This blew my mind (Sando)

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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:27 am
  • FlyingGreg wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:Disagree. On a neutral field, primetime evening game I think we smoke them. But, of course we'll never know. We're the better team, they did more to win yesterday. Imo.


    Neutral field, probably right. And definitely C Link.

    But that's not my point. They are the better team because they won the games they had to, whereas we did not. Pretty simple. I just don't think it makes us look really classy playing the "we are better" card. Be gracious in defeat, even when we know a few little breaks there and we had it.

    We'll see what happens next season when we get to roll back into the Dome. I imagine that will be a rather enticing target for a SNF/MNF game.


    I don't get that. The Cardinals made a Super Bowl where they won the games they had to. They were not better than any of the playoff teams they beat. It does happen, sometimes better teams get beat. It isn't like anyone said the Falcons suck. Better cam be pretty incremental.

    Let me illustrate: Why is it logical for me to assume the Niners will beat the Falcons next week?
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:27 am
  • FlyingGreg wrote:
    TDOTSEAHAWK wrote:I have to respectfully disagree. The Falcons won by 2 at home coming off a BYE against a team that is on their second East Coast road game in a row.

    They are certainly not the better team but they scored more points than us in that scenario the one time that it occurred. There are several scenarios in which we destroy the Falcons.


    Ok, but they are a better team for winning 13 games and beating the teams they had to and earning homefield advantage. We don't have anyone to blame but ourselves - we fudged it away in Detroit and Miami or we would have had games at C Link.


    Consider if we had won our division. If, say, the Hawks had gotten into FG range at Miami and kicked a game-winner instead of blowing it at the end. Suddenly, we get a game at home (and maybe even a bye). No FedEx turf, so we have Clemons for the divisional round, maybe.

    Ugh, it's going to be hard for me to let this season go.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:30 am
  • Scottemojo wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:Disagree. On a neutral field, primetime evening game I think we smoke them. But, of course we'll never know. We're the better team, they did more to win yesterday. Imo.


    Neutral field, probably right. And definitely C Link.

    But that's not my point. They are the better team because they won the games they had to, whereas we did not. Pretty simple. I just don't think it makes us look really classy playing the "we are better" card. Be gracious in defeat, even when we know a few little breaks there and we had it.

    We'll see what happens next season when we get to roll back into the Dome. I imagine that will be a rather enticing target for a SNF/MNF game.


    I don't get that. The Cardinals made a Super Bowl where they won the games they had to. They were not better than any of the playoff teams they beat. It does happen, sometimes better teams get beat. It isn't like anyone said the Falcons suck. Better cam be pretty incremental.

    Let me illustrate: Why is it logical for me to assume the Niners will beat the Falcons next week?


    I think it comes down to how each of us view the word "better". The Cardinals is one example -- how many more are there that don't fit that example?

    My point is more of a broad view. I want to be where the Falcons were - HFA and a week off ready for a team that had to fight to win it's first game to come into C Link. In order to get to that level, we need to be better (there's that word again) throughout the whole season, not just in a single game.

    I hope that makes sense...
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:31 am
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:
    TDOTSEAHAWK wrote:I have to respectfully disagree. The Falcons won by 2 at home coming off a BYE against a team that is on their second East Coast road game in a row.

    They are certainly not the better team but they scored more points than us in that scenario the one time that it occurred. There are several scenarios in which we destroy the Falcons.


    Ok, but they are a better team for winning 13 games and beating the teams they had to and earning homefield advantage. We don't have anyone to blame but ourselves - we fudged it away in Detroit and Miami or we would have had games at C Link.


    Consider if we had won our division. If, say, the Hawks had gotten into FG range at Miami and kicked a game-winner instead of blowing it at the end. Suddenly, we get a game at home (and maybe even a bye). No FedEx turf, so we have Clemons for the divisional round, maybe.

    Ugh, it's going to be hard for me to let this season go.


    Yes, exactly where I'm at with it.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:33 am
  • FlyingGreg wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:Disagree. On a neutral field, primetime evening game I think we smoke them. But, of course we'll never know. We're the better team, they did more to win yesterday. Imo.


    Neutral field, probably right. And definitely C Link.

    But that's not my point. They are the better team because they won the games they had to, whereas we did not. Pretty simple. I just don't think it makes us look really classy playing the "we are better" card. Be gracious in defeat, even when we know a few little breaks there and we had it.

    We'll see what happens next season when we get to roll back into the Dome. I imagine that will be a rather enticing target for a SNF/MNF game.

    You can be gracious in defeat and still understand Seattle was a better team.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:34 am
  • It's possible to accept defeat and still believe we're the better team.
    The better team doesn't always win.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:36 am
  • I have been saying it to my wife all year. The only team that could beat the Seahawks is the Seahawks! Practically every loss we suffered this year was by our own hand. We were never out-played. Whether they be coaching mistakes, clock mismanagement, penalties, PED violations, dropped balls or just flat foul ups. My point being that Polish is all this team needs. Work on eliminating our past mistakes, play more disciplined, get people healthy, and make a change or two as necessary and the skies the limit here. I think that come the first Pre-season game this year we will be pretty high up on the odds makers lists to run the table!
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:36 am
  • No, it doesn't make sense to me. You are examining results, I am examining ingredients. But we all look at things from different angles, which is good for helping me build my overall view.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:41 am
  • Scottemojo wrote:No, it doesn't make sense to me. You are examining results, I am examining ingredients. But we all look at things from different angles, which is good for helping me build my overall view.


    Right on. Ingredient wise, I would agree we are a better team. But I'm a completely black-and-white kind of guy when it comes to this stuff - which is why I don't get caught up in DVOA and statistical valuations (although I do concede there is some merit in them). And as I said, I'm just a little gunshy to play the "we lost, but we are better" card - it just doesn't work for me. Take the loss like a champ, concede and give the team props, and learn from it.

    In the end, our defense wasn't good enough to stop their offense - even with only 20 seconds left and half a field to go to get into field goal range. Very disheartening, especially when we saw it so many times this season which led to losses that would have changed the whole face of this post-season run had we held on to win them.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:53 am
  • hawksfansinceday1 wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:But it's not "luck". It's a defense that cannot win the game when we need it the most - mostly because we continue to suffer from the biggest problem we've had for the last few years - lack of a consistent and effective pass rush, especially away from C Link.

    We won't get any further in the playoffs next season unless it's absolutely fixed. Period.

    Wilson is unbelieveable. How much more does he need to do for us to win...? It's a shame we wasted so many incredible performances.

    This X 1000.
    5 games the defense failed to hold a lead on the opposing team's last drive this season. 4 of those games resulted in defeats (exception Chicago but it could've been one too if the coin toss call was wrong). That ain't luck, it's a pattern based on a very legitimate sample size. It's very much a defensive failure when defensive success is absolutely needed most. Agree that 90% of the problem is lack of a 4 man or even 5 man pass rush (5 yesterday on Falcons last drive). No matter how great Russ is (already amazing) and how much greater he will become (has a real chance at the HOF folks!!), this team's defense is going to have to step up and make stops to win games now and then. They failed at doing so this year and it well could've cost us our first Super Bowl winning celebration....as a fanbase, city and team.


    In 100% agreement with both of you. It's a shame that the defense can't be counted on when they're needed the most. :pukeface:
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:55 am
  • That is a pretty amazing statistic.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 12:47 pm
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:
    TDOTSEAHAWK wrote:I have to respectfully disagree. The Falcons won by 2 at home coming off a BYE against a team that is on their second East Coast road game in a row.

    They are certainly not the better team but they scored more points than us in that scenario the one time that it occurred. There are several scenarios in which we destroy the Falcons.


    Ok, but they are a better team for winning 13 games and beating the teams they had to and earning homefield advantage. We don't have anyone to blame but ourselves - we fudged it away in Detroit and Miami or we would have had games at C Link.


    Consider if we had won our division. If, say, the Hawks had gotten into FG range at Miami and kicked a game-winner instead of blowing it at the end. Suddenly, we get a game at home (and maybe even a bye). No FedEx turf, so we have Clemons for the divisional round, maybe.

    Ugh, it's going to be hard for me to let this season go.


    This.

    As far as the "better" discussion goes...I think that we could have played better than we did, and if so, the result would have been better for us. Atlanta played better than they had in past playoffs, and they played better than we did for most of the game. They were better physically- we may have been better mentally in the final quarter though- but they executed better when they had to, and we didn't. I don't know who is the better team overall, but they had a better season, and so they got a home game and had the better chance of winning.

    In my opinion, Russell Wilson is not only better than Matt Ryan, he is better than any QB we've ever had, and better than Luck and Robert...well, at least this year he was better.

    I was feeling a lot better about this game yesterday than I am today. Of course, yesterday I was on bourbon, which I think works better than beer when your team is down 20-0 at halftime in the playoffs.

    And, finally, we'd better improve our pass defense next year or our season wont end any better.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:00 pm
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:
    TDOTSEAHAWK wrote:I have to respectfully disagree. The Falcons won by 2 at home coming off a BYE against a team that is on their second East Coast road game in a row.

    They are certainly not the better team but they scored more points than us in that scenario the one time that it occurred. There are several scenarios in which we destroy the Falcons.


    Ok, but they are a better team for winning 13 games and beating the teams they had to and earning homefield advantage. We don't have anyone to blame but ourselves - we fudged it away in Detroit and Miami or we would have had games at C Link.


    Consider if we had won our division. If, say, the Hawks had gotten into FG range at Miami and kicked a game-winner instead of blowing it at the end. Suddenly, we get a game at home (and maybe even a bye). No FedEx turf, so we have Clemons for the divisional round, maybe.

    Ugh, it's going to be hard for me to let this season go.


    Well, that's just about the most depressing thing I've read today.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:00 pm
  • We had the potential to be the better team, but we didn't quite reach that potential.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:02 pm
  • Three things:

    1.) Yes, the new quarterback more than did his job in the regular season, and even moreso, during the post season. Clearly, Russell Wilson is the answer to the many prayers all of us have had, at one time or another.

    2.) There are only two reasons why we lost the game yesterday; We didn't take the 3 points both times we were at the 15 yard line and went away empty, and the absence of Chris Clemons rushing from the defensive end position.

    3.) When looking for both hope and closure as a 2012 Seattle Seahawks fan, simply refer to numbers 1 and 2 above.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:04 pm
  • HoustonHawk82 wrote:Three things:

    1.) Yes, the new quarterback more than did his job in the regular season, and even moreso, during the post season. Clearly, Russell Wilson is the answer to the many prayers all of us have had, at one time or another.

    2.) There are only two reasons why we lost the game yesterday; We didn't take the 3 points both times we were at the 15 yard line and went away empty, and the absence of Chris Clemons rushing from the defensive end position.

    3.) When looking for both hope and closure as a 2012 Seattle Seahawks fan, simply refer to numbers 1 and 2 above.


    How can 2 be true when we had the lead with 30 seconds left?
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:05 pm
  • Scottemojo wrote:
    HoustonHawk82 wrote:Three things:

    1.) Yes, the new quarterback more than did his job in the regular season, and even moreso, during the post season. Clearly, Russell Wilson is the answer to the many prayers all of us have had, at one time or another.

    2.) There are only two reasons why we lost the game yesterday; We didn't take the 3 points both times we were at the 15 yard line and went away empty, and the absence of Chris Clemons rushing from the defensive end position.

    3.) When looking for both hope and closure as a 2012 Seattle Seahawks fan, simply refer to numbers 1 and 2 above.


    How can 2 be true when we had the lead with 30 seconds left?


    You could argue that Clemons would have applied the necessary pressure that allowed Seattle to keep its safety in the middle of the field. No guarantees of course, but it's a possibility.

    Of course, Clemons might have gotten a sack on a couple long-developing plays. And he would have been crucial in stopping Turner multiple times. (This was the killer for us. Our secondary didn't play too bad, given the Atlanta receiving corps, but to give up those long runs to Captain Slowfoot?)
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:18 pm
  • LoneHawkFan wrote:
    As far as the "better" discussion goes...I think that we could have played better than we did, and if so, the result would have been better for us. Atlanta played better than they had in past playoffs, and they played better than we did for most of the game. They were better physically- we may have been better mentally in the final quarter though- but they executed better when they had to, and we didn't. I don't know who is the better team overall, but they had a better season, and so they got a home game and had the better chance of winning.

    In my opinion, Russell Wilson is not only better than Matt Ryan, he is better than any QB we've ever had, and better than Luck and Robert...well, at least this year he was better.

    I was feeling a lot better about this game yesterday than I am today. Of course, yesterday I was on bourbon, which I think works better than beer when your team is down 20-0 at halftime in the playoffs.

    And, finally, we'd better improve our pass defense next year or our season wont end any better.


    I can't believe it's not better.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:18 pm
  • If everything had transpired (points-wise) as it did, and had included those extra six points, the Falcons would have needed two scores in the last thirty seconds, not one field goal. Hell, even the 3 at the 4th and 1 debacle would have iced it for us.

    We had the best scoring defense in the league and had contained big-time running backs with Clemons rushing. Taking Clem out of the mix created a rift in the the force that was our D-line in that game, and allowed two relatively mediocre backs have good games. Ryan was able to pitch a tent and roast weenies without having to deal with the guy that led our team in sacks. Shuffling guys around and hiring a new guy simply did not contain the Falcons run game.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:29 pm
  • FlyingGreg wrote:
    kearly wrote:Saw this from Sando earlier today, kind of blew my mind. I'm not a fan of QBR, but in this specific case I'll give it a pass since it mirrors other metrics (passer rating, etc) that said Wilson played well. Anyway, here is what Sando pointed out:

    Starting NFL quarterbacks have gone 78-8 during the 2012 regular season and playoffs when posting Total QBR scores as high as the 86.4 Russell Wilson posted for Seattle during a 30-28 divisional playoff defeat Sunday.

    Here is the thing about those eight defeats: Wilson owns three of them, all since Week 8.


    The 2012-2013 season has seen 264 total games to this point with each of those games having at least two QB performances. So 528+ QB performances this year.

    Of those over 500 performances, just 86 of them scored on par with Wilson's performance yesterday. Only EIGHT times all season, IN OVER FIVE HUNDRED PERFORMANCES, did a QB perform that well and lose. The odds of performing that well and losing is 1.5% (528/8).

    And Wilson owns THREE of those EIGHT. Not only that, but ALL of those losses came in Seattle's 8-3 stretch to end the season.

    Now remember that Seattle finished with the #1 scoring defense in the NFL. This takes the term "hard luck" to a whole new level.

    That kind of luck won't continue forever. Another reason for optimism.


    But it's not "luck". It's a defense that cannot win the game when we need it the most - mostly because we continue to suffer from the biggest problem we've had for the last few years - lack of a consistent and effective pass rush, especially away from C Link.

    We won't get any further in the playoffs next season unless it's absolutely fixed. Period.

    Wilson is unbelieveable. How much more does he need to do for us to win...? It's a shame we wasted so many incredible performances.


    Exactly. I've said before we could have easily been 14-2 if our late 4th quarter defense on the road hadn't failed. RW absolutely balled at Miami, Detroit, and now Atlanta. The offense couldn't have played any better. You get a lead with under a minute left, you expect to win if you have an "elite" defense. People around here are saying we will be 14-2 or 13-3 next season just because we're so young and you should expect to get better. But I say we aren't going to be any better than 11-5 or maybe even 10-6 next season unless we fix this problem. How to fix the problem is certainly a challenge- it's likely a combination of personnel and philosophy/scheme changes. IMO it needs to be the number one priority in the off season by JS and the coaching staff.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:47 pm
  • The objective of the game is to score more points than your opponent. Yesterday Falcons were the better team they scored the most points. Seahawks is the better team the other 364 days of the year.......
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 1:58 pm
  • zayden185 wrote:
    Jazzhawk wrote:The Falcons truly earned that victory, as much as I hate to admit it. We were beat by a better TEAM.



    disagree...they arent a better team...they had the easiest schedule in the leage, and should have dropped 2-3-4 more games (didnt mind you) found a way to win, but wagner didnt trail Tony G...ran right next to him....rookie mistake

    that wasnt the play of the game mind you

    Atlanta not a better team...easy schedule and the right breaks all year

    we walked up and down the field on them and left 6-10 on the board in the first half...PERIOD



    Really? Guess what. We beat whomever the league put in front of us. That's how we got the #1 seed. You can holler easy schedule all you want. That isn't determined until 3/4 of the season is over with by the way. The fact of the matter is that the better team found a way to win at the end of the game which is what we've done several times this year and about 15 to 20 times in the last 5 years. That's Matt's Ryan's M.O.. Just look up the stats on game winning drives by Matt Ryan. On the other hand you guys have found ways to lose close games like you've done all year. Good teams find ways to win. That's the different.

    We walked the ball up and down the field in the first half and would have done it in the second half if we didn't start that conservative mess that always gets us in trouble. Plus we went to a soft zone and prevent defense in the second half with no man to man which we did in the 1st half. You guys really couldn't stop us. We stopped ourselves by being conservative and playing a soft zone. As far as the right breaks. Please. Our offense have made plays and our defense have created turnovers all year when we needed them. Making a play isn't called getting a break.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 2:00 pm
  • Jazzhawk wrote:The Falcons truly earned that victory, as much as I hate to admit it. We were beat by a better TEAM.


    Yup. They completely outplayed us in the first half. Completely.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 2:24 pm
  • Evil_Shenanigans wrote:I have been saying it to my wife all year. The only team that could beat the Seahawks is the Seahawks! Practically every loss we suffered this year was by our own hand. We were never out-played. Whether they be coaching mistakes, clock mismanagement, penalties, PED violations, dropped balls or just flat foul ups. My point being that Polish is all this team needs. Work on eliminating our past mistakes, play more disciplined, get people healthy, and make a change or two as necessary and the skies the limit here. I think that come the first Pre-season game this year we will be pretty high up on the odds makers lists to run the table!
    Go Hawks!



    You got outplayed in the first half which was enough of a cushion for us to win it with a late field goal. If you didn't get outplayed I don't know what you call it. On another note. RW is the truth. You guys have something very special there. Yeah I know that we went to soft zone but you have to give credit where credit is due. He exploited the heck out of it and executed plays with perfection. He took what the defense gave him and went to work like a surgeon. That's what good quarterbacks do. For him to keep his poise and give you guys a chance to win speaks volume. If you add about 2 more good pieces on offense you will have something that I wouldn't want to see on my schedule. Now you need to get a piece like him on defense and tell Sherm to shut his mouth and play ball. Act like you've been there before. Your defense is your liability. Based on stats you are #1 but that's based of stats only and that doesn't mean a thing when you strap up on Sunday. That's why you play the game. A #1 defense wouldn't have let Matt Ryan march 44 years to set up for a winning field gold with virtually no time on the clock. You can say that it was the coaches fault but you still have to account for your man if you are playing man and your area if you are playing zone no matter what play was called. They didn't make a play and the falcons made 3 in 32 seconds to take the W away from you guys.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 3:18 pm
  • Jazzhawk wrote:The Falcons truly earned that victory, as much as I hate to admit it. We were beat by a better TEAM.

    I don't believe that, we got beat by better coordinators yes, better team no.
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    May the spirit of our friend The Radish live on forever!
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:49 pm
  • Btw, I never mentioned the Falcons in the OP. Point was that Wilson has been by far the hardest luck QB in the league. Had basically nothing to do with the Falcons.

    But since we're on the Falcons topic, Seattle had a 92% chance of winning after going up 28-27. Now, Atlanta is better than an 8% chance given their passing offense, but whether you think its 10%, 20%, or 30%, the fact is that Atlanta was extremely fortunate to spoil Wilson's epic effort that day. Even after Gonzales caught the pass to set up the kick, Seattle still had a 53% chance to win. A lot can go wrong, but unfortunately enough things went right for Atlanta to pull a stunner.
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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Mon Jan 14, 2013 11:55 pm
  • Sounds like my luck in poker. Have a 92% chance of winning the had on the river then then other guy spikes his 8 percenter on the final card!
    SEATTLE SEAHAWKS SUPERBOWL XLVIII CHAMPIONS!

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Re: This blew my mind (Sando)
Tue Jan 15, 2013 12:39 pm
  • I agree that it is good sportsmanship to avoid playing the better team card on Falcon fans. When we were walking out of the stadium we congratulated Falcons fans on their win, and most of them were too relieved by their narrow escape to gloat. The "worst" thing we heard was a comment to one of my friends to go back to his IT job (We are from Seattle, get it? Although he does actually work in IT.). I did have a number of Falcon fans tell me that they thought we looked like the better team but only the scoreboard matters, and they were right on both counts.

    If the Seahawks were playing the Falcons this Sunday at a neutral field, Vegas would have us favored by at least 3 points. The first half of that game was a fiasco of missed opportunities for us and we ultimately couldn't overcome it. However, once we stopped the bleeding we were clearly able to do things that the Falcons had no answer for. They tried to keep contain on their rush but in doing so couldn't get to Wilson in the second half. Vegas noticed that, and it is why the Falcons are now home underdogs against Kaepernick's 49ers.

    I do wish the Falcons luck in the rest of the playoffs and will be pulling for a bird team Superbowl. It's too early to say who will be the better team in 2013.
    "Check out my 2012 NFL Draft Grades. I just gave the worst grade ever to Seattle." - WalterFootball.com
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