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 Post subject: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:03 pm 
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Russell Wilson of course, no debate there.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:09 pm 
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And steal of the 2011 draft...has to be Richard Sherman. Go Hawks!


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:21 pm 
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One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:25 pm 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.

He's just a guy who obviously hasn't watched a seahawks game this year. Really he's talking up Darrell Bevell? Lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:26 pm 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.

System....yeah, any friggin' system he walks off the street onto....sheesh!

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:31 pm 
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System QB?

NC State, Wisconsin, here, everywhere he goes... Russell Wilson is the system.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:34 pm 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.



From the same juggernaught system that brought us 2010 Hasselbeck and 2011 TJ!? Monster system.....


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:34 pm 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.


Yeah, well he's making Bevell's 'system' look awefully good right now, so in that respect...


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:36 pm 
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He's only a system QB in the sense that Pete tweaked the offense to emphasize Russell's strengths. Of course that's what a good coach is supposed to do no matter who the player is...

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:39 pm 
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"System Quarterback" is one of the phrases in sports that I wish would just go away. Its a cop out in my opinion. Russell Wilson is doing great because he's a damn good QB and our coaches are doing a good job of putting him in position to succeed.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:41 pm 
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So is Tom Brady.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:50 pm 
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Peter Schrager, on the next clip they ask who he would want of the 1st and 2nd year QB's if he were building a team right now and he said Cam Newton. I like Cam but come on, dude has been completely exposed. Schrager even acknowledges his maturity issues and say's a good coach could cure that in a snap. Sorry but maturity issues are a player problem and having them means you also lack leadership any many other tools that go with being a franchise QB.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:52 pm 
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I don't care if he is a "system QB" or a "game manager he is damn good! The system QB has ran three different systems in three years, and ran them all very well.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:55 pm 
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Newton is pure talent and that's it. He has zero leadership ability. No one really wants to put out effort on his behalf.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:16 pm 
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sc85sis wrote:
He's only a system QB in the sense that Pete tweaked the offense to emphasize Russell's strengths. Of course that's what a good coach is supposed to do no matter who the player is...


And in that sense, every QB is a system QB.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:41 pm 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
One of those dudes thinks Wilson is a system QB. That pisses me off.

Hell yeah!, that guy is a hair brain.
Two TD's away from Rookie ALL TIME TD's ,,, a mid 3rd round draft pick,You kidding me?!?!

John Schneider, Pete Carroll,,,OH, and Chuck Gruden, are ALL looking like geniuses.
Oh, and "System Quarterback"?, Russell Wilson IS a "System Quarterback", it's called the "Russell Wilson System", I have doubt's that there are many Quarterbacks that can run Wilsons "System" like RW does, because it isn't just his physical skills that make it work, being cerebraly gifted (is that a word?) can not be Coached to the near perfection that RW has.
Not just anybody can put it all together so thoroughly ESPECIALLY at his Rookie stage.
Bevel knows he's struck paydirt, as guys like Wilson just don't happen along but once in a lifetime, IF YOU'RE LUCKY.
It's one thing to draw up plays for a Quarterback, it's quite another to see it unfold beyond expectations.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 6:59 pm 
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Lol. That wasn't a debate. It was "state your opinion." If it were a debate, I'm sure the guy who supported Wilson would have asked "So if there were a redraft, who would the Dolphins rather have 8th overall?"

EDIT: Oh, and the Panthers would much rather have Kuechly than Levonte David.

Levonte David. Ha. Wasn't that guy taken shortly after Bobby Wagner? And we know how great Wagner is!


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:19 pm 
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JSeahawks wrote:
"System Quarterback" is one of the phrases in sports that I wish would just go away. Its a cop out in my opinion. Russell Wilson is doing great because he's a damn good QB and our coaches are doing a good job of putting him in position to succeed.


Wilson is a system QB. But so is Drew Brees and Tom Brady. They need to play in an offense that is tailored to overcome a weakness. Doesn't mean they aren't among the best QBs to ever walk the planet.

MontanaHawk05 wrote:
And in that sense, every QB is a system QB.


Not really. Most NFL QBs have the minimal amount of height, arm strength, and mobility to play in any system. A few (like Brees, Wilson, Vick, Brady, and arguably Manning, etc) have to play in a very specific kind of offense to be their best.

Brady and Manning lack mobility. New England works around that problem with an elite pass protecting line. Denver/Indy worked around that problem with Manning because Manning is maybe the best QB in history at unloading the ball in less than 3 seconds- so they constructed quick hit offenses.

Brees, Vick, and Wilson play in an offense that is tailored to adjust for height. These QBs are not asked to do quick hits or 3 step drops. If they were, they wouldn't have as much success. Particularly Wilson and Vick who unlike Brees does not rely on timing routes very often. Wilson takes his time and goes through reads instead.

Of course, if the guy is suggesting that Wilson is a product of the system he plays in (see Alex Smith), then he's laughably wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:30 pm 
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kearly wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
"System Quarterback" is one of the phrases in sports that I wish would just go away. Its a cop out in my opinion. Russell Wilson is doing great because he's a damn good QB and our coaches are doing a good job of putting him in position to succeed.


Wilson is a system QB. But so is Drew Brees and Tom Brady. They need to play in an offense that is tailored to overcome a weakness. Doesn't mean they aren't among the best QBs to ever walk the planet.


What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.

If I remember right his offense at NC State was pro style with lots of slants and such.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:32 pm 
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As far as the guy picking David- I think he just did that for the sake of variety. It would be boring if he just agreed on Wilson and left it at that. Lavonte David was a great choice if you exclude Wilson from consideration.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:34 pm 
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JSeahawks wrote:
What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.


Any offense that requires him to see over his line from under center in less than two seconds, which is most NFL offenses. He'd be making blind throws. I have so much belief in Wilson that I think he could do what Brees does and make those throws anyway with enough time and cohesion with his WRs, but both NC State and Wisconsin were careful to not put him in that kind of an offense and so has Seattle. And for good reason.

Brees struggled for years in San Diego because the Chargers tried playing him like a regular QB. I think Wilson is going to be a hall of famer, but I don't think he'd be much different. If he was used wrong, he wouldn't be this special. He might not even be that good. There is a reason why GMs, coaches, and scouting departments scoff at short QBs, albeit a dumb reason. It's because they fail to realize that a system can salvage them, and they always envision a short QB flailing in a big QBs system- just like Max Hall did for Arizona in 2010.


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:51 pm 
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The TD slant to Baldwin was catch and throw, shotgun or not. Wilson better be able to make that or he's not an NFL QB. Thankfully it wasn't an issue in college and it's not an issue now. I'd take him in any system.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 1:43 am 
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I think if your going to try and make the argument for system QB, RGIII is a much better fit. They completely changed their system to accommodate his experience and strengths.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 4:10 am 
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kearly wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.


Any offense that requires him to see over his line from under center in less than two seconds, which is most NFL offenses. He'd be making blind throws. I have so much belief in Wilson that I think he could do what Brees does and make those throws anyway with enough time and cohesion with his WRs, but both NC State and Wisconsin were careful to not put him in that kind of an offense and so has Seattle. And for good reason.

Brees struggled for years in San Diego because the Chargers tried playing him like a regular QB. I think Wilson is going to be a hall of famer, but I don't think he'd be much different. If he was used wrong, he wouldn't be this special. He might not even be that good. There is a reason why GMs, coaches, and scouting departments scoff at short QBs, albeit a dumb reason. It's because they fail to realize that a system can salvage them, and they always envision a short QB flailing in a big QBs system- just like Max Hall did for Arizona in 2010.


I don't remember Drew Brees struggling that bad in San Diego. If he did it was just due to his inexperience.

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 7:16 am 
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Tech Worlds wrote:
kearly wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.


Any offense that requires him to see over his line from under center in less than two seconds, which is most NFL offenses. He'd be making blind throws. I have so much belief in Wilson that I think he could do what Brees does and make those throws anyway with enough time and cohesion with his WRs, but both NC State and Wisconsin were careful to not put him in that kind of an offense and so has Seattle. And for good reason.

Brees struggled for years in San Diego because the Chargers tried playing him like a regular QB. I think Wilson is going to be a hall of famer, but I don't think he'd be much different. If he was used wrong, he wouldn't be this special. He might not even be that good. There is a reason why GMs, coaches, and scouting departments scoff at short QBs, albeit a dumb reason. It's because they fail to realize that a system can salvage them, and they always envision a short QB flailing in a big QBs system- just like Max Hall did for Arizona in 2010.


I don't remember Drew Brees struggling that bad in San Diego. If he did it was just due to his inexperience.

Brees had one pro Bowl year with the Chargers, 2004, wherein he won 11 of the 15 games that he started.

In that year, he threw for 3159 yards, 27 TDs and only 7 INTs.

Sounds like Russell Wilson stats for this year, doesn't it?

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:13 am 
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Any offensive coordinator, who doesn't adjust the playbook based on his QB strengths and weaknesses should look for a new job in any system. If you are excellent at what you do best, why should anyone ask you to do something completely different?

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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:40 am 
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kearly wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.


Any offense that requires him to see over his line from under center in less than two seconds, which is most NFL offenses. He'd be making blind throws. I have so much belief in Wilson that I think he could do what Brees does and make those throws anyway with enough time and cohesion with his WRs, but both NC State and Wisconsin were careful to not put him in that kind of an offense and so has Seattle. And for good reason.


How does 6'4 Tom Brady see over 6'8 Nate Solder, 6'4 Logan Mankins, 6'2 Ryan Wendel, 6'4 Dan Connelly and 6'8 Sebastian Vollmer?

Is there some light bending going on in New England? I mean, even though he's 6'4, his eyes are maybe 6'1 off the ground, then those big guys in front of them have big helmets on too which adds another couple of inches to their height.

Do you think maybe he sees through the gaps between where they stand?? Kind of like Russell Wilson?


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 Post subject: Re: Fox Sports Steal Of The 2012 Draft
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:45 am 
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themunn wrote:
kearly wrote:
JSeahawks wrote:
What offense do you think Wilson would NOT be successful in? I cant imagine a single team, or offense, in the NFL where he wouldnt go in and be successful.


Any offense that requires him to see over his line from under center in less than two seconds, which is most NFL offenses. He'd be making blind throws. I have so much belief in Wilson that I think he could do what Brees does and make those throws anyway with enough time and cohesion with his WRs, but both NC State and Wisconsin were careful to not put him in that kind of an offense and so has Seattle. And for good reason.


How does 6'4 Tom Brady see over 6'8 Nate Solder, 6'4 Logan Mankins, 6'2 Ryan Wendel, 6'4 Dan Connelly and 6'8 Sebastian Vollmer?

Is there some light bending going on in New England? I mean, even though he's 6'4, his eyes are maybe 6'1 off the ground, then those big guys in front of them have big helmets on too which adds another couple of inches to their height.

Do you think maybe he sees through the gaps between where they stand?? Kind of like Russell Wilson?


Do you think all offensive linemen play flat footed and at thier absolute height? I bet they fire out of thier blocks and are quite a bit lower than thier listed height.

Only when standing flat footed will Brady or Wilson not be able to see over the line.

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