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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:39 am 
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I read somewhere that Richard Seymour held up well against the run before he got hurt.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:20 am 
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How much of our deficiency against the run in the second half of the year (we were stout to start the year) do you put on Red's injury? And are there indications that he can go back to being the same ol' run stuffing Red? I definitely agree that resigning Branch is a good idea, but I think that if we can get back to "the status quo" from last year, assuming Red is healthy, that will be more than enough.

thoughts?

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:25 am 
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I agree, one more starting caliber DT is needed and we are pretty much set. That position is too important and too difficult to rely on a non first round rookie on a superbowl capable team. Of course it is possible that a rookie could do it, but the odds are against it. At this point I am totally good with bringing Branch back


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:29 am 
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pehawk wrote:
To be fair to the Hawks, the only people who can truly stop SF's power running game, is Roman and Harbaugh. Its just that good, and that line is too invested in. You stop that by scoring, period.

Good point and I agree which is why I was hoping for Tavon Austin in the draft before Percy Harvin materialized. That's 2 regular season games that the Hawks plan to show no mercy with Percy. Still, aim to slow down that SF run game and/or try to make them one-dimensional. Tough task, but the Hawks can do it. There's other teams to game plan for as well and not overlook in terms of run defense.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:46 am 
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It sounds like they are working to re-sign Branch:

Quote:
With Bennett, Avril and Percy Harvin in the fold, Schneider said the Seahawks now will focus on securing their own free agents, which include defensive tackle Alan Branch, linebacker Leroy Hill, cornerback Marcus Trufant, kicker Steven Hauschka and offensive lineman Frank Omiyale.

Read more here: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/03/1 ... l=Seahawks#storylink=cpy


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:49 am 
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3.6 YPC given up with healthy Big Red in the 1st half of the season, 5.1 YPC the second half when Red was injured


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:52 am 
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I think they could take a look at something like this from time to time if we don't bring Branch back:

Base/running downs:
Bennett Mebane Bryant Avril

3rd down/pass rush:
Irvin Bennett Meban Avril

Something a lot of people are overlooking with the Bennett signing is that he was one of the best run defenders in the league as well. Why waste that skill set?


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:06 am 
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I would be all for re-signing Branch back.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:29 am 
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ivotuk wrote:
I read somewhere that Richard Seymour held up well against the run before he got hurt.


I would think at this point in his career he may want a chance for one more ring. He could play the Jason Jones role this year to spell Branch (if he resigns). Not sure if he could be an every down player, but for a 1-2 year veteran minimum contract I would get him.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:45 am 
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Boiler wrote:
It sounds like they are working to re-sign Branch:

Quote:
With Bennett, Avril and Percy Harvin in the fold, Schneider said the Seahawks now will focus on securing their own free agents, which include defensive tackle Alan Branch, linebacker Leroy Hill, cornerback Marcus Trufant, kicker Steven Hauschka and offensive lineman Frank Omiyale.

Read more here: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/03/1 ... l=Seahawks#storylink=cpy


I think that means we are trading for Suh and signing a few more FA's.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:46 am 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit. San Francisco can still push our guys around with their offensive line if they make it a game priority.

Re-signing Branch would retain last year's status quo, which was only OK the last half of the year. I am open it ideas that improve Branch's spot, but don't say rookie. What veterans can upgrade Branch's run stopping spot?

Dude, you are harshing my Hawks induced buzz!

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:59 am 
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Boiler wrote:
It sounds like they are working to re-sign Branch:

Quote:
With Bennett, Avril and Percy Harvin in the fold, Schneider said the Seahawks now will focus on securing their own free agents, which include defensive tackle Alan Branch, linebacker Leroy Hill, cornerback Marcus Trufant, kicker Steven Hauschka and offensive lineman Frank Omiyale.

Read more here: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/03/1 ... l=Seahawks#storylink=cpy


Honestly, given who's out there and available on the market right now ... I'd have to say that's probably the smart move. I would have said that William Hayes was a guy that was worth bringing in, as he is a very good run defender and I believe that you could play him at DT. The problem is that the Rams thought that too as they re-signed him 3 days ago.

So, outside of Vance Walker and our own Alan Branch ... I'm not entirely sure that there is a whole lot of other good options out there in the FA Market. Re-signing Branch then has to be the primary focus right now and would make the most sense.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:00 pm 
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Sedrick Ellis anyone?


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:49 pm 
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volsunghawk wrote:
Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit. San Francisco can still push our guys around with their offensive line if they make it a game priority.

Re-signing Branch would retain last year's status quo, which was only OK the last half of the year. I am open it ideas that improve Branch's spot, but don't say rookie. What veterans can upgrade Branch's run stopping spot?


Roy Miller is a young option. He was part of Tampa's impressive run D last season. But he's ONLY a run stopper. He's got zero to offer as far as pass rush.

Sen'Derrick Marks might be an option, and he offers some pass rush, as well.

Leger Douzable of the Titans. Went on IR last year, but was reportedly a versatile, rotational run stopper.

Trevor Laws joined the Rams last season on a one-year deal and then ended up on IR before leaving camp. Hard to know if he's healthy, but he's more of a run guy than a rush guy.

So I guess there's a few options. Not sure if any of them are really great, though.

Thank you. I will take a closer look at these names.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:58 pm 
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I will be monitoring this situation very closely.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:05 pm 
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JKent82 wrote:
Boiler wrote:
It sounds like they are working to re-sign Branch:

Quote:
With Bennett, Avril and Percy Harvin in the fold, Schneider said the Seahawks now will focus on securing their own free agents, which include defensive tackle Alan Branch, linebacker Leroy Hill, cornerback Marcus Trufant, kicker Steven Hauschka and offensive lineman Frank Omiyale.

Read more here: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/03/1 ... l=Seahawks#storylink=cpy


I think that means we are trading for Suh and signing a few more FA's.


LMAO -- I seriously would love Suh and then sign Dawson as kicker

Off we go :)


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:17 pm 
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JKent82 wrote:
Sedrick Ellis anyone?


Nevermind. After a short bit of research, he's not much of a run defender anyways.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:30 pm 
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JKent82 wrote:
JKent82 wrote:
Sedrick Ellis anyone?


Nevermind. After a short bit of research, he's not much of a run defender anyways.


Yeah, I could have told you that. Just FYI and for those who are wondering just how Saints fans feel about Sedrick Ellis, here is an interesting conversation I found. Definitely pretty insightful ...

http://saintsreport.com/forums/f2/dt-sedrick-ellis-bust-face-consistency-282228/#.UUOgdlIg8YI


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:31 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit. San Francisco can still push our guys around with their offensive line if they make it a game priority.

Re-signing Branch would retain last year's status quo, which was only OK the last half of the year. I am open it ideas that improve Branch's spot, but don't say rookie. What veterans can upgrade Branch's run stopping spot?


I had this same thought, and that's why I had us taking Sylvester Williams at #56 in my latest "what I think will happen" mock draft. Williams is a very similar player to Brandon Mebane (though more well rounded as a pass rusher), who made an immediate impact for us in 2007 and 2008.


Last edited by kearly on Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:34 pm 
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DJrmb wrote:
3.6 YPC given up with healthy Big Red in the 1st half of the season, 5.1 YPC the second half when Red was injured


The Cardinals, 49ers, and Rams all ran better against us in the 1st half of the year than during the second half of the year.

The reason for the awful second half was because our defense has historically struggled against ultra quick RBs and WRs. We faced much quicker RBs in the second half of the year. AP, Spiller, Bush, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 8:48 pm 
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i'm going to have to disagree, only in the first time we played the 9ers our interior run D was exploited, but every game where we were owned by RB's like AP, The guy from the Bills, Reggy Bush, Morris and Turner they gashed us on outside runs particularly to Red Bryants And Irvins side. Clems usually would hold his on. At least to the point he wasn't a liability.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:36 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit.


I agree wholeheartedly. Except I think more than a handful of teams are capable of exploiting it. Bottom line is, our secondary will prevent us from getting smoked from passing, (in terms of whole games, no secondary will ever effectively stop the passing game from teams game in and game out) but we're definitely vulnerable in the run game in a couple of ways. I also think that, until proven otherwise, we are vulnerable to the quick & short passing game. Look what Welker did to us; we won that game, but Brady had over 400 yards and a LOT of it was comprised of quick slants and the like, burning our linebackers. Do you agree or disagree about the passing?

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:53 pm 
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One thing that needs to be understood about that SF game is that Bane and Branch weren't in for the big runs. We were in nickel with Jones and McDonald at DT. The first one Jones fell flat on his face. Just tripped over his own shoelaces and fell down and allowed them to double Wright. The 2nd one wasn't all that different. Wagner hit the A Gap left of center and they doubled McDonald and ran right of center.

Partially personnel and a whole lotta bad playcall.

We do need someone to compete at 3 tech and despite a lot of hogwash said about Red playing that spot it still might be the best move. He plays it once in a while anyway, if people would pay attention. Beyond that though I think we'll add a DT in the draft. I like Sylvester Williams or Kawann Short in the 2nd or 3rd respectively. Short is stricly a 3 tech, but Sly Williams can play 1 or 3 and would prefer the latter.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:55 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit. San Francisco can still push our guys around with their offensive line if they make it a game priority.

Re-signing Branch would retain last year's status quo, which was only OK the last half of the year. I am open it ideas that improve Branch's spot, but don't say rookie. What veterans can upgrade Branch's run stopping spot?


This won't happen if Red gets right and we either draft a big 2 gap DT or re-sign Branch... A couple ifs, but I think JS figures this one out.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 5:36 am 
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RolandDeschain wrote:
Scottemojo wrote:
Our run defense up the middle is still not right. That is a defect a handful of teams can exploit.


I agree wholeheartedly. Except I think more than a handful of teams are capable of exploiting it. Bottom line is, our secondary will prevent us from getting smoked from passing, (in terms of whole games, no secondary will ever effectively stop the passing game from teams game in and game out) but we're definitely vulnerable in the run game in a couple of ways. I also think that, until proven otherwise, we are vulnerable to the quick & short passing game. Look what Welker did to us; we won that game, but Brady had over 400 yards and a LOT of it was comprised of quick slants and the like, burning our linebackers. Do you agree or disagree about the passing?

Definitely agree there too, so as it stands two down run stopper, nickel, and a replacement for Leroy Hill who can cover are needed.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:47 am 
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Yes but with DVOA on injured reserve we couldn't stop squat the last half the year.

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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:25 am 
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If we can get interior pressure we will be golden. That's what I seen that we needed all last year. If QB's can't step up in the pocket we're gonna get em.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:34 am 
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Axx wrote:
i'm going to have to disagree, only in the first time we played the 9ers our interior run D was exploited, but every game where we were owned by RB's like AP, The guy from the Bills, Reggy Bush, Morris and Turner they gashed us on outside runs particularly to Red Bryants And Irvins side. Clems usually would hold his on. At least to the point he wasn't a liability.


Minnesota stopped running AP because he was mostly ineffective outside about 5-6 big runs.
He had a 77 yard run from sick juke (also because Sherman was held just before he could get to him).

But if you look at the runs he broke off the yards on you can see two things:

(14:21) 28-A.Peterson right end to SEA 1 for 74 yards (39-B.Browner).
(8:46) 28-A.Peterson left tackle pushed ob at MIN 46 for 16 yards (39-B.Browner)
(8:36) 28-A.Peterson up the middle to SEA 44 for 24 yards (39-B.Browner, 69-C.McDonald).
(7:52) 28-A.Peterson up the middle to SEA 29 for 15 yards (29-E.Thomas).
(4:04) 28-A.Peterson right tackle to MIN 47 for 28 yards (54-B.Wagner).
(13:06) 28-A.Peterson left end pushed ob at MIN 20 for 12 yards (39-B.Browner).

First: that 169 of his 182 yards on 6 plays. Irritating to say the least, but much more preferable to losing 5-6 yards on every carry.
Maybe once per drive he gets a first down, but the rest of the running game is so ineffective that it forces them into 3rd and long situations too, that's why the Vikings went away from him in the second half.

Second: 2 runs to the left, 2 runs to the right, 2 runs up the middle. You can't blame any one player for those runs, AP just does that to everyone.


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 Post subject: Re: I know you are all giddy, but...
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:46 am 
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I buy that Red can play inside more then people think. I watched half the Home SF game last night, need to catch the other half still, but Red was effective when he was inside. He's just so strong and I think his burst off the line is better than it used to be. It's shown in a lot of games.

I think we'll see it a little more often, not that they would scrap his spot at 5 technique, but I think he'll do it some times. Particularily if we don't bring Branch back and if we're playing pass heavy teams. Run a lot of Avril, Red, Mebane, Bennett lines against that.


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