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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:06 am 
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English, I don't know how you survive, considering how personally you seem to take hypocrisy. (Which is everywhere, all the time.) Don't get me wrong, I completely agree with your point, but I try not to let it get to me so much. Not good for the blood pressure. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:08 am 
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RolandDeschain wrote:
English, I don't know how you survive, considering how personally you seem to take hypocrisy. (Which is everywhere, all the time.) Don't get me wrong, I completely agree with your point, but I try not to let it get to me so much. Not good for the blood pressure. :)


Stiff upper lip.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:11 am 
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Sarlacc83 wrote:
Stiff upper lip.

And a slack jaw.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:17 am 
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Smelly McUgly wrote:
I think that players should be paid whatever the market is willing to give them with no restrictions.

That being said, however, if there was a guy that might get me to at least consider coming off that position, it would be Aaron Curry.

The problem was... it was a false market. It still is for that matter... but at least it's more in line than under the old CBA.

Applying the old CBA to myself... I'm a mechanical engineer with 32+ years experience in the aerospace industry.

I can't imagine a 22 y/o kid coming out of college with the same degree and his starting salary trumps mine by 10x.

That makes no sense whatsoever.

Back on topic... I'll predict that Curry won't make it past game 8 before getting cut, assuming that he even makes the Giants 53-man roster.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:27 am 
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I'm with the Glove.

You get drafted very high, then come into the NFL and hold out for even more money. Then they pay you 50 million dollars, which is more than most of the veterans on the team are already making.

So where is the hunger? Where is the motivation? I am a small business owner. It's a rare person that is fueled by a desire to be successful, for personal achievement, after you've already been given everything you need. We're talking Russell Wilson rare, and he's making peanuts compared to what Curry was handed. Seriously, how many of you would go to work if you won the lottery ? How many of you business owners out there would keep grinding away if you were already wealthy beyond your dreams, we're talking about enough money to set you and generations of your family up?

I'll say this: I would keep working, but I wouldn't be putting 80-90 hrs a week into this thing, and not see my kids, if I was already wealthy. And if fishing, or vacations or family activities came up, it would be super easy to bail on work, which would lead to the degredation of my business. I don't see athletes as a whole lot different. You work to hone your craft, and if you don't really need to, how hard exactly would you push ?


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 12:59 pm 
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I suspect that Aaron Curry's draft hype was most likely a media creation, much like Shariff Floyd this year. His tape was nowhere near top five pick quality, and the untapped potential argument always struck me as myth-making because there wasn't any evidence that made you think "oh, if he does this one thing better he'll take off." Nothing like that. He had a "missile" like quality against running backs that attacked laterally, and he had good "physical" talent (size, speed, etc), but otherwise he was ultra blase on tape. If you are going to pay a LB $60 million over 6 years you need to be sure he's Julian Peterson first, and on his college tape Curry looked much more like a Leroy Hill type.

Perhaps because of the cautionary tale that is Aaron Curry, it seems front offices have gotten better at figuring out which players are media creations and which aren't. Floyd looked like a lock for the top 3 based on draft hype but slid into the late 1st. Based on how I graded him, late 1st is what he deserved. Floyd has short arms and couldn't penetrate to save his life at Florida. He's good at everything else, he's not a bum, but as a pass rusher he's the opposite of great, and yet people in the media were saying he'd be a 10 sack a year 3-tech. Talk about clueless. People said the same thing about Curry, that he'd be a 10 sack a year player, and like Floyd, they predicted this despite strong evidence to the contrary. They pulled it straight out of their ass. Unfortunately for us, Tim Ruskell fell for it because he didn't know how to evaluate talent.

I felt the same way with Greg Oden. Every time I watched him at OSU he would get 10 points 10 rebounds playing full time. I understood the argument that you draft centers #1, but I never understood why it had to be Oden. He was a hype job gone out of control. I'm glad I'm not a Blazers fan. Watching my teams take mindless hype jobs like Oden and Curry within the span of a couple years would have been too much to take.


Last edited by kearly on Thu May 23, 2013 1:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:01 pm 
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RolandDeschain wrote:
English, I don't know how you survive


It must be something in the tea....


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:02 pm 
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Rob has to live with an edge. If he didn't, he'd slip into a coma covering soccer all the time.

That reminds me, I read today that the DC United MLS team just scored their first point in 65 days. I'm not joking.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:05 pm 
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onanygivensunday wrote:
Smelly McUgly wrote:
I think that players should be paid whatever the market is willing to give them with no restrictions.

That being said, however, if there was a guy that might get me to at least consider coming off that position, it would be Aaron Curry.

The problem was... it was a false market. It still is for that matter... but at least it's more in line than under the old CBA.

Applying the old CBA to myself... I'm a mechanical engineer with 32+ years experience in the aerospace industry.

I can't imagine a 22 y/o kid coming out of college with the same degree and his starting salary trumps mine by 10x.

That makes no sense whatsoever.

Back on topic... I'll predict that Curry won't make it past game 8 before getting cut, assuming that he even makes the Giants 53-man roster.


The market is the market. Markets are fluid, not "false."

Let's put it this way: Had Andrew Luck not been forced into a completely planned market with a salary cap and a draft system, he would have been worth whatever the Colts (or whatever team) wanted to pay him. What someone is worth is fluid.

Analogizing between our jobs and the NFL usually heads toward the false analogy realm, but let's put it this way. I am a college instructor. If someone that just came out of college showed a possible ability to get students to learn and retain information at 200% my ability (or anyone else's), then yeah, that person should get more money than me. If a school values that potential enough to give that instructor tenure right off the bat, then that is the school's decision based on its goals and the availability of the people in the market to help them reach those goals.

Back on topic, though: We can definitely agree that Curry sucks.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:40 pm 
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SM - What I keep tripping over is... a free market does not exist for college players once they are drafted. That's why I called it a false (not free) market.

Otoh, it does for UFAs... and I agree that any UFA should get whatever the market will bear.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:41 pm 
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biggest hawks bust ever...wanaa argue? go.











yeah, I thought so.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:53 pm 
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kearly wrote:
Rob has to live with an edge. If he didn't, he'd slip into a coma covering soccer all the time


Now THAT's funny. :lol:

Soccer sucks! Other than taxation without representation and the whole King thing, I'm pretty sure the biggest reason we broke away from Mother England back in the day was realizing we didn't want to have soccer as our national sport.

FYI, tongue firmly planted in cheek, so all you hyper soccer geeks calm down and get a sense of humor... :thirishdrinkers:

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 1:57 pm 
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onanygivensunday wrote:
SM - What I keep tripping over is... a free market does not exist for college players once they are drafted. That's why I called it a false (not free) market.

Otoh, it does for UFAs... and I agree that any UFA should get whatever the market will bear.


It is still a market. It's just a heavily-planned one rather than a free one. I thought that it was planned enough even before the rookie cap restrictions.

UFAs are not in a free market. They are restricted by the cap as much as the teams that court them are restricted by the cap. In a free market, Darrelle Revis would be making more than what he makes now.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:16 pm 
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What's this 'soccer' you all speak of?

We play football over here.

With your feet and a ball.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:17 pm 
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theENGLISHseahawk wrote:
What's this 'soccer' you all speak of?

We play football over here.

With your feet and a ball.


That's just diabolical

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:20 pm 
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theENGLISHseahawk wrote:
What's this 'soccer' you all speak of?

We play football over here.

With your feet and a ball.


I would say that you less "play football" and more "mince around aimlessly for ninety minutes, flopping to the ground for no discernible reason every once in awhile."

But otherwise, everything else you said made perfect sense. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:32 pm 
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Futbol!

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:36 pm 
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theENGLISHseahawk wrote:
What's this 'soccer' you all speak of?

You should know. You guys came up with that word in the first place. :P

EDIT: If anyone is genuinely curious, here's the origin of the word "soccer" and some other good stuff.
http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php ... rd-soccer/

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Last edited by razgriz737 on Thu May 23, 2013 2:45 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:39 pm 
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razgriz737 wrote:
theENGLISHseahawk wrote:
What's this 'soccer' you all speak of?

You should know. You guys came up with that word in the first place. :P



Its actually a word used to describe men who have sex with lots of women in their country. Someone who plays football. Thus we made up the term Soccer.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:42 pm 
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Au contraire...

While there's no doubt the game at the highest level has changed with the influx of money/worldwide popularity and is now played by complete and utter fannies (check google for our meaning of the word)... at the smallest unprofessional grass roots level it's completely brutal.

I'm lucky to have only endured two broken teeth (elbow to the face) and three serious ankle injuries including a double fracture. I once saw a friend red carded for retaliation to being punched in the face.

I like to tell this story about my brief one day stint playing in Canada. I joined a team and went along to the first practise where we played a game at the end. I did find it a little strange that I was the only one using the F-word frequently at the top of my voice, but the other players seemed to like my English edge. Then I went for a 50-50 ball with an oriental goalkeeper. He got their first, I couldn't put on the breaks and over he went. He writhed around in pain (including screams) while I initially laughed at the humorous outcome, only to realise that he was going to milk this to the maximum and pretend he was badly injured. I mean... at worst this was paramount to being gently nudged onto a bed of grass.

Anyway, to cut a long story short, I received a stern email telling me the goalkeeper complained to the coach he'd injured his kidney's and I wasn't going to be asked back to play again. This despite scoring the winning goal -- an absolutely worldy -- in a 1-0 victory in the aforementioned practise game.

So beware the English football player... we're coming for your kidney's.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 4:39 pm 
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I think the fact that Curry was way over drafted and overpaid is only part of the story. He could have become a servicable starting linebacker if he had the commitment. I believe at least that. If he had become a Leroy Hill type, his career would have been a disappointment, but not an outright bust.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:11 pm 
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Curry sucks

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 6:07 pm 
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Couldn't handle the money

50 million, set for life, everything else just became more important then football.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 6:12 pm 
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After seeing what this team has become...I'm guessing he wishes he had tried a bit harder while in Seattle. He totally missed the championship boat.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 6:28 pm 
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He could have used some Adderall. Just saying.

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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:38 pm 
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Kind of sad really, here's a Ferrari sitn' up on blocks


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 7:42 pm 
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Evil_Shenanigans wrote:
He could have used some Adderall. Just saying.

He needs something a lot stronger than that


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 10:11 am 
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Smelly McUgly wrote:
-The Glove- wrote:
I'm glad the outrageous rookie contracts are a thing of the past. Never understood how a pup could come in and make so much more than a proven vet. You should be paid for performance not potential.


I think that players should be paid whatever the market is willing to give them with no restrictions.


Couldn't disagree more. That was the problem with the old rookie wages, these guys were holding teams hostage. The team had the pressure to get the players in camp, everyone held out, a lot of guys would sign during pre-season and rookie years were wasted.

I think a lot of reason young QB's are doing better is that holdouts are a thing of the past.

I think players should be paid what the market is willing in free agency, as a rookie? No. There is no market, either the team and player agrees or they don't.


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 Post subject: Re: Aaron Curry solidified his position as....
 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 12:05 pm 
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If I were in Pete and John's shoes, I would put copies of this article in every rookie's welcome packet and playbook during the off-season. Right in the front. I would highlight in yellow, Curry's comments about the motivational changes he experienced after getting paid upon entering the league. I would also post some of Curry's comments in strategic places around the facility that the young guys will see often during OTA and off-season workouts as a cautionary tale. The message - "Hey guys, we care about you. Guard your hearts and minds. Don't be this guy."

Hindsight being what it is, it's easy to say Curry is too slow mentally, was never going to get it, shouldn't have been picked, etc. However, at draft time that year, he was considered by 'most' experts around the league, and I'm exluding the Kipers of the group, just the inside-the-beltway NFL scouts and GM's, as a "can't miss", "safest pick in the draft", "no brainer" kind of player. Several talking-heads asked, "could he be the next Lawrence Taylor?"

If management can influence a Christine Michael or any other rookie of the uniquely rare opportunity they have, and how quickly it can be taken away from them, we all win, management, the team, the fans.


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