Flynn to Jax?

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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:27 am
  • Jared Stanger over at Field Gulls also has a good article up on the idea of trading Flynn. He brings up some excellent points -- namely ...

    1) Trading Flynn would create between $8-13 Million in value that could be used elsewhere in adding needed Free Agents.

    2) Flynn's contract is actually a fairly reasonable one -- especially if you're talking about a starting QB.

    3) Overall, this is a very weak draft class for quarterbacks -- there many be no better time to cash in on and maximize Flynn's value to another team than now.

    4) Though we've heard commentators like John Clayton talk many times about how Flynn would fetch nothing more than a 7th Round pick ... history says that teams tend to overpay for quarterbacks. Just a few names from recent history ...

    (2006) Baltimore traded a 4th Round Pick to the Titans for Steve McNair (who was 33 at the time)

    (2008) Kansas City traded a high 2nd Round Pick (#34) to the Patriots to get Matt Cassell and LB Matt Vrabel.

    (2010) we traded a 3rd Round Pick to San Diego for Charlie Whitehurst

    (2011) Oakland traded a 1st AND 2nd Round Pick to the Bengals for Carson Palmer (who was also 33 at the time)

    Whether we're talking about deals for guys like these ... or draft choices like Blaine Gabbert, Mark Sanchez, Christian Ponder, Ryan Fitzpatrick, and tons of others throughout the years ... teams have a propensity for overpaying for quarterbacks.

    Therefore, I have to agree with the overall sentiment that some team out there will be willing to overpay for Flynn as well. Personally, I'm thinking that a 3rd Round Choice for Flynn sounds about right.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:28 am
  • Why do we think anyone would trade for him when nobody else even wanted to sign him last year? We think losing his starting job and sitting on the bench all year somehow makes him more valuable? I don't get it.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:28 am
  • SacHawk2.0 wrote:Gus knows what he can do, and he's pretty clearly ahead of anyone else in Jax. Draft crop for QBs isn't stellar and we're in a win now league?

    Do you thing Gus will make a trade for Flynn?

    I think he will relie on his OC team to advise him. Flynn may not be what the want to do with their offense. Gus is a D guy. Like Carroll he will be going on O input to help him.

    Also he does not have the situation like Pete does with his GM. If the GM doesnt want Flynn it wont matter what Gus wants.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:29 am
  • Any chance the hiring of Bradley will AT LEAST prevent the Jags road games from being blacked out? No way it *affects* their home games.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:33 am
  • HawkFan72 wrote:
    CANHawk wrote:
    CodeWarrior wrote:Of course Gus would have to go to a franchise entirely bereft of pass rushing talent. That's right, Jax finished DEAD LAST in the NFL in sacks during the regular season at a pathetic 20. Alualu was their sack leader, recording a whopping 3.5 sacks...

    Still, I'll take that from a DT.


    I don't profess to watch a ton of Jags games (just like most people in Jacksonville <rimshot>) but Alualu looks like he brings a TON of pressure up the middle. We need that (desperately) and at 295 he's big enough to play 3 downs and stuff the run.

    I'd be thrilled to hear we worked out some kind of trade involving Flynn for Alualu.


    I'm pretty sure that Gus, being a defensive guy, wouldn't go for it. He knows who the best players on the D are there and he's not going to trade one of them away.


    Maybe so, but Gus isn't calling the shots. He didn't get "Pete Carroll level" control down there. JAX is having a huge attendance problem down there and what's one of the easiest ways to instil false hope in the fanbase and get some tickets sold? Wheel in a saviour QB. Flynn has all those highlights from those two games in GB they could show on TV to try and sell some tickets.

    This is the same franchise with the owner who says he'd love to have Tebow and the GM that says he has no intention of trading for him. That has future discunction written ALL OVER it. I wonder what the behind the scenes conversations sound like down there? Trading for a totally different quarterback might be a way for the GM to get the owner off his back on the Tebow front.

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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:34 am
  • entropyrulesall wrote:
    Hawkfan77 wrote:
    SeahawksFanForever wrote:Matt Flynn to Jax and I would like us to draft Matt Barkley with the 25th overall pick of this draft.

    Did you forget the :sarcasm_off: at the end of your statement?



    No he must have been reading Hawk Blogger. It's an interesting idea but not for our Superbowl caliber team. http://www.hawkblogger.com/2013/01/early-thoughts-on-trading-matt-flynn.html?m=1


    I think Hawkblogger is VASTLY overrating and overvaluing Flynn.

    And I don't like the idea of drafting and developing Barkley just to try and trade him away for a "higher pick." Considering that we'd probably have to spend our 1st rounder on him, that makes it difficult to fetch a more valuable package for him down the road. I can get behind drafting a QB for development in the middle rounds, but not in the 1st, no matter how big Carroll's "mancrush" on Barkley is.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:39 am
  • Hawkstorian wrote:Why do we think anyone would trade for him when nobody else even wanted to sign him last year? We think losing his starting job and sitting on the bench all year somehow makes him more valuable? I don't get it.


    Because few teams needed him the year that an elite QB class was available in the draft. Flynn is one of the few candidates available whose stock has remained the same this year, at the very worst, or even slightly improved since he handled the year and frustration of not starting with class.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:59 am
  • Hawkstorian wrote:Why do we think anyone would trade for him when nobody else even wanted to sign him last year? We think losing his starting job and sitting on the bench all year somehow makes him more valuable? I don't get it.


    It's basic Supply and Demand here. Let's take a brief whizz around the NFL and just list off how many teams are really in the need for a quarterback ...

    Kansas City
    Jacksonville
    Philadelphia (it's highly unlikely that Vick is back in 2013. Foles might be the guy, but maybe not)
    Arizona
    NY Jets
    Minnesota (I'm not sold on Ponder at all and Webb as a backup -- oof!)

    Those are just 6 that I listed off the top of my head who could legitimately be looking for help for starting QB help. Now, the issue here (which could really favor Seattle) is that Supply-wise, there's really aren't a ton of guys out there who you could look at as potential starters.

    In terms of the draft, you're basically talking about Geno Smith and Matt Barkley (whom I would sit ideally, but he could handle starting IMO.) Looking up and down the draft board, I'm really not seeing anyone else who could really step in right away (I don't know that I see a Russell Wilson in this class).

    On the Free Agent side of things, I'm going to first of all assume that Joe Flacco isn't going anywhere. So, take him off the list. That leaves the following guys out there in the market:

    Jason Campbell
    Tavaris Jackson
    Matt Moore
    Drew Stanton
    Seneca Wallace

    If I'm one of those teams, I'm looking at the available list of Free Agents ... and looking at what's available through the draft and I'm asking myself, "Would a 3rd or 4th Round Choice make sense for a Matt Flynn?" Given what's available out there and the fact that his contract isn't overwhelming by any means, my answer probably would be -- Yes. Therefore, I'd be looking for some team to seriously come kicking the tires on him this offseason.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:03 am
  • To pile on scanner's post, KC makes immediate sense. I could throw for 2,500 and 18 TD's under Reid, pretty sure Flynn would thrive there. That's a talented team, in a poor division, with a great running game. Add Flynn, and you're at 8 wins, MINIMUM.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:06 am
  • pehawk wrote:To pile on scanner's post, KC makes immediate sense. I could throw for 2,500 and 18 TD's under Reid, pretty sure Flynn would thrive there. That's a talented team, in a poor division, with a great running game. Add Flynn, and you're at 8 wins, MINIMUM.


    That was my thinking earlier, and if you're talking compensation in whatever round, KC's going to trump everyone else each time (though Jax would be close).

    I wonder, though, how reticent the Jags would be about spending a mid-round pick (3rd or so) on Flynn only 2 years after spending a top 10 pick on Gabbert?
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:10 am
  • If I was the Jags, I wouldn't. I'm in the minority here, but Henne has a stronger arm and is equal to, or better than Flynn, anyways. What's the point? Caldwell aint doing it.

    I'm having all sorts of fantasies about the Chiefs (only one involves Reid's stache). If the Hawks REALLY want Richardson, a swap of 1st, Flynn and a 2nd maybe enough.

    KC doesn't need to get younger, they're already ALL under 30 with talent galore.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:19 am
  • I can't believe how people tend to devalue Flynn.
    1. There is a high demand for QB this year with very little help in the draft.
    2. Flynn is a known quantity
    3. Swapping places in the 1st or 2nd round is a plausible trade value
    4. At minimum, Matt Flynn, a starting caliber QB is worth a 3rd rounder, especially with his reasonable contract.
    5. There are teams whose window does not allow for them to bring a QB up to speed and none of the QBs except for Barkley are ready to come in and start right away.
    6. As mentioned above, history shows that teams are willing to give up good draft picks for QBs. Hell, they will give up 4th and 5th rounders for Tim Tebow and Josh Wilson!
    7. Teams that could use a new QB
    Buffalo
    Jets
    Browns
    Jaguars
    KC
    Raiders
    Eagles
    Cardinals

    8. Teams that need a good backup QB
    Miami
    Titans
    Dallas
    Bears!
    Vikings
    Panthers
    Tampa Bay (Freeman could use a good benching)

    Personally, I think Flynn is worth someone moving back in the 1st round in order to get him. Or a mid-late 2nd round pick straight up. And if Clayton thinks he is only worth a 7th, then he's losing it.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:26 am
  • pehawk wrote:To pile on scanner's post, KC makes immediate sense. I could throw for 2,500 and 18 TD's under Reid, pretty sure Flynn would thrive there. That's a talented team, in a poor division, with a great running game. Add Flynn, and you're at 8 wins, MINIMUM.

    Yeah if he goes anywhere I believe it'll be KC. He's an excellent fit for Reid's nearly pure west coast offense. I'll say now if it comes down, we get their 4th for him which of course is the 2nd pick in that round so almost a late 3rd.

    As for Jacksonville, the owner will install Tebow as the starter to sell tix IMO. It'll fail miserably because Tebow is not an NFL QB and Gus will be starting all over again next year. For Bradley's sake I do hope I'm wrong.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:34 am
  • I think Reid would want to draft and nurture his own QB. After the Casell signing and eventual failure, the new GM and HC would need to be sensitive to the fanbase and ownership's previous experience. If it is something Reid wants, I am sure he won't get much grief but I think he would rather develop his own. Then again he was involved in the Vick signing, so what do I know?

    I am not sure Jags GM Caldwell would want to make signing Flynn his first player related move. Henne was going to be in the mix if Mularkey remained, wonder what the owner's feel is on bringing in a 3rd QB. Tough deal with Gabbert having issues getting established with the club.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:34 am
  • Also, let's not forget about Alex Smith possibly jacking up the market for Flynn.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:38 am
  • Hawkstorian wrote:Why do we think anyone would trade for him when nobody else even wanted to sign him last year? We think losing his starting job and sitting on the bench all year somehow makes him more valuable? I don't get it.


    Damn it Hawkstorian, you're smarter than that. The QB market last year was the oddest EVER. Manning and the class of '83 revisited, w/ the #2 pick on the block. Every team thought they could get a franchise 1st rounder, under the rookie CBA rules, Flynn didn't stand a chance.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:44 am
  • drdiags wrote:I think Reid would want to draft and nurture his own QB. After the Casell signing and eventual failure, the new GM and HC would need to be sensitive to the fanbase and ownership's previous experience. If it is something Reid wants, I am sure he won't get much grief but I think he would rather develop his own. Then again he was involved in the Vick signing, so what do I know?

    I am not sure Jags GM Caldwell would want to make signing Flynn his first player related move. Henne was going to be in the mix if Mularkey remained, wonder what the owner's feel is on bringing in a 3rd QB. Tough deal with Gabbert having issues getting established with the club.

    You know plenty and your point about Reid is a good one. Still I can see Flynn as a bridge type so Reid can nurture his own guy along since Matt is a good fit for Andy's offense. Plus he actually could develop into something more than stopgap in that system IMO so it's win/win. As for the fans, you sell them on him as the 'right fit here but not in Seattle' and 'we plan on drafting a young guy and bringing him along' and so on and so forth. Maybe not and maybe I'm just wishful thinking but because he's such a good fit in that type of offense it makes a great deal of sense and damn it, I'm stubbornly clinging to this until it does or doesn't happen. :D
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:48 am
  • I like the idea HFSD1 of the Reid selling point for Matt as a bridge until he can get his program established. Sort of like Pederson (I think) before McNabb was ready to take over (if my memory is correct of the early Eagles transition to McNabb).
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:48 am
  • Reid AINT going to draft a high pick QB. Why would he? This is a dude thats made; Vick, Foles, Garcia, Kolb and even KAFKA good QB's. It'd be like investing a high draft pick at OL for Cable.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:55 am
  • drdiags wrote:I think Reid would want to draft and nurture his own QB. After the Casell signing and eventual failure, the new GM and HC would need to be sensitive to the fanbase and ownership's previous experience. If it is something Reid wants, I am sure he won't get much grief but I think he would rather develop his own. Then again he was involved in the Vick signing, so what do I know?



    Very true, but Flynn could be an excellent bridge quarterback in KC while that Andy Reid developmental quarterback of the future erm... develops. Flynn is ready to start right now. He was ready to start last year, but divine intervention delivered Russell Wilson to us. That pure west coast system Andy uses was taylor made for a guy like Matt Flynn. Matt Flynn could be Matt Hasselbeck 2.0 in a system like that.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:04 pm
  • I want Flynn to be traded for his own sake. He gotta get a chance to start somewhere.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:07 pm
  • Given the Supply and Demand Issue (the fact that there aren't a lot of decent starting QB's out there), Matt Flynn getting traded this offseason makes FAR too sense. This is one that I'm basically taking to the bank and saying that this is going to happen.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 12:09 pm
  • Hawkscanner wrote:Given the Supply and Demand Issue (the fact that there aren't a lot of decent starting QB's out there), Matt Flynn getting traded this offseason makes FAR too sense. This is one that I'm basically taking to the bank and saying that this is going to happen.


    Poor Traumahawk and his new Matt Flynn Seahawks jersey...
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:28 pm
  • I'd say KC, Jacksonville, Buffalo, and NYJ would all be contenders for a QB trade. Geno Smith will go to one of the four teams, and the Jets seemed married to Flynn. I think we will likely end up getting a top 5 pick in the 3rd round for him.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:55 pm
  • pehawk wrote:Reid AINT going to draft a high pick QB. Why would he? This is a dude thats made; Vick, Foles, Garcia, Kolb and even KAFKA good QB's. It'd be like investing a high draft pick at OL for Cable.


    Uh...isn't a first round pick for Carpenter a "high draft pick"?
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:59 pm
  • And let's not forget the nfc east trade of a washed up McNabb for a 4th round pick...
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:00 pm
  • pehawk wrote:Reid AINT going to draft a high pick QB. Why would he? This is a dude thats made; Vick, Foles, Garcia, Kolb and even KAFKA good QB's. It'd be like investing a high draft pick at OL for Cable.


    McNabb? :2:
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:11 pm
  • Son of a... we probably aren't retaining Branch now.

    On the positive side, I think this topic is on to something. Jacksonville NEEDS a QB, and they may not love this year's options. Why not trade for Flynn on the cheap? He'd be at worst a middle of the road starter that could keep the seat warm while you figure out who your long term starter is. When Mangini went to Cleveland he targeted a lot of Jets players to bring with him. Makes a lot of sense.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:50 pm
  • T-Sizzle wrote:
    pehawk wrote:Reid AINT going to draft a high pick QB. Why would he? This is a dude thats made; Vick, Foles, Garcia, Kolb and even KAFKA good QB's. It'd be like investing a high draft pick at OL for Cable.


    McNabb? :2:


    McNabb was when he first got there. Well after he made hey with the list of of also-rans and whos I listed. Wasn't it his first pick? C'mon.

    Carpenter was a pick Seattle really didn't want. And, that was before maybe even Cable realized how good he is.

    The Cable thing isn't just me. I did hear Rang mention last year that there would be no way the Hawks would consider DeCastro because "Cable can make anyone good, so why?"
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:05 pm
  • ivotuk wrote:I can't believe how people tend to devalue Flynn.
    1. There is a high demand for QB this year with very little help in the draft. There was high demand last year, and his market was ice cold.
    2. Flynn is a known quantity. Perhaps in Green Bay. I don't think anyone has any idea what he'd look like without GB's receivers (probably a pancake), but last year's market gives us a hint.
    3. Swapping places in the 1st or 2nd round is a plausible trade value I think a 6th rounder at most is plausible trade value
    4. At minimum, Matt Flynn, a starting caliber QB is worth a 3rd rounder, especially with his reasonable contract. He needs to prove himself a starting caliber QB first.
    5. There are teams whose window does not allow for them to bring a QB up to speed and none of the QBs except for Barkley are ready to come in and start right away. True, but even if the young QB's this year aren't perfect, they've probably still got more name recognition and ticket-selling vibe around them that Matt Flynn.
    6. As mentioned above, history shows that teams are willing to give up good draft picks for QBs. Hell, they will give up 4th and 5th rounders for Tim Tebow and Josh Wilson! And Deion Branch. No doubt teams get stupid. This remains the primary hope of Flynn getting us more than a 7th. But there are always desperate teams every year.
    7. Teams that could use a new QB
    Buffalo
    Jets They're stuck with Sanchez and might like McElroy as a cheap stopgap while they slog out of cap hell
    Browns They might or might not give up on Weeden so quick
    Jaguars
    KC Barkley
    Raiders
    Eagles Between Vick and Foles, they might not be looking, but new coach does suggest new QB.
    Cardinals See Eagles. But keep in mind, last year several teams were just as desperate, and still nobody cared for Flynn. It's hard to get around that.

    8. Teams that need a good backup QB are not going to give up anything more than a 7th to get him.
    Miami
    Titans
    Dallas
    Bears!
    Vikings
    Panthers
    Tampa Bay (Freeman could use a good benching)

    Personally, I think Flynn is worth someone moving back in the 1st round in order to get him. Or a mid-late 2nd round pick straight up. And if Clayton thinks he is only worth a 7th, then he's losing it.


    I'm sorry, I just see this as wishful thinking. Why are we just so plaintively desperate for an extra 2nd-3rd round pick when we do so well with our 5ths?
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:09 pm
  • Montana - you lost me when you fail to understand the difference between the 2012 and 2013 QB market. Really, c'mon, you're smarter than that.

    Again, we're dealing with a rookie CBA + the damn class of 1983 all over again + the #2 pick on the block + Peyton Manning, etc. Flynn stood NO chance. You know that.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:09 pm
  • 100% agree with you Montana. When has Flynn established himself as a known quantity and a starting caliber QB? His big games in GB established himself as a guy who deserved a shot at a starting job, but he didn't win that (granted Russ is amazing), but he's no better off than he was.

    I just don't see where he went from "teams aren't even bringing him in for a look see" to "teams are willing to give a high pick".
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:17 pm
  • pehawk wrote:Montana - you lost me when you fail to understand the difference between the 2012 and 2013 QB market. Really, c'mon, you're smarter than that.

    Again, we're dealing with a rookie CBA + the damn class of 1983 all over again + the #2 pick on the block + Peyton Manning, etc. Flynn stood NO chance. You know that.


    That still doesn't automatically ensure that some team is going to pay a second-rounder for a five-year backup with a weak arm, limited mobility, and experience in a strictly pass-first offense. It's not a terribly electrifying profile for fans or coordinators, even on desperate teams. His own offensive coordinator in Miami yawned at him. I don't think I'm being crazy here.

    The difference between the 2012 and 2013 QB market is the difference between Flynn fetching a 7th rounder to fetching MAYBE a conditional 5th, IMO. The QB market is just one piece of the puzzle - Flynn's the other piece. Whether it's for our own QB hopes or now just our hopes of extra draft picks, this board continues to overrate Flynn's quality and I just don't understand why.

    Besides, with this front office, a mere 5th-rounder could be the next Richard Sherman. So why strain yourself arguing for a 2nd-rounder? :mrgreen:
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:22 pm
  • Oh, I totally agree with the draft pick range. Totally.

    But, last year was a once every 25 years type offseason for QB's in FA.

    And, why wouldn't have Philbin yawned at him? At that price, with a high draft pick (under new rookie cap), in a rebuilding year. I think its dumb anyone expected them to make a play for Flynn.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:32 pm
  • Montana, the OC in Miami was also Tannehill's college coach. So, there is that. Tannehill allowed him to not teach a new QB his entire system.

    I think you know I don't over rate Flynn's quality. But desperation creates strange bedfellows. And Jacksonville and a few other teams are desperate. Do you think Arizona thought Flynn looked pretty damn good about halfway through last season?

    I have been consistent in saying that with 10 picks, we don't need more picks. But with our 25/26 spot in the draft next to Green Bay, who shares some of our needs at DT, WR, TE, Flynn might be the trade piece to jump up a few spots. His value doesn't have to be an actual pick.

    Or, his value might be a 2014 conditional pick. Which allows the trading team to add a round, allows us to get a higher pick if he hits some performance marks, and everyobody is happy.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:44 pm
  • I know this sounds NUTS. But is it really THAT far fetched to think the Hawks could swap with KC in round 1, with a cost of Flynn and a 2nd or 3rd?
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:47 pm
  • pehawk wrote:I know this sounds NUTS. But is it really THAT far fetched to think the Hawks could swap with KC in round 1, with a cost of Flynn and a 2nd or 3rd?


    Depends how much Reid likes Flynn. It's not that far-fetched since there are no QBs worthy of that spot for KC. If they are planning to trade down anyway, that type of option could be intriguing for them because they would add their QB, plus have a 1st rounder still in addition to an extra pick.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:48 pm
  • pehawk wrote:I know this sounds NUTS. But is it really THAT far fetched to think the Hawks could swap with KC in round 1, with a cost of Flynn and a 2nd or 3rd?


    Why is what I ask myself. What do you want that high up in this draft that you are willing to give up a 2nd or 3rd rounder plus Flynn?

    This draft has depth - this draft does not have elite talent easily spotted (saying there may be elite players coming out of the draft but none is standing out right now)

    First few picks will mean $20 million over three years so you gain nothing in regards to the cap......
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:50 pm
  • HawkFan72 wrote:
    pehawk wrote:I know this sounds NUTS. But is it really THAT far fetched to think the Hawks could swap with KC in round 1, with a cost of Flynn and a 2nd or 3rd?


    Depends how much Reid likes Flynn. It's not that far-fetched since there are no QBs worthy of that spot for KC. If they are planning to trade down anyway, that type of option could be intriguing for them because they would add their QB, plus have a 1st rounder still in addition to an extra pick.


    Dudes..... that won't happen. The #1 pick has too much "value" for that deal to ever take place. Look at the value charts.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:52 pm
  • Well, Reid's made lessor QB's SHINE. And, IMO, that's an 8 win team, with a mediocre QB. Flynn's at least that.

    For the record, I'm not shooting for the moon, for the sake of it. I see KC as the only real trading partner (no to Jax because Henne's cheaper and just as good). And, at DT, there's only 2 impact types. And, they'll be gone within 6 picks.

    But, please note, I'm a draft moron. I know NOTHING about draft charts or prospects. So, feel free to call me a nutter.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:10 pm
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:Whether it's for our own QB hopes or now just our hopes of extra draft picks, this board continues to overrate Flynn's quality and I just don't understand why.


    Pretty simple. They're fans. Be it Matt Flynn or Charlie Whitehurst, they want to believe they have unearthed the next big find. Had Flynn signed with Arizona, the exact same fans would have downplayed his two starts in GB. But he signed here, so those two games meant the world. Exact same rationale applies to his trade value. Whatever fits the best interests of the Hawks is where the thinking goes. Of course our backup qb is the only option for teams that need a starter. And of course this draft class is now considered one of the worst ever. lol. It's what fans do.
    Last edited by SeaTown81 on Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:11 pm
  • T-Sizzle wrote:
    HawkFan72 wrote:
    pehawk wrote:I know this sounds NUTS. But is it really THAT far fetched to think the Hawks could swap with KC in round 1, with a cost of Flynn and a 2nd or 3rd?


    Depends how much Reid likes Flynn. It's not that far-fetched since there are no QBs worthy of that spot for KC. If they are planning to trade down anyway, that type of option could be intriguing for them because they would add their QB, plus have a 1st rounder still in addition to an extra pick.


    Dudes..... that won't happen. The #1 pick has too much "value" for that deal to ever take place. Look at the value charts.


    Seriously some generic chart would be more important than what applies this specific draft.

    KC is right now projected to take Geno Smith who really didn't end the season very well. So would you rather pay $22 million to Geno for the next 3-4 years or get Flynn with a $7 million contract / year and you are only committing yourself to two years and if he is great fine re-sign him next year at least that is worth it.

    If I am picking a qb in the first round THIS YEAR then I am much rather picking up Flynn. Last year - HECK NO

    With that said I still question why Seahawks would want hte number 1 pick. There is nobody there worth the money. You offer us the 10th and 11th pick of the draft and that is way more interesting to me.

    EDIT: Oh wait forgot about Jones - if they love him then he fits the need :D
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:18 pm
  • People are acting downright ridiculous about this year's qb draft class. So what if they don't hold a candle to last year? What year does? So now all the teams are just going to throw their hands up and avoid the top ranked qb's with reasonable upside in favor of backups? It doesn't matter how epic the draft class is. QB's always get overdrafted in the 1st round due to need. It's just about as close to a universal truth as you're going to get. You will almost always have 3 to 5 qb's going in the first round. Teams draft on a relative scale. Just the way it is. Draft history is filled with qb's drafted higher than the mock experts predicted.

    And it's just not the 1st round where team's try to find their guy. Wilson in the 3rd round, Dalton in the 2nd, Kaepernick in the 2nd. A lot of the teams people think have no choice but to trade for Flynn will consider looking for a guy to groom in those rounds. Actually that's where I feel Flynn's value comes into play. A team that takes a rookie qb in the 2nd or so, kinda like us last year with Wilson, who wants a guy to play in the interim.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 4:41 pm
  • So Flynn is unproven? How unproven was Kolb when AZ gave up a King's ransom for him? Flynn has shown way better than Kolb ever did. Look at it any way you want, but I don't see how people can say Flynn is only worth a 6th or a 7th round pick but teams will pay a 1st or a 2nd for QBs like Ponder and Dalton.

    I see us getting a minimum of a 3rd round pick, unless it's a 4th and other considerations.

    Edit; ANd there is absolutely ZERO comparison between this year's QB options and last years. Just because he didn't sign somewhere else last year, it in no way indicates his value in 2013.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:02 pm
  • ivotuk wrote:So Flynn is unproven? How unproven was Kolb when AZ gave up a King's ransom for him? Flynn has shown way better than Kolb ever did. Look at it any way you want, but I don't see how people can say Flynn is only worth a 6th or a 7th round pick but teams will pay a 1st or a 2nd for QBs like Ponder and Dalton.

    I see us getting a minimum of a 3rd round pick, unless it's a 4th and other considerations.

    Edit; ANd there is absolutely ZERO comparison between this year's QB options and last years. Just because he didn't sign somewhere else last year, it in no way indicates his value in 2013.


    Kolb started 7 games for Philly. Including his first 2 starts where he through for over 300 yards in back to back weeks. Early in the season in meaningful games, not at the end of the year like Flynn. But none of that really matters. Kolb proved a giant bust, and was a big reason why the market for Flynn was smaller than some anticipated. It will also likely factor into his trade value.

    And when teams are spending 1st and 2nd rounders on guys like Ponder and Dalton, they are doing so to obtain a young player with upside. They wouldn't do the same for a middle-aged player.

    The funny thing is I actually agree with your value assessment for the most part. I think his value is probably a 3rd or 4th (3rd being the max, not minimum). But I don't think teams will be tearing down the door as many here do. There are other options besides Flynn out there.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:11 pm
  • SeaTown81 wrote:And when teams are spending 1st and 2nd rounders on guys like Ponder and Dalton, they are doing so to obtain a young player with upside. They wouldn't do the same for a middle-aged player.



    So if teams learn everything from Kolb what are they supposed to learn from Ponder?

    My lesson is don't reach for a qb. You either believe he is a starter or you don't. If you do get him - nobody that watched Ponder play should have believed that he has a long term future in this league.......
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:14 pm
  • mikeak wrote:
    SeaTown81 wrote:And when teams are spending 1st and 2nd rounders on guys like Ponder and Dalton, they are doing so to obtain a young player with upside. They wouldn't do the same for a middle-aged player.



    So if teams learn everything from Kolb what are they supposed to learn from Ponder?

    My lesson is don't reach for a qb. You either believe he is a starter or you don't. If you do get him - nobody that watched Ponder play should have believed that he has a long term future in this league.......


    Another lesson; be Andy Reid and win with any old QB; UDFA, 4th/5th rounders, whatever.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:04 pm
  • Hawkstorian wrote:Why do we think anyone would trade for him when nobody else even wanted to sign him last year? We think losing his starting job and sitting on the bench all year somehow makes him more valuable? I don't get it.

    I think I do get it,,There were a slew of Head Coaches, and GMs pink slipped for not taking a flyer on Cousins, Wilson and a few others that are head and shoulders better than the Quarterbacks on their rosters.
    What gives Flynn way more credibility NOW, is after John and Pete have come up looking like geniuses for signing Flynn, AND drafting a third round Wilson.
    The rest of the League has taken notice of Wilson, and how he passed by the #1, & #2 Quarterbacks in last Years draft.
    Flynn will be perceived as a more viable option than most QB's in the upcoming draft, plus, his time with Green Bay AND his six TD's against the Lions + the good fight he put up against the Patriots has to be considered for his abilities to get the job done.

    He didn't beat out Wilson for the starting role, but then again who the hell on our roster could have?
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:11 pm
  • rainger wrote:
    SacHawk2.0 wrote:Gus knows what he can do, and he's pretty clearly ahead of anyone else in Jax. Draft crop for QBs isn't stellar and we're in a win now league?

    Do you thing Gus will make a trade for Flynn?

    I think he will relie on his OC team to advise him. Flynn may not be what the want to do with their offense. Gus is a D guy. Like Carroll he will be going on O input to help him.

    Also he does not have the situation like Pete does with his GM. If the GM doesnt want Flynn it wont matter what Gus wants.

    Yes but, Bradley will be responsible for the Offense in Jax. as well as the Defense, where he only had to answer for the production of the Defense here in Seattle, AND, a good Defensive Coach still has to help formulate success for the Offense through figguring out how to counter HIS Defensive attack.
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Re: Flynn to Jax?
Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:20 pm
  • Don't think we get much for Flynn in a trade. Personally I would rather hold onto him. With Russ's tendency to run I think there is a decent chance he gets hurt at some point. Would rather have a good backup to get us through that period.
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