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 Post subject: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:51 am 
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Russell Wilson has definitely thrown a few of these and I remember Tarvaris just getting SLAUGHTERED on here for throwing them. I don't think it was the jump pass so much as the football smarts / overall ability that was the real problem.

Just a random thought I had.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:55 am 
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There is a difference. TJ imo threw a few jump balls that were behind or thrown out of position for our recievers... e.g. could have led him just fine, but instead he had to stop and leap, and therefore gets crushed.

RW, imo, tends to throw the ball into an area where the opponent has a very difficult time getting to it while his receiver has the advantage. If that includes a jump, so be it.

TJ = less acurate

just my perception

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:57 am 
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Obvious answer is russell needs to extra height.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:00 am 
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nwgamer wrote:
There is a difference. TJ imo threw a few jump balls that were behind or thrown out of position for our recievers... e.g. could have led him just fine, but instead he had to stop and leap, and therefore gets crushed.

RW, imo, tends to throw the ball into an area where the opponent has a very difficult time getting to it while his receiver has the advantage. If that includes a jump, so be it.

TJ = less acurate

just my perception


Not a jump ball, a jump pass, where the QB jumps while throwing the ball.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:11 am 
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Those baseball skills come in handy... jump throws, running and throwing, sliding, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:18 am 
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Jackson always threw them when he was about to get smoked.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:35 am 
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JesterHawk wrote:
nwgamer wrote:
There is a difference. TJ imo threw a few jump balls that were behind or thrown out of position for our recievers... e.g. could have led him just fine, but instead he had to stop and leap, and therefore gets crushed.

RW, imo, tends to throw the ball into an area where the opponent has a very difficult time getting to it while his receiver has the advantage. If that includes a jump, so be it.

TJ = less acurate

just my perception


Not a jump ball, a jump pass, where the QB jumps while throwing the ball.


I don't think we had an issue solely with jumping while passing, but where the ball ended up when he did it. With Wilson, they're likely TD passes.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:43 am 
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Dude jumps up throws a 60 yard pass I am fine with it. Dude turns around throws it over his shoulder and gets a TD I am fine with it. Dude throws it like a boomerang and completes for a first down I am fine with it.

I don't think anyone really cares how the pass is throw but they judge the outcome. If a guy throws lots of jump passes and often with bad result he will get slammed for throwing those unless they are out-of-bounds......


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 9:59 am 
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IIRC, lots of those jump passes from Jackson resulted from the QB running the naked bootleg play action and then immediately having to throw over the defensive end before getting hammered to the turf. And it usually only resulting in a 2 yard pass to the fullback. Man, I hated those playcalls 2 years ago.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:09 am 
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Really? We're going to compare Wilson to TJack now?

Other than the obvious difference in ad lib skills, I'm going to go with if Russell Wilson does it, there's an advantage to be gained by doing it. If Jackson does it, it's basically a passing alternative to Seneca Wallace running out of bounds for a 9 yard sack.


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:29 am 
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The difference there is "touch", RW has it.

TJ's was more of a "chuck it up", "Hot Potato", "Here, you take this, I gotsta go" kinda pass.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:14 pm 
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It's amazing how a fans perspective of an action changes based on the results!


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:47 pm 
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bellingerga wrote:
It's amazing how a fans perspective of an action changes based on the results!


That was basically my point.

Nobody ever said "Man I hate it when TJack throws a bad pass", but I distinctly remember seeing "If he ever throws a blankety-blank jump pass again I'll break my TV!"

Nobody is comparing Tjack to anybody. I'm comparing fan reactions to two very different quarterbacks doing the same action.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:52 pm 
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No one is going to knock it if the pass is completed and the pass still looks pretty.

When you jump in the air, throw a duck or a laser that goes nowhere near a receiver, then people are going to knock it.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:55 pm 
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Russ usually jumped a little when on the move. Tjax would jump pass in the pocket with zero pressure.


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 12:56 pm 
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JesterHawk wrote:
bellingerga wrote:
It's amazing how a fans perspective of an action changes based on the results!


That was basically my point.

Nobody ever said "Man I hate it when TJack throws a bad pass", but I distinctly remember seeing "If he ever throws a blankety-blank jump pass again I'll break my TV!"

Nobody is comparing Tjack to anybody. I'm comparing fan reactions to two very different quarterbacks doing the same action.


Let me explain it to you. Lets change sports and discuss basketball and lets go back in time a few years.

Shaq is playing - he attempts ten 3-pt shots in a game..........would you complain?

Miller is playing - he attempts ten 3-pts shots in a game.........would you complain?

Yes a players ability to execute the play / the move / the action that he is taking is going to impact the comments attributed to that play. I don't understand why this would be surprising


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 1:29 pm 
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The vitriol seemed like it was directed at the jump pass and not the result. Somebody not knowing much about the game of football would have learned from posts here that a jump pass was the worst thing a football player could ever attempt. It would be more like shooting from half court with 23 seconds on the game clock, again, based on the comments made about jump passes in the past.

It's a commentary on people projecting failed actions onto the wrong thing. The jump pass wasn't the problem, Tjack's basic football acumen was the problem.

There is a difference between pointing something out and 'being surprised'. No need to get snarky, that's my job.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 1:30 pm 
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Jackson sucks, Wilson is already one of the better QB's in the league.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 8:58 am 
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Hey, whatever works for the kid. The results speak for themselves. He could run backwards to the goal posts, spin around them like a gymnast, and throw the ball with his feet while doing a Deltchev to triple backflip dismount and if it's a perfect spiral that hits his intended receiver in stride, I couldn't care less about how he got it there.

Sometimes people like traditional, stand straight up in the pocket, don't move around, make the perfect form on a throw, and blah blah blah...and don't get me wrong, I would like that too, but Wilson is a winner—and winners do what they need to do, no matter how unconventional it is, to get the job done.

Tjack's jump passes were annoying because they were rarely on target... Wilson's jump passes rarely, if ever, are incomplete and usually result in a busted play turning into a positive play.

That's all, and that's why he gets a pass on his jumping, throwing on the run, or other "unorthodox" ways he can deliver the ball....

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:05 am 
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One thing is a 'fact,' though. Leaving one's feet and leaping in the air make it more difficult to maintain fundamentals in the throwing motion. That's why coaches teach good solid footwork as a basis of good passing.

However, and this is a big one, some players are better able to maintain good throwing mechanics than others, including when jumping in the air. It's not just about arm strength, though I'm sure that contibutes to it, it's about still being able to throw an accurate, catchable ball while doing so. Russ can do that, apparently, while TJ struggled with it. Basically, fans, and I believe most coaches, will frown on jump passes because of the fact that perhaps most QBs can't do it well. Most coaches probably won't teach or allow practice of the move because of that. So, like was said above, hatred of the move translates into hatred of the QB doing it based more on whether he can do it successfully.

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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:13 am 
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I don't see it. How about posting some gifs to compare?


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 Post subject: Re: It's kind of funny...RE: Jump passes.
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:40 am 
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The big difference?, Tarvarus Jackson threw the panic ball up for grabs, in hopes that his Receivers would win the contest (BIG Mike Williams?), + he had accuracy issues.
Russell Wilson throws away from coverage by DB's to where his Receivers have the best chances to make the catch, and his accuracy is pretty spot on.
Not to say he doesn't sometimes over throw in some of his attempts to give his Receivers a chance to run under the ball for the catch.


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