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 Post subject: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 8:03 pm 
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Just wondering if signing him to a long term deal this offseason would be a possibility? We have extra money this year, maybe we give him a 3 or 4 year deal thats front loaded. Might be able to save some money before he becomes a FA next year.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 8:41 pm 
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If I'm not mistaken Browner will be a RFA next season because he'll be under 4 years of service time. Meaning they can give him a one year (first round) tender for around 3 million. Either he comes back or someone gives us their #1 pick.

Yes I'd love to lock Browner up but if we can have him these next two years for cheap it makes some sense to let things play out. Browner is going to be 29 this season, I'm personally a bit curious how he's going to age over the next two years before I make a big commitment to him.

I think a big reason teams don't front load contracts is that in the NFL you can hold out for more money so let's say we do front load his deal, if he's still at a pro bowl level what's to stop him on the backend of asking for more money?

I think the smart thing to do with our extra cap room is to improve our team for now through the draft and free agency to make a run.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 8:53 pm 
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Browner is a low priority re-sign, IMO. I'm with Steve. Not sure how he ages exactly. Or that teams might not slowly be figuring him out a bit. I'm not against keeping him. He just falls far behind guys like Sherman, Earl, Kam, and Okung in terms of must re-signs for this team.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:01 pm 
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I disagree. Browner is unique and completely outplayed Kam last year.

Kam makes a few big hits, makes some impact plays at the LOS, and didn't get as many turnovers as last year.

Browner made an impact by pretty much erasing anyone lining across from him.

You can plug Winston Guy in for Chancellor and get close to the same impact (without the huge hits).

We don't have another Browner on the roster, and the next best cover corner is Thurmond, whom I wouldn't trust to last an entire half at this point.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:20 pm 
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Kam had some bone spur issues that were bothering him, I think it effected his start stop burst and change of direction, hopefully they get fixed and he's back to where he was.

This thought process about players without reading some of the information threads about players is knee jerk, just like Baldwin and then finding out about his shoulder and how he played thru it after GB.

We have a tough bunch of guys that want to contribute, performance drop off we can see, the why's are not always eveident until much later.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:24 pm 
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Time after time this guy made clutch hits .

off the top of my head last year his tackles against D williams vs Carolina which he also recovered was the turning point of that football game.

His tackle at the one yard line vs the Pats if im not mistaking was another huge play. I remember him having two such plays near the goal line and also against GB he hit Benson 4 yards in the back field and made him fumble inside thier ten. unfortantley we didnt recover it but still led to a punt and you know.

I remember hearing rumblings of a holdout last off season and I believe if we dont raise his pay a little we might be hearing the same this year.
My guess a 3 year 24 m extension.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:28 pm 
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He's the CB that punches guys in the chops and can knock them on their asses all game long, he has given the BUMP and RUN defense a new focus as far as how a DB plays it. He BUMPs and they no run. Sherman gets them psyched out and baits, Browner pisses them off and they lose focus. It's been a long while since the league has seen a CB that plays that angry.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:56 pm 
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God, I love Browner's game. Yes, I know Sherman is more valuable and the epitome of a #1 lockdown CB and I am a big fan of his. But I'm a Browner guy. Basically a thug playing CB, literally noone like him the entire sport. Given his crazy path so far I really hope he sees a few million soon.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:04 am 
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like I said before, call Sherman a shutdown corner all you want, but Brandon Browner is a smackdown corner and I love him for it. I want to see him do the same for many years


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:17 am 
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Just curious. What would the advantages be of keeping Browner over Sherman? Obvisouly cheaper price?

Not a fan of Sherman's yap and like Browner's game/physicality. Would rather have Browner and money/draft picks from a team that sees a high value in Sherm, but Im not an expert on how front office stuff works.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:39 am 
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Wow, we should sign Browner. Teaming him with Sherm would make them one of the top CB duos in the league!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:19 am 
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themunn wrote:
like I said before, call Sherman a shutdown corner all you want, but Brandon Browner is a smackdown corner and I love him for it. I want to see him do the same for many years

This.
When I think of the words "Rough & Tumble", Browner is the first guy that comes to my mind.
Recievers are quite aware of his reputation for his tenacious and punishing style around the League, and most with good sense will give him a wide berth.
If they're not giving him respect, he takes it.

I don't know that I've seen any drop off in his agression or play out there, so for a guy his age still laying the wood, I'd like to keep him around for awhile longer, because it would be the shits to see him wearing another uniform and have to face him as an adversary.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:19 am 
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EastCoastHawksFan wrote:
Time after time this guy made clutch hits .

off the top of my head last year his tackles against D williams vs Carolina which he also recovered was the turning point of that football game.

His tackle at the one yard line vs the Pats if im not mistaking was another huge play. I remember him having two such plays near the goal line and also against GB he hit Benson 4 yards in the back field and made him fumble inside thier ten. unfortantley we didnt recover it but still led to a punt and you know.

I remember hearing rumblings of a holdout last off season and I believe if we dont raise his pay a little we might be hearing the same this year.
My guess a 3 year 24 m extension.


Wasnt he the one that chased down AP from behind too?

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:13 am 
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And don't forget that hit on Welker!

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 5:18 am 
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Not to mention the game sealing pick 6 against the Giants in 2011 when they were inside the 10 about to score...

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:04 am 
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Browner and Sherman are the best one two punch at corner in the NFL. You will "rarely" find a guy with Browner's size, tackling ability and speed playing corner. He may not be as good of a cover corner as Sherman but he brings so many other things to the table. It was a HUGE loss for Seattle when he was out at the end of the season. Anyone who think that Browner isn't worth locking up needs to go back and study some film. Show me his equal for the skills set that he has.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:31 am 
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I am on the smackdown corner bandwagon also. He just does so much and offers great run support too. I can't remember seeing him get shoved around by anyone.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:34 am 
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Browner is more valuable to this defense than Kam. Vs Atlanta, Browner was lights out. And Browner can play safety if his wheels get a little rusty.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:35 am 
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Schadie001 wrote:
Browner and Sherman are the best one two punch at corner in the NFL. You will "rarely" find a guy with Browner's size, tackling ability and speed playing corner. He may not be as good of a cover corner as Sherman but he brings so many other things to the table. It was a HUGE loss for Seattle when he was out at the end of the season. Anyone who think that Browner isn't worth locking up needs to go back and study some film. Show me his equal for the skills set that he has.


Agreed with everthing except the bolded. I hardly noticed he was gone.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:05 am 
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I would love to keep our secondary together but I just don't think it is possible. All 3 outside of ET are going to command huge pay raises when their contracts are up.

To me it is more important to hold on to ET and Sherm. As much as I like the way Kam plays I think we could replace his production fairly easily. Probably impossible to replace those KO type hits that he puts but that is the cost of business.

I also like Browner a lot but we saw what this team could do without Browner on the field.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:06 am 
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I still think he would be a better SS .. one that Will intimidate as well as have better cover skills.

Then maybe take a look at Smith from Miami.. big Seahawkish type CB that would fit perfect.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:12 am 
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Browner is a blue collar kind of player. Not the marquee talent you pay the huge bucks, but someone you absolutely want to keep happy because he's vital to your team's success.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:39 am 
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The list of Boom signings (from most important to least):

Thomas
Sherman
Chancellor
Browner

Love Browner, I really do. But he's approaching 30 and he's barely quick enough right now at his size to pace his man. I worry that in a few years he'll be too old/slow. If the deal is below market value, yes.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 10:05 am 
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Trenchbroom wrote:
The list of Boom signings (from most important to least):

Thomas
Sherman
Chancellor
Browner

Love Browner, I really do. But he's approaching 30 and he's barely quick enough right now at his size to pace his man. I worry that in a few years he'll be too old/slow. If the deal is below market value, yes.



I totally agree that Browner is the lowest priority out of the defensive backfield (maybe Kam) but I get this feeling that if we let Browner walk we as fans will be missing him desperately. He's not the most talented but I absolutely LOVE the way he plays. The exchanges this year with S. Moss and Greg Jennings were two of my favorite moments ALL YEAR.

It's interesting when you think about it like this:

On on side (figuratively) you have Sherman and Thomas - probably the better two football players, and two incredible play makers.
On the other - Browner and Chancellor. Both guys seem more expendable, but it's these two who absolutely set the physical tone for the back half of our D.

I don't want to think about where this defense would be without them. Let's keep the Legion together!!!!

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 10:20 am 
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Browner is basically the exact player Carroll had in his dreams when he came to Seattle. He looked all over the country for a huge, physical CB, and when he couldn't find one, he turned to Canada. There's just not a lot of guys like him anywhere. I'm guessing Carroll has him pretty high on his priority list.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:16 pm 
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True, but then the FO could grab a 6'4" physical wide receiver that can't catch for shiz and try to convert them to DB.

They something similar with Sweezy, so it may not be out of the question.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:33 pm 
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Scottemojo wrote:
Browner is more valuable to this defense than Kam. Vs Atlanta, Browner was lights out. And Browner can play safety if his wheels get a little rusty.


He was also more valuable to the defense @WSH, and Kam was awful that game as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:47 pm 
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Browner is 4 years older than Chancellor. That plays a much larger role in who I prefer than performance is a game or two. Browner is getting close to 30. I don't think it's close to realistic to think he can stay at his current level of play as long as Kam can. Football is a young man's game. Especially on the defensive side of the ball. The only corners you see with prolonged elite level play are all-world guys like Champ Bailey. I like Browner. But I don't see a giant dude like him, who is already prone to getting torched here and there, aging gracefully.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:47 pm 
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I think when it comes time to re-sign these guys they will pull a Tom Brady and be willing to take less than their market value just to keep this unit together and this team a contender

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:50 pm 
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And quite frankly, I'm not exactly sure how long the NFL is going to allow Browner to knock the crap outta wr's after 5 yards of contact, as he got away with against the Redskin wr's in the playoffs. That entire game I was just waiting for him to get called for penalties. He already gets enough every now and again. I really feel it's only a matter of time until his game is keyed in on by refs and they go into games looking for it. Sherm plays physical also. But he doesn't rely on it nearly as much as Browner does. You take away Browner's ability to knock guys around, his value plummets. And yes, I do worry that it's going to become an issue with refs at some point down the road, if not soon. And if it does, that makes him aging and slowing down matter all that much more.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 3:10 pm 
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SeaTown81 wrote:
And quite frankly, I'm not exactly sure how long the NFL is going to allow Browner to knock the crap outta wr's after 5 yards of contact, as he got away with against the Redskin wr's in the playoffs. That entire game I was just waiting for him to get called for penalties. He already gets enough every now and again. I really feel it's only a matter of time until his game is keyed in on by refs and they go into games looking for it. Sherm plays physical also. But he doesn't rely on it nearly as much as Browner does. You take away Browner's ability to knock guys around, his value plummets. And yes, I do worry that it's going to become an issue with refs at some point down the road, if not soon. And if it does, that makes him aging and slowing down matter all that much more.



Are you worried more about the global shift away from contact, or are you worried more specifically about Browner being targeted or called out specifically?
Ike Taylor plays really similarly and has had a nice career. Why would they target Browner now? I don't think you (or Browner) can worry about that kind of thing. It's all about consistency - if he plays that way the whole game it makes it very difficult for the ref to throw a flag on specific plays.

He gets penalties, and that can be annoying but typically he's worth a lot more good than the occasional bad.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:55 pm 
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Browner received 2 contact penalties in 2012. The team received 12 total good for 27th place


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:49 pm 
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I'm not saying he got a lot of penalties. I'm saying I wonder if his style of play will get more attention in light of things like Harbaugh complaining and him throwing receivers all over the field being replayed over and over during the playoffs, and the announcers questioning the legality of what he was doing. I like the guy. But a lot of what he does is borderline. All it takes is for refs to call it tighter on him and a lot of what he is good at can be taken away. Not saying this is going to happen. Just threw it out as a thought that crosses my mind when considering how far you might go to keep a guy like him nearing 30.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 9:15 pm 
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OP - I get your point about front-loading so that we can re-sign Sherman after next year and RW year after that.

What you probably forgot is that you can now rollover cap space. Savin the money now allows you to use that same money next year so no need to front load. In fact it hurts you to re-sign now as you would spend more money overall.

For the person that didn't miss Browner. We plate one team that attacked the secondary at the end. How did that Chicago game go?.....pretty sure Marshall did just about what he wanted


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:03 am 
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SeaTown81 wrote:
Just threw it out as a thought that crosses my mind when considering how far you might go to keep a guy like him nearing 30.



Agreed. I just think his age is going to be the bigger issue. The combine showed the unreal speed of some of the receivers as well as DBs. We don't get faster as we age.


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:41 am 
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Thing that worries me about Browner is his knock-knees.

My doctor friend says growing up with knock-knees places added stress on the medial collateral ligaments and tends to cause a degenerative effect on the lateral collater ligaments. This is good for trauma from the outside in, but one good hit from the inside out and "snap!". I realize every player is only one good hit away, but I think Brandon should strongly consider a safe lateral after his interceptions to avoid that angry over-tackle from that TE that just got picked.

I'd like to see some emphasis placed on strengthening-up those chicken legs in the weight room, and perhaps some MRI monitoring of the knees to make sure they are not getting any worse.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:53 am 
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Browner MUST stay..dude takes no shizzle from nobody..He doesnt cost much but adds that kickass swag to the team..


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 3:46 am 
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mikeak wrote:
For the person that didn't miss Browner. We plate one team that attacked the secondary at the end. How did that Chicago game go?.....pretty sure Marshall did just about what he wanted


mike, Browner played in the Chicago game. In the last four games we played against Larry Fitzgerald, Stevie Johnson, Michael Crabtree and Danny Amendola. All four of them are very good receivers (understatement in some cases) and all of them had their chances against Lane and he did well. It's true that he gave up two touchdowns in four games, but that is pretty damn good. The team overall gave up only four touchdowns during Browner's self imposed absence (it's funny how no one calls Browner a cheater, but Sherman gets it a lot).

I don't say all that to say I don't like Browner or what he brings to the table. I love our cornerbacks. I think the long time fans remember what it was like to play against Hayes and Haynes and now we get to finally see it from the Raiders perspective after all these years. Frankly I am enjoying it.

As far as locking Browner up long term, it will be a hard decision to make, but I think the team has to take a wait and see attitude on it. Perhaps his impact plays will lessen without the focusing help of the adderall, but it is something the team needs to consider.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 5:38 am 
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I've posted this before, but feel the need to post it whenever a Browner topic gets started. I've got even MORE love for Browner now that my girlfriend got me a UNIQUE (Bootleg) Browner jersey for Christmas. I seriously have this grey (but not wolf grey) offshoot of the "Shadow" jersey sitting in my closet. I've gotta be honest, it's pretty sweet, despite what I thought it would look like before it arrived. I'll take some pictures of it and post them some time.

http://seafense.blogspot.com/2012/10/some-love-for-brandon-browner.html\

Browner's one of my absolute favorite Seahawks. He's sort of a Beast Mode-lite in my opinion, in that the attitude and physicality he plays with sort of sets the tone for the rest of the defense as Marshawn does for the offense. Now, he doesn't create the identity of the entire team like 'Shawn does so that's where the comparisons stop. I honestly don't think he'll be too tough to re-sign. He'll only be a restricted free agent next season and when he does become a UFA he'll be 30 years old. No spring chicken.

He'll probably be looking for his 1 (and most likely only) "big" contract in the NFL at that point. However, with his age, the odds of some teams throwing crazy money at him are kind of slim. Also, as much as I hate to entertain the possibility, it's certainly possible that his skills erode or decline by this point. At least somewhat. I hope not, but it's certainly possible. Regardless, he strikes me as the type of player that's infinitely more valuable to what Seattle's trying to do than mostly any other team in the league. Sure, the Jags could use him now since Gus Bradley might be trying to build a similar D in Jacksonville but that's about it. Big, physical corners still aren't the rage yet in the NFL although they certainly might be in 2 years time.

As far as the idea of moving him to SS is concerned, I actually love the idea and it's something I thought about after the playoff loss to the Falcons. I was kind of down on Kam after the 2 playoff games and I started thinking about the possibility of moving Kam to the WILL and Browner to SS. I think Browner would be an incredible presence at SS and wouldn't be surprised to see a move there during the later stages of his career. However, I don't see the Seahawks messing with a good thing right now and I can't blame them, so I doubt it ever happens.

The verdict? I'd venture that Browner gets a new deal next season, despite only being an RFA, that mirrors that of Clemons' this year. 3 years/21 million entering his age 30 season. Assuming he doesn't get hurt in the mean time, knock on wood.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2013 11:06 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 6:25 am 
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But, but, but... those knock-knees...

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 7:01 am 
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Didn't Browner run down AP from behind on that long run against us? He could have pulled up and let him stroll in but instead he caught him and took him down, dude plays HARD. I think he deserves a decent contract.

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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:28 am 
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dunceface wrote:
I think when it comes time to re-sign these guys they will pull a Tom Brady and be willing to take less than their market value just to keep this unit together and this team a contender


Very wishful thinking...


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:29 am 
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mikeak wrote:
OP - I get your point about front-loading so that we can re-sign Sherman after next year and RW year after that.

What you probably forgot is that you can now rollover cap space. Savin the money now allows you to use that same money next year so no need to front load. In fact it hurts you to re-sign now as you would spend more money overall.

For the person that didn't miss Browner. We plate one team that attacked the secondary at the end. How did that Chicago game go?.....pretty sure Marshall did just about what he wanted


Browner played in the Chicago game...


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 Post subject: Re: Signing Brandon Browner
 Post Posted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 4:54 pm 
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WestcoastSteve wrote:
dunceface wrote:
I think when it comes time to re-sign these guys they will pull a Tom Brady and be willing to take less than their market value just to keep this unit together and this team a contender


Very wishful thinking...


Yes it is :mrgreen:

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