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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:59 pm 
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DJrmb wrote:
Everyone keeps talking about how much you have to pay Revis and how we don't need a CB. True we don't necessarily "Need" a CB as we likely already have the best Secondary in the game.


You pretty much answered your own scenario here.

The reason that the Seahawks have "The Best Secondary In The Game" is because the physical Mauler "Browner" is on that Secondary.
He is being dismissed by some as being border line with skills, and that just isn't true...There isn't a gigantic drop off as some are suggesting.
His jambing at the line, screws up the timing of a LOT of Quarterback/Receiver plays.
Steve Smith was stifled by Sherman last Year, and he lost his cool and flustered, slammed Sherman ( getting flagged ), BUT, could you imagine Smith trying something like that with Browner? :thfight7:


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 1:37 pm 
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I like Browner, I really do. I know going on about Revis probably makes me sound like I don't. I think Browner brings a lot to the team and is a solid CB opposite Sherman. And actually I have never even been a big Revis fan. But there is no way I can agree with people that think Browner is better than Revis.

Again, not trying to bash Browner but do you remember when he served his suspension? The Defense didn't miss a beat and actually seemed to get a little better in pass protection.

Revis is not just some small cover corner like the perception out there. He is a strong and physical guy who is known for much more than just picking the ball. He's one of the best tacklers and run defenders at his position as well. He just does everything excellent. He's an all around type of guy.

Why do you think Browner wasn't on Steve Smith to begin with? He just doesn't have the quickness/speed to handle that type of guy. He is limited. Revishas the ability to cover any WR in the NFL (at least he did before his injury).


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:20 pm 
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For the Jets: 2 first round picks

For the Seahawks: 1st and a combination of players or conditional picks

Chances of this happening: Not very good

Would I do it: No

Is this Seahawks related?: Not really but it is the off-season so anything goes.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:37 pm 
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Bevis is off our dining table folks. There isn't a single circumstance that lands him in Seattle.

We have a team to run here. And by team, I mean everyone, not just one.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 2:54 pm 
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DJrmb wrote:

As for the Jets it really just depends on how much they like Browner and Flynn. If you think Flynn can be your starter then he's easily worth a 2nd or 3rd. Philly got a Probowl CB and a 2nd for Kolb... And Browner should probably be about the same, maybe more a 3rd. So it's kind of like a 2nd and a 3rd and no I really don't think anyone else would offer much more then that. Maybe someone offers a couple 2nds but I don't see (nor have I heard of any rumors yet) of anyone offering a 1st.


Don't you think the Kolb trade has made teams more weary to enter this kind of deal? Same with Carson Palmer and to a lesser extent Whitehurst. Teams simply aren't going to pay you top dollar for a backup QB in a trade right now. I feel the Chiefs overpaid for Alex Smith, but you're not going to convince me that Flynn is worth a comparable amount to Alex Smith in a 2nd round pick. There are years of tape on Smith for a team to make up there mind. You still only have what, 2 games to make up your mind on Flynn?

Personally i think of Browner as a pro-bowler in our system, but i don't think he could have success in any system.

Revis to Seattle is just wishful thinking and our salary cap is better spent elseware.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:11 pm 
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KC gave up Two 2nd round picks for Smith. I am saying Flynn is worth half that (one 2nd or 3rd).

Again, the salary cap is spent either way. You pay Browner or you pay Revis

And I am sure that Revis is a total pipe dream and highly unlikely, but there is a little more there then what some people think.

edit: Rotoworld has it listed as a 2nd and a conditional 3rd. I could have sworn ESPN was reporting a possibility of two 2nd's either way that's quite a bit for A. Smith


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:33 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Kip, your idea makes sense for the Seahawks. Also, like Tical said, nobody is trading for Revis without having already negotiated a deal. And the Jets won't trade him for a conditional pick, what if your new rental player blows out his other knee and you don't re-sign him then? That scenario would never let the Jets do the deal for a conditional thing. The 2nd pick in the deal might be conditional, like the Alex Smith trade.

Right now, the Jets are treating his potential trade like his Franchise Tagged. Two firsts. That is where negotiations start. We have two problems. Number one, San Fran has more to spend in the draft than we do, and it is this year's picks they have to spend, not 2014. So your offer makes Seattle a leverage partner, and nothing else. With the desperate state of the coach in New York, 2014 picks might as well be 2025 picks. They need cheap players right now, not next year. There is no offer we can make that the Niners cannot outshine, unless players are part of the deal. And the Niners need him more than we do, so they would escalate us out of the talks. WHich is good, if they are going to trade for him, we need to make them pay for the privilege by making them overpay.

Here is my question to Kip. Stop trying to delay the pain of the trade by making it about 2014 picks. Would you trade this year's 1st and next year's conditional second for Revis? Or this year's second and next year's first? Or even our first two picks this year?


I think you missed the point of this thread. Don't worry, everyone did.

This thread is about where the Seattle Seahawks draw the line. It's about deciding what is the maximum cost for Revis where a trade starts to make sense from Seattle's vantage point. If that maximum price is beat out by another team, then sayonara Revis. Best of luck in Cleveland or whatever shithole wants you too much.

I am also not quite sure a contract extension with the trade is a slam dunk either. Revis is asking for $16 million, and he seems like the type that would go to the open market to prove his point if you disagree with him. This difficulty could end up killing Revis' trade value, since teams aren't going to give that kind of money and Revis probably isn't going to sign for less outside of hitting free agency. If you trade for Revis, you are probably getting a rental unless you are just fine with paying him crazy money.

As you showed with that Kirwan article, it's the Jets who are in the tough position here. Trading Revis for two high picks is tough the same way that trading Browner for two high picks would be. But if you lower the demands, it gets easier. It's all about pricing. At a certain price, eventually a team or two will decide he's worth it. If you offered Revis for a 3rd rounder straight up every other team in the NFL would be on the phone.


Last edited by kearly on Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:37 pm 
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drdiags wrote:
For the Jets: 2 first round picks

For the Seahawks: 1st and a combination of players or conditional picks

Chances of this happening: Not very good

Would I do it: No

Is this Seahawks related?: Not really but it is the off-season so anything goes.


We'll see.

Sure.

That's more than I proposed, but I could see it, sure.

Would I do it? Depends. That's over the line in the sand I drew, but depending on who those players are and depending on if Revis signs an extension, it might be worth it.

I think it is. Seattle was reported to have interest. This topic is from the Seahawks POV. I wouldn't complain if it was moved, but IMO I think it should be here.


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 6:14 am 
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Well, Kip, If that is the Seahawks POV, and top price, why would they even bother calling the Jets? If you don't want to spend money, don't go to the store, right? A conditional 2nd for Revis is more like waiting by the dumpster for the store to throw out yesterday's produce.

The Jets are better off just keeping him for his 6 million this year, offering him a nice deal before free agency 2014 when the inevitable cut of Mark Sanchez frees up cap space.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:58 am 
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If the Seahawks are interested, it seems they may have to negotiate to get the level of compensation closer to what the OP suggests

Quote:
Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

Talking to 3 execs in last 12 hours, market for Revis seems to be a first-rounder, plus another high pick, perhaps a conditional '14 pick.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 06, 2013 9:39 am 
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I think a 1st this year is fair compensation, but i think there could be a conditional pick given back to the team if say Revis gets injured or does not resign with the team, but if he stays healthy and resigns with the team they shoudl ahve to give up another 3rd.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:55 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Well, Kip, If that is the Seahawks POV, and top price, why would they even bother calling the Jets? If you don't want to spend money, don't go to the store, right? A conditional 2nd for Revis is more like waiting by the dumpster for the store to throw out yesterday's produce.

The Jets are better off just keeping him for his 6 million this year, offering him a nice deal before free agency 2014 when the inevitable cut of Mark Sanchez frees up cap space.


Maybe the Jets just don't want to pay Revis at all? In that scenario, getting whatever they can makes sense. It's the same rationale as the Tapp/Wilson/Sims trades when John Schneider first came here.

I'm guessing Idzik is looking at his roster and realized that he's operating a sinking ship. He needs to blow it up and get what he can from the salvaged parts.

I personally don't view Revis as yesterday's produce. And Seattle wouldn't approach the Jets with the offer I have in mind, they'd approach with something lower, and draw the line at (in this scenario) a conditional 1st. Maybe the Jets will get a better offer. If so, oh well, you tried. That's how these things go. No harm in exploring options that might help your team.


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:34 am 
*Scott of Smacksville*
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Well, Kip, John Schneider is shameless when it comes to cheap bargaining. What he paid for Bee Moe was highway robbery. So if anybody can get Revis on a one year rental for cheaps, it is JS.

Must be the midwestern part of him.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:11 am 
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kearly wrote:
Scottemojo wrote:
This thread is about where the Seattle Seahawks draw the line.


I got this but the full problem with this is that we (should) draw the line WAY before it even becomes remotely possible to get Revis.

There is no way period that we spend the money to get Revis with the long term implications so the discussion is like having a thread about where we draw the line for signing Aaron Rodgers next year when he is a FA........


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 7:27 pm 
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Wenhawk wrote:
but i think there could be a conditional pick given back to the team if say Revis gets injured or does not resign with the team, but if he stays healthy and resigns with the team they shoudl ahve to give up another 3rd.


Can you give me a single example of this happening before?


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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:12 pm 
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WestcoastSteve wrote:
Wenhawk wrote:
but i think there could be a conditional pick given back to the team if say Revis gets injured or does not resign with the team, but if he stays healthy and resigns with the team they shoudl ahve to give up another 3rd.


Can you give me a single example of this happening before?


Nope, but I can't think of a time when a team is trying to get a 1st round + for a gy coming off an ACL injury. A more typicaly trade would be a 2nd this year and depending on his production a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd next year as a conditional. Say 1st if he makes the pro bowl, 2nd if he starts 14 games, and 3rd as the starting point.

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 Post subject: Re: What level of compensation makes sense in a Revis trade?
 Post Posted: Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:13 pm 
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I wouldn't even trade a 1st for him. Unknown level of play after an injury he might fully recover from, or be a shell of his former self from. Different story if he never got injured. I'd say a 2nd, considering the risk.

Revis would obviously be an upgrade over Browner, but Browner's a pretty good CB. Waste of money. We're able to roll cap space over again this year, right?

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