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 Post subject: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:27 pm 
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Disclaimer, obviously I have no say in this matter since I am not Russell Wilson nor the offensive coordinator, but I just watched a video of RW highlights and Sidney made some ridiculous catches this season. I think one of the biggest things that could happen this off season is RW and Sidney developing more chemistry so he can truly be a #1 target for us. There were some throws this year that had no reason to be caught and he just snagged it out of the air. If they can grow together so RW doesn't need to run around in the backfield looking for a pass (even though that's one of his best talents), I don't see why he couldn't become a 10+ pass attempt per game receiver for us.

In the final few weeks of our season there were a few plays where Sidney was wiiiide open and due to pressure/not seeing him he didn't get the ball. I am hoping film studies over the offseason with the WR crew can make them a dominate force in the NFL for years to come.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:40 pm 
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Improving the pass blocking will help as well. It's amazing how little time Wilson had in the pocket at times.

Sidney was open a LOT this season. He has some of the best hands in the league.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:56 pm 
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Weird. I was going to make this same thread. Rewatching SNF Game right now. One thing I also noticed is Side gets pissed when he's wide open and gets vocal with RW, which is what I want but I couldn't help but wonder if the chemistry between them is 'off' somehow.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 8:57 pm 
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If it is I'm sure it's nothing a full off/preseason couldn't get remedied.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:12 pm 
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hgwellz12 wrote:
If it is I'm sure it's nothing a full off/preseason couldn't get remedied.


That's my hope. Sidney when healthy is a legit #1 receiver in the NFL. I hope they can get on the same page early in the off season.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:16 pm 
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Our pass protection was significantly worse than our run blocking, and the only reason our pass pro ranked in the middle of the NFL pack was because of how good Wilson is at scrambling.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:22 pm 
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Sidney led the team in targets, receptions and receiving yards. We just didn't throw the ball a lot. I'm guessing we'll throw it more in 2013.

End of thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:25 pm 
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RolandDeschain wrote:
Our pass protection was significantly worse than our run blocking, and the only reason our pass pro ranked in the middle of the NFL pack was because of how good Wilson is at scrambling.



BADA Bing!!! Can you imagine what kind of team we would have if we could "reincarnate" Walter Jones?


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:28 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:
Sidney led the team in targets, receptions and receiving yards. We just didn't throw the ball a lot. I'm guessing we'll throw it more in 2013.

End of thread.


Nice, glad we can end the thread. Thanks for your insight. My only hope is you're the offensive coordinator next year so 'guessing' we'll throw it more becomes a reality.

Radish/Absolute/J can this guy become a mod? That way anytime someone creates a thread he can put his stamp on it and then close it.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:28 pm 
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We're going to throw it more in 2013. Our staff isn't stupid, Pete only wants/wanted a run-first offense because you can build one without the near-impossible task of finding an elite QB. Good run blocking and a good RB can go a long ways. We're going to pass to open up the run starting this fall. Beast Mode may even become BM2K and hit 2,000 yards. We are going to have a ridiculous offense. Maker my words!

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:41 pm 
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mistaowen wrote:
DavidSeven wrote:
Sidney led the team in targets, receptions and receiving yards. We just didn't throw the ball a lot. I'm guessing we'll throw it more in 2013.

End of thread.


Nice, glad we can end the thread. Thanks for your insight. My only hope is you're the offensive coordinator next year so 'guessing' we'll throw it more becomes a reality.

Radish/Absolute/J can this guy become a mod? That way anytime someone creates a thread he can put his stamp on it and then close it.


What else needs to be said? Relative to the rest of the team, Sidney got his targets. Everyone and their mom expects them to throw the ball more next season, so if Sidney is still the best receiver on the team, his numbers will go up accordingly. If you have something useful to add, please, by all means, share.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:54 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:
mistaowen wrote:
DavidSeven wrote:
Sidney led the team in targets, receptions and receiving yards. We just didn't throw the ball a lot. I'm guessing we'll throw it more in 2013.

End of thread.


Nice, glad we can end the thread. Thanks for your insight. My only hope is you're the offensive coordinator next year so 'guessing' we'll throw it more becomes a reality.

Radish/Absolute/J can this guy become a mod? That way anytime someone creates a thread he can put his stamp on it and then close it.


What else needs to be said? Relative to the rest of the team, Sidney got his targets. Everyone and their mom expects them to throw the ball more next season, so if Sidney is still the best receiver on the team, his numbers will go up accordingly. If you have something useful to add, please, by all means, share.


Correct, that's why I am glad we can end the thread buddy. Lol if I have something useful to share? I made this to talk about how I watched Sidney only getting about ~3 designed targets a game and saw him make some ridiculous hand catches, aka I hope we start designing more presnap calls to him. Like I said, originally, I am not RW or the Bevell, but by observation I was HOPING we would target him more. I'm glad that in hind sight Sidney should see his numbers goes up.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 11:36 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:
If you have something useful to add, please, by all means, share.


There's no need to be a dick over internet disagreements.

Where everyone else remembers bad pass protection, I remember a ton of snaps where Wilson had five seconds to progress and took a while to find an open man, if he ever did. Part of this is no doubt his height. Part of it, I still imagine, is lack of WR talent. We are, after all, relying a very thin group, and Golden Tate and Anthony McCoy still run lazy routes too often.

I tend to think the reality is a combination of factors. Oftentimes the pass pro breaks down (though I also think Kearly is correct in his oft-stated opinion that we're actually seeing league-average pass pro and we're just spoiled by the ironclad protection from the 2005 O-line). When the pass pro doesn't break down, people aren't getting open, or aren't doing so at the right times or places or durations. Also, Wilson himself will always be the kind of guy to leave a few plays on the field, even if he is brilliant at creating new ones.

A few different moves could fix this situation. Personally, I'd prefer the route of improving our WR group, as it's pretty shallow and our OL honestly isn't.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 11:46 pm 
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MontanaHawk05 wrote:
DavidSeven wrote:
If you have something useful to add, please, by all means, share.


There's no need to be a dick over internet disagreements.

Not to derail the thread, but he was only being a dick in response to dickish comments.

I'm happy with spreading the ball around. I think we could get Rice the ball more, but I like Tate to get his touches. Dude does crazy stuff once he gets the ball. Don't forget Miller either. Not to mention if we end up drafting a guy like Hopkins or someone similar.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 2:28 am 
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You just like seeing Sidney's buttcrack


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:34 am 
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MontanaHawk05 wrote:
A few different moves could fix this situation. Personally, I'd prefer the route of improving our WR group, as it's pretty shallow and our OL honestly isn't.


A lot of good stuff in this post, but this is the part I agree with the most. Obomanu, Kearse and Martin have got to be the least talented 4, 5 and 6 in the league. Kearse may have the talent, but lacks the concentration to be more than a 4 at best. We need the infusion to take the next step.

In regards to the Rice targets, be mindful that Pete wants a "point guard" QB who is going to enable the offense by spreading it around. The best offenses (Green Bay and New Orleans) spread the ball among four receivers, their backs and tight ends. The only player on those two teams receiver wise who has caught more than 80 passes in a season was Colston mostly because he is the possession guy on third downs.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 9:45 am 
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BASF wrote:
MontanaHawk05 wrote:
A few different moves could fix this situation. Personally, I'd prefer the route of improving our WR group, as it's pretty shallow and our OL honestly isn't.


A lot of good stuff in this post, but this is the part I agree with the most. Obomanu, Kearse and Martin have got to be the least talented 4, 5 and 6 in the league. Kearse may have the talent, but lacks the concentration to be more than a 4 at best. We need the infusion to take the next step.

In regards to the Rice targets, be mindful that Pete wants a "point guard" QB who is going to enable the offense by spreading it around. The best offenses (Green Bay and New Orleans) spread the ball among four receivers, their backs and tight ends. The only player on those two teams receiver wise who has caught more than 80 passes in a season was Colston mostly because he is the possession guy on third downs.


Good points. The day of the 100 catch WR might be numbered as more and more offenses spread the ball around. Frankly, I prefer that. It increases the pressure on D knowing they have four or five guys to cover instead of just one or two. I'm not totally against drafting a good/great WR, but I also think that a WR might not be the best BPVA in the first round for us. Pete himself has said they will be looking for pass rush, and so far, he has pretty much done what he said he would do, even though we never seem to be able to guess the exact players.
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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:16 am 
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Word, Montana. For every breakdown in protection, I saw two plays where Wilson bought time and no one got open.

A few years ago, alot of people were ripping Pete, saying he just didn't understand QB's or the passing game. When in reality, the regime just stayed true to their "dont panic and reach for QB's" ideaology. It worked. The offense WILL pass more next year, no doubt.

The evolution from a Lynch to Wilson offense will begin next year. Yes, they'll still run the ball, but the pass will set up the run from now on. Holmgren had to eventually ditch his tendencies and feed SA, Pete will do the same, it just makes too much sense. It makes sense on both sides of the ball.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:43 pm 
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hgwellz12 wrote:
Weird. I was going to make this same thread. Rewatching SNF Game right now. One thing I also noticed is Side gets pissed when he's wide open and gets vocal with RW, which is what I want but I couldn't help but wonder if the chemistry between them is 'off' somehow.


This is my thought too. I mean just from my fan's perspective. It does seem like Sidney does find himself open a lot, and you find RW passing it to Tate or even running it down himself. And a big play may get made and we applaud it, but we all miss the bigger play that could have happened. You then see Sidney running with his arms wide out pissed. And yeah I can't help but wonder if there is some kind of beef between RW and SR. I mean it's obvious Tate and RW are buds cus they hang out outside of the games, and it almost seems like Tate is his Go-to guy...but at the same time SR is the bigger name receiver, he could just be covered more, which is why Tate is more open. *shrug* I'm no pro. But I like you wonder if SR and RW have some issues off the field.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:06 pm 
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DavidSeven wrote:
Sidney led the team in targets, receptions and receiving yards. We just didn't throw the ball a lot. I'm guessing we'll throw it more in 2013.


There's some truth to this. Wilson does a good job of spreading the ball around and finding his open receivers, but he's had his opportunity to make more plays to Rice. He's just more careful than other quarterbacks in when and who he throws to.

I'd like to see Russell risk a little more when throwing Sidney. Rice showed in 2009/2010 with Farve and even this year that he's capable of bailing out his QB and making some spectacular catches, so give your #1 receiver a chance to go make a play. Not forcing the ball to him, but maybe an extra 3 throws a game where Wilson says, "Here you go Sidney. Do your thing". I think the benefits of that outweigh the risks.

Edit; And this directed at you DavidSeven. Just adding to your point.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:55 pm 
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mistaowen wrote:
Disclaimer, obviously I have no say in this matter since I am not Russell Wilson nor the offensive coordinator, but I just watched a video of RW highlights and Sidney made some ridiculous catches this season. I think one of the biggest things that could happen this off season is RW and Sidney developing more chemistry so he can truly be a #1 target for us. There were some throws this year that had no reason to be caught and he just snagged it out of the air. If they can grow together so RW doesn't need to run around in the backfield looking for a pass (even though that's one of his best talents), I don't see why he couldn't become a 10+ pass attempt per game receiver for us.

In the final few weeks of our season there were a few plays where Sidney was wiiiide open and due to pressure/not seeing him he didn't get the ball. I am hoping film studies over the offseason with the WR crew can make them a dominate force in the NFL for years to come.


Getting a better defense so our offense is on the field more.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:38 pm 
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hgwellz12 wrote:
Weird. I was going to make this same thread. Rewatching SNF Game right now. One thing I also noticed is Side gets pissed when he's wide open and gets vocal with RW, which is what I want but I couldn't help but wonder if the chemistry between them is 'off' somehow.

I suspect that not only has Tate spent more time with Wilson in the past, but that he makes every effort to 'come back' when Wilson is under pressure, or that he gives his all at blocking for Wilson when he tucks the ball and runs.
This off-Season should give everyone time to work out some of the bugs in their mini-system.
Roddy White has nothing on Rice for making sensational catches, but Roddy is in a pass happy system, so of course he's going to see more targeting.
Like Flying Greg said, the Offensive Line learns how to afford Wilson just a few more seconds, and he'll have time to find Rice, or other open Recievers/Tight Ends.
You can bet that nobody's at a standstill at the V-MAC this Year, least of all Russell Wilson ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 4:50 pm 
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Too much second guessing here. Read progression is an element conveniently ignored in arguements of this nature. And a possiblity a of a sure first down vs chancy big play to a supposed "wide-open" Rice is also being conveniently ignored.
Rice is not "wide open" unless that happens early enough in the read progression, and why not go for the sure 1st down via legs or short pass if it's there? We have one of the most efficient QB's in the league for a reason. I don't want to see RW start making ill-advised, Favre-esche throws (and picks) just because Sidney is flapping his arms.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 5:45 pm 
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Sidney Rice from what I have seen doesn't give off a diva/selfish attitude at all. Selfish players don't put their bodies on the line against like Chicago like he did. Now him flapping his arms yelling at a teammate isn't something you want to see but players are human and emotions will get the best of them sometimes

Sidney wasn't cleared for full contact until preseason, and Russell got hardly any reps for most of training camp, and barely played with our starters during preseason. So not being on the same page is to be expected. With Wilson getting all the snaps during minicamps/training camp this year and working out together with our WR/TE, I expect none of this to be a problem next year.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 6:12 pm 
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HawKnPeppa wrote:
Too much second guessing here. Read progression is an element conveniently ignored in arguements of this nature. And a possiblity a of a sure first down vs chancy big play to a supposed "wide-open" Rice is also being conveniently ignored.
Rice is not "wide open" unless that happens early enough in the read progression, and why not go for the sure 1st down via legs or short pass if it's there? We have one of the most efficient QB's in the league for a reason. I don't want to see RW start making ill-advised, Favre-esche throws (and picks) just because Sidney is flapping his arms.


I see what you're saying, and you're right, but that's not to say Wilson hasn't missed any reads or taken advantage of the right reads. If Rice is running down the field on a post route with one-on-one coverage and inside position, that's an opportunity for a big play. Of course it's a risk knowing a non-perfect throw could result in Rice and the DB fighting for the ball, but because of the situation, Rice has the advantage to win that battle. I wouldn't call those ill-advised. Just a calculated risk.

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 7:34 pm 
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Sidney Rice is definitely paid like a #1 receiver in the NFL. He plays like it at times. So, the chemistry is definitely a huge part of the deal. Whatever it was between Sidney Rice and Brett Favre, during Favre's first season with the Vikings, I really hope Wilson and Rice can duplicate. That would be awesome..

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 Post subject: Re: Getting Sidney Rice the ball more
 Post Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2013 8:53 pm 
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HawKnPeppa wrote:
Too much second guessing here. Read progression is an element conveniently ignored in arguements of this nature. And a possiblity a of a sure first down vs chancy big play to a supposed "wide-open" Rice is also being conveniently ignored.
Rice is not "wide open" unless that happens early enough in the read progression, and why not go for the sure 1st down via legs or short pass if it's there? We have one of the most efficient QB's in the league for a reason. I don't want to see RW start making ill-advised, Favre-esche throws (and picks) just because Sidney is flapping his arms.


Preach it brother, preach it. One thing that should be noted is that the throws to Rice that are being advocated did start during the middle of the season. However, Sidney made a horrible decision in the Lions game diving for the ball while the Lions safety was attacking the ball at it's highest point and got the interception. Those shots to Rice started to taper off after that.

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