to our boy Brian McIntyre for the info!

Quote:
The first unrestricted free agent the Seahawks added was quarterback Tarvaris Jackson, who agreed to a two-year, $8 million contract that immediately drew comparisons to Charlie Whitehurst’s deal from last March. While Whitehurst’s contract was technically a one-year, $6.8 million extension – Whitehurst had signed a one-year restricted free agent tender worth $1.176 million before the trade – the structures of the deals for the two quarterbacks are nearly identical.


Whitehurst received a $2 million roster bonus and $2 million base salary in 2010, with a $4 million base salary in 2011 and $1 million in incentives in each year of the contract. Jackson received a $1.5 million signing bonus and will receive a $500,000 roster bonus if he’s on the 53-man roster for Week One. Jackson has base salaries of $2 million in 2011 and $4 million in 2012, with $2.05 million in individual and team performance incentives available between the two years ($1 million in 2011, $1.05 million in 2012).



Actually we traded Jackson in his last year of his contract. This is true, but the Bills re-signed him to a new contract for the 2013 season, then they had the regime change and the draft and free agency and went in another direction.

Jackson has $550,000 from the bills for his trouble. That is the dead money attributed to cutting him. Likely that was a signing bonus, although it could have been guaranteed money. Basically he was paid half a million to miss out on a few months of free agency

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:21 am 
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I just got owned hard!

Well done David and kidhawk :bow:

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:22 am 
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TJack got caked up and now he's gonna get a ring? Who the hell has it better than him?

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:34 am 
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RichNhansom wrote:
It's' not counting his money. If he is getting paid twice what Quinn is it could be a factor in whether he stays or not. Our cap is real important coming into the near future.


Why would Jackson's salary play into it at all? I highly doubt he signed for all that much more than Quinn. And even if he did, so what? He signed a one year deal. The Hawks wouldn't have signed him to a contract that screws up their salary cap this year. That makes no sense at all. Going into it, they had something like $4 mil in cap space. Even if TJack made over a mil, they'd be fine. This isn't like Matt Flynn making starter money and impacting your ability to re-sign Chancellor or make other moves. The roster is basically set. They aren't adding $4 mil more salary between now and week one.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 10:23 am 
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Throwdown wrote:
TJack got caked up and now he's gonna get a ring? Who the hell has it better than him?


That's the spirit!

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:35 am 
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It's just a question Sea town relax. The point was of he signed for let's say 1.5 and Quinn is at .75 then it could play into decision making. That would actually support the supporters because the FO onviously UST think higher of him and if it didn't work out it could partially be for financial reason.

As for the cap, every penny is going to be important soon and 3/4 of a mill could be rolled into next years cap.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:55 pm 
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According to the Seahawks twitter, Jerrod Johnson was cut for Jackson's spot.

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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:17 pm 
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Throwdown wrote:
According to the Seahawks twitter, Jerrod Johnson was cut for Jackson's spot.


Say it ain't so! Now we'll never win a Super Bowl!


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:32 pm 
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Throwdown wrote:
TJack got caked up and now he's gonna get a ring? Who the hell has it better than him?


Seriously, he's getting hooked up pretty good here. Nobody can say he got mistreated by Seattle, that's for sure. He got a full year to start, proved he was a tough career backup, got hit by the RW bullet train, shipped to Buffalo, paid half a mil, then back to Seattle for the ice. Hopefully that'll innoculate us against the whiners who used to talk about how bad the poor guy always had it.


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:55 pm 
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SeaTown81 wrote:
RichNhansom wrote:
It's' not counting his money. If he is getting paid twice what Quinn is it could be a factor in whether he stays or not. Our cap is real important coming into the near future.


Why would Jackson's salary play into it at all? I highly doubt he signed for all that much more than Quinn. And even if he did, so what? He signed a one year deal. The Hawks wouldn't have signed him to a contract that screws up their salary cap this year. That makes no sense at all. Going into it, they had something like $4 mil in cap space. Even if TJack made over a mil, they'd be fine. This isn't like Matt Flynn making starter money and impacting your ability to re-sign Chancellor or make other moves. The roster is basically set. They aren't adding $4 mil more salary between now and week one.


Cap rolls. $4million over this year is $4million you can spend next year. The money left under the cap now matters unlike before

Hey Sherman - do you want to make $1million less per year than you think you are worth because we signed TJack over Quinn

Just saying it matters. If you get your moneys worth then great if you are not then you don't spend it just because you are under the cap


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 Post subject: Re: Tjack or Quinn (Update: TJack flying in for visit)
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:33 pm 
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T-Jax is terrible. League average QB (at absolute BEST) for 3 quarters, and an absolute disaster in the 4th Quarter. He almost ruined my Christmas 2 years ago in that Xmas eve loss to the 9ers. That entire season I said we were a QB away from an instant 10 win team, and I'll be damned I was right. The least clutch Seahawks QB I've seen. To go from him to perhaps the most clutch Hawks QB in franchise history (time will tell but it looks bright for RW), I couldn't be more excited. The only problem is Brady Quinn might be just as terrible. I hated to get rid of Flynn as an insurance policiy, but seeing that money turned into some of the great signings they made makes me not as scared about that move. Everybody do a toast to Russell Wilson staying healthy this season and rendering this debate meaningless

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