Comparing Harbaugh & Carroll (By Hawk Blogger)

SeahawksFanForever · Jan 25, 2013

Pete Carroll is sitting at home. Jim Harbaugh is preparing for the Super Bowl. Ask the average fan which one has done a better job in the NFL, and most would point to Harbaugh's record and roster as evidence that he is the more valuable organizational leader.

http://www.hawkblogger.com/2013/01/comp ... chise.html

Good read.

RolandDeschain · Jan 25, 2013

I've been pointing this out since Harbaugh landed in San Francisco two years ago. He inherited a supremely talented roster, and his draft picks thus far do not look to have been spectacular on an overall basis. 1st-round pick WR not playing the whole year? Wow.

Sarlacc83 · Jan 25, 2013

Good read, but something most of us already knew. Their defense, as far as I can tell, is going to give them fits in the future. Especially as Justin Smith gets older, it's really going to hurt their defensive line.

Their offense should be fine for awhile, though. The O-line is still relatively young and they have some young receivers and Kaepernick.

NinerLifer · Jan 25, 2013

The Seahawks trajectory is so much steeper than the 49ers, San Francisco better get their ring this year, because the evidence suggests it may be the last time Caroll allows them a shot.

I don't see how this is relevant. PC inherited a team like most of you said needed a lot of work, and therefore needed to do more to improve it hence the steep trajectory the blogger points out.

On the other side, JH inherited a very talented team with all the pieces in place that was just missing a good coach to lead them. Why would Harb's fix what's not broken? Again, hence the steeper trajectory of PC as the blogger points out.

So far Harbaugh hasn't shown that he can rebuild a team because he hasn't been required to do so yet. Though his decision to make the questionable switch to Kaep early in the season is something that all the analysts (so called experts) have all eaten crow over and stated that that move alone speaks TONS about his ability to recognize talent and make the appropriate roster adjustments to make his team win.

The argument can also be made, that the blogger didn't point out, that Harbs has already demonstrated that he can lead his team to the Superbowl and even possibly win it, while PC hasn't yet. Yes Harbs inherited a great team, but that same team didn't even make it to the playoffs since 2002 until Harbs showed up and took them to the NFCCG his first year, and the Superbowl in his second year.

You don't go from a losing season one year to 13-3 and make it to the NFCCG the next year without a great coach.

I'm not taking anything away from the tremendous accomplishments that PC has achieved since taking over the Hawks, as I know that the Seahawks are definitely one of the better teams in the league now that PC is at the helm.

sam1313 · Jan 25, 2013

NinerLifer":2r71rl9y said:
The Seahawks trajectory is so much steeper than the 49ers, San Francisco better get their ring this year, because the evidence suggests it may be the last time Caroll allows them a shot.

Click to expand...

I don't see how this is relevant. PC inherited a team like most of you said needed a lot of work, and therefore needed to do more to improve it hence the steep trajectory the blogger points out.

On the other side, JH inherited a very talented team with all the pieces in place that was just missing a good coach to lead them. Why would Harb's fix what's not broken? Again, hence the steeper trajectory of PC as the blogger points out.

So far Harbaugh hasn't shown that he can rebuild a team because he hasn't been required to do so yet. Though his decision to make the questionable switch to Kaep early in the season is something that all the analysts (so called experts) have all eaten crow over and stated that that move alone speaks TONS about his ability to recognize talent and make the appropriate roster adjustments to make his team win.

The argument can also be made, that the blogger didn't point out, that Harbs has already demonstrated that he can lead his team to the Superbowl and even possibly win it, while PC hasn't yet. Yes Harbs inherited a great team, but that same team didn't even make it to the playoffs since 2002 until Harbs showed up and took them to the NFCCG his first year, and the Superbowl in his second year.

You don't go from a losing season one year to 13-3 and make it to the NFCCG the next year without a great coach.

I'm not taking anything away from the tremendous accomplishments that PC has achieved since taking over the Hawks, as I know that the Seahawks are definitely one of the better teams in the league now that PC is at the helm.

I hate it when you Niner fans come here and act classy. It makes it harder to keep up my general disdain for your team and fan base. :evil:

bestfightstory · Jan 25, 2013

I've never read his blog, but I met 'Hawkblogger' in Toronto pre-Bills game this year. Seemed like a cool and thoughtful dude.

RolandDeschain · Jan 25, 2013

NinerLifer":32tr86g6 said:
You don't go from a losing season one year to 13-3 and make it to the NFCCG the next year without a great coach.

Nobody is saying Harbaugh isn't a good or great coach, but he had already set himself up to be hated by Seahawks fans before he entered NFL coaching due to Carroll already being our coach. The whole going for 2 points while up by 5 scores at the end of the 4th quarter thing in college was unarguably classless, no 49ers fan should wonder why Seahawks fans don't like Harbaugh. We can admit he knows what the hell's doing and still hate him.

NinerLifer · Jan 25, 2013

RolandDeschain":3os732li said:
NinerLifer":3os732li said:

You don't go from a losing season one year to 13-3 and make it to the NFCCG the next year without a great coach.

Click to expand...

Nobody is saying Harbaugh isn't a good or great coach, but he had already set himself up to be hated by Seahawks fans before he entered NFL coaching due to Carroll already being our coach. The whole going for 2 points while up by 5 scores at the end of the 4th quarter thing in college was unarguably classless, no 49ers fan should wonder why Seahawks fans don't like Harbaugh. We can admit he knows what the hell's doing and still hate him.

I completely agree, and don't question the reason why Hawks fans hate Harbaugh. The reason why some of us Niner fans don't let that effect our opinion of him is due to the fact that we have been subjected to a LONG period of coaches who were content with getting up by 7-10 points and then pump the brakes offensively and start calling a conservative game, which worked less than half the time each season, hence our losing records that we endured. Having a coach with a killer instinct is something we have begged for for a very long time.

Perhaps it is my level of understanding that allows me to post on here without going full retard over every Niner hate filled post I read. I wouldn't expect anything less from a rivals MB, as Niner MB's are filled with Hawk hate as well. It's all relative!

PC is obviously a great coach, and thanks to him and Harbs, and maybe even Fisher, the NFCW is now the toughest division in the NFL! You guys have to agree that it feels good to no longer be referred to as the "NFC Worst".

RolandDeschain · Jan 25, 2013

Random note about Fisher; that team scares me if Bradford can step another level up, particularly with all those draft picks they have coming. Hell, their D-line already scares me. Our division might send three teams to the playoffs next year.

Also, damned right it feels good for our division to be respected. I still want you to get blown out by the Ravens in 9 days, though.

NinerLifer · Jan 25, 2013

RolandDeschain":1za2s2re said:
Random note about Fisher; that team scares me if Bradford can step another level up, particularly with all those draft picks they have coming. Hell, their D-line already scares me. Our division might send three teams to the playoffs next year.

Also, damned right it feels good for our division to be respected. I still want you to get blown out by the Ravens in 9 days, though.

But of course!

hawker84 · Jan 25, 2013

Curious Ninerlifer.. how did it make you feel to see your coach throw the tantrum on the sideline? be honest...

that and the fact he is a documented A hole from ex players , ex team mates and just the way he carries himself on camera is why i do not care for him.. Great coach no doubt, but his character is what turns me negative towards him.

granted Carroll has his moments too.. oh and i too want to see you suffer a miserable SB loss...

NinerLifer · Jan 25, 2013

hawker84":aaw06t3a said:
Curious Ninerlifer.. how did it make you feel to see your coach throw the tantrum on the sideline? be honest...

that and the fact he is a documented A hole from ex players , ex team mates and just the way he carries himself on camera is why i do not care for him.. Great coach no doubt, but his character is what turns me negative towards him.

granted Carroll has his moments too.. oh and i too want to see you suffer a miserable SB loss...

In all honesty I didn't like seeing him throw himself like that, even though I did the EXACT same thing at the same moment LOL. But that type of behavior should be reserved for the fans, but I love seeing the passion he has for winning. Again it is easy to forgive his negative behavioral qualities since he has in exchange given us so much more. I don't have any problem with how he treats the media. He knows that the NFL is a big chess game and you need to think 3 moves ahead and not give away all your secrets. Something our previous coaches didn't understand. I can still remember Singletary when he first took over as HC in a press conference telling the media "We will ride behind #21 and run the ball down their throats!" And the ensuing season we saw how running 3 downs in a row and then punting over and over again didn't work out so well. I'm not saying that it would have worked if he didn't announce that we were going to design our offense around Frank because after all Dingleberry was an idiot, but giving away your game plan during a press conference is just stupid.

Personally I am comforted by how serious Jim is taking our Superbowl matchup, while his brother is publicly goofing around and seems more relaxed. Of course I expect John to have one hell of a game plan ready on February 3rd, but us Niner fans know that Harbaugh is an evil genius and when given 2 weeks to prepare for a game, it has always been spectacular to watch it! I am sure Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy can agree.

DavidSeven · Jan 25, 2013

They've both done what's been asked of them, and I'll give Harbaugh his due credit for being able to coach up young QBs, but Carroll certainly took on a much more difficult project. There's no denying that.

Can't remember a coaching rivalry that I felt was as intense as the one between these two guys. This is going to be fun for a long time.

JGfromtheNW · Jan 25, 2013

DavidSeven":1fo5ngn3 said:
They've both done what's been asked of them, and I'll give Harbaugh his due credit for being able to coach up young QBs, but Carroll certainly took on a much more difficult project. There's no denying that.

Can't remember a coaching rivalry that I felt was as intense as the one between these two guys. This is going to be fun for a long time.

I am with you on that one. With PC and Douchebaugh's history of USC v. Stanford and the rivalry that is the Seahawks v. 49ers, it's going to be really fun to watch these two teams over the next couple years. They seem to go back and forth on who has the better gameplan. The Seahawks have been improving noticibly v. the 49ers over the past two seasons so it's going to be interesting to see what happens in year 4 of Project Pete

RolandDeschain · Jan 25, 2013

NinerLifer":1is13dvi said:
In all honesty I didn't like seeing him throw himself like that, even though I did the EXACT same thing at the same moment LOL.

You and I don't have moral turpitude clauses in our employment contracts that require us to act like an adult and represent our employer professionally, though.

NinerLifer":1is13dvi said:
Harbaugh is an evil genius and when given 2 weeks to prepare for a game, it has always been spectacular to watch it!

Easy there, cowboy. You guys tied the Rams after your bye this year, and you put a whopping 20 points up against a horrible Cleveland team after your bye last year. Harbaugh's a long ways from proving dominance with two weeks of planning.

drdiags · Jan 25, 2013

One thing pointed out by this article regarding McCloughan, you can see that Baalke hasn't been too shabby in keeping the talent level flowing into their team:

There is no understating the work McCloughan's successor, Trent Baalke, has done in building a Super Bowl contender. Baalke's 2011 draft produced, in order, linebacker Aldon Smith, quarterback Colin Kaepernick, cornerback Chris Culliver, running back Kendall Hunter and fullback Bruce Miller. It's comparable to the team's celebrated 1981 and 1986 drafts that helped produce, and then sustain, San Francisco's former dynasty.

Still, 11 of the team's 22 starters were acquired when McCloughan ran the personnel department, including five of the 49ers' nine Pro Bowl selections this year: Dashon Goldson, Frank Gore, Justin Smith, Joe Staley and Patrick Willis.

Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/2013/01/25/513995 ... rylink=cpy

I think the talk of their imminent demise may be premature. Unfortunately only time will tell whether the Seahawks are on the fast track and the 9ers are slipping.

RolandDeschain · Jan 25, 2013

It's simply too early to tell if Harbaugh can build or maintain a team's talent level. I'd say we won't really know for 3 more seasons, possibly more, based on the personnel they have from the prior regimes and the ages of those players right now. Harbaugh has a ton of time to find replacements for all the good players, though; that's for sure. So, there's no excuse for him to not get it done.

MontanaHawk05 · Jan 25, 2013

I agree with NinerLifer. Comparing Carroll to Harbaugh as organizational leaders is an apples-to-oranges comparison at this point precisely because they haven't been asked to accomplish the same things. The article reaches a bit to establish Harbaugh as already failing at the rebuilding process. Definitely a homer piece.

NinerLifer · Jan 25, 2013

drdiags":2zxwpt94 said:
One thing pointed out by this article regarding McCloughan, you can see that Baalke hasn't been too shabby in keeping the talent level flowing into their team:

There is no understating the work McCloughan's successor, Trent Baalke, has done in building a Super Bowl contender. Baalke's 2011 draft produced, in order, linebacker Aldon Smith, quarterback Colin Kaepernick, cornerback Chris Culliver, running back Kendall Hunter and fullback Bruce Miller. It's comparable to the team's celebrated 1981 and 1986 drafts that helped produce, and then sustain, San Francisco's former dynasty.

Still, 11 of the team's 22 starters were acquired when McCloughan ran the personnel department, including five of the 49ers' nine Pro Bowl selections this year: Dashon Goldson, Frank Gore, Justin Smith, Joe Staley and Patrick Willis.

Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/2013/01/25/513995 ... rylink=cpy

Click to expand...

I think the talk of their imminent demise may be premature. Unfortunately only time will tell whether the Seahawks are on the fast track and the 9ers are slipping.

Again why would Trent replace talent that is on the field that is superior to most of those at the same position on other teams? That would have gotten him fired LOL! Baalke brought in Harbaugh, which based on his first 2 years, is a huge talent acquisition for our team.

Again, you don't fix what isn't broken. Apples & oranges like stated above, which makes that yet another irrelevant statement by the author of that blog.

drdiags · Jan 25, 2013

NinerLifer":2beaf1tf said:
drdiags":2beaf1tf said:

One thing pointed out by this article regarding McCloughan, you can see that Baalke hasn't been too shabby in keeping the talent level flowing into their team:

There is no understating the work McCloughan's successor, Trent Baalke, has done in building a Super Bowl contender. Baalke's 2011 draft produced, in order, linebacker Aldon Smith, quarterback Colin Kaepernick, cornerback Chris Culliver, running back Kendall Hunter and fullback Bruce Miller. It's comparable to the team's celebrated 1981 and 1986 drafts that helped produce, and then sustain, San Francisco's former dynasty.

Still, 11 of the team's 22 starters were acquired when McCloughan ran the personnel department, including five of the 49ers' nine Pro Bowl selections this year: Dashon Goldson, Frank Gore, Justin Smith, Joe Staley and Patrick Willis.

Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/2013/01/25/513995 ... rylink=cpy

Click to expand...

I think the talk of their imminent demise may be premature. Unfortunately only time will tell whether the Seahawks are on the fast track and the 9ers are slipping.

Click to expand...

Again why would Trent replace talent that is on the field that is superior to most of those at the same position on other teams? That would have gotten him fired LOL! Baalke brought in Harbaugh, which based on his first 2 years, is a huge talent acquisition for our team.

Again, you don't fix what isn't broken. Apples & oranges like stated above, which makes that yet another irrelevant statement by the author of that blog.

I guess I am agreeing with you so not sure if you are using my post as a soapbox or whether you are refuting some imagined slight on my part?

Comparing Harbaugh & Carroll (By Hawk Blogger)

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