Are we going to smoke SF Sunday night?

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Re: Are we going to smoke SF Sunday night?
Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:39 pm
  • 60niners wrote:Different caliber of opponent definitely makes a difference.


    Yes, but if it was that black & white, you'd see every elite team put 50+ on every bad team most of the time. Instead, it's still incredibly rare. That speaks more to the fact that there is so much parity in this league, and that even the worst teams still have a lot of talent overall, even if it falls well short of the best teams in the league. Upsets happen regularly. It's not like college with their huge blowouts every single week.
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Re: Are we going to smoke SF Sunday night?
Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:46 pm
  • So to OP, explosive plays = circumstantial = horrible football

    Ok, good to know
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  • NorCal wrote:So to OP, explosive plays = circumstantial = horrible football

    Ok, good to know


    You missed the point of my post man. I watched the game over on Rewind and took note of every drive the Niners had. What I'm getting at is their win wasn't really all that DOMINATING. The weather played such a big factor in this game, the niners got very lucky on a few fumble recoveries that could have EASILY gone the other way. Not one of the INTs SF got were all that impressive, most of it was Brady trying to force the ball. They didn't have to DRIVE the entire field very much at all due to great field positioning after turnovers, mind you they FAILED TO CAPITALIZE several times with great field position. They miss handled the ball a ton and got very lucky they didn't lose it a few times. They almost blew the lead, their Elite D gave up 28 unanswered points and 500+ yards of offense.

    I just don't see it as a DOMINATING win that catapults them to the #1 power ranked team in the league. My OP has every drive SF had in it, if you see something different then I do, go ahead write your thoughts. As for mine, I am not worried about this game at all. Seattle handles the ball very well in the rain, unlike Kaep. You guys aren't going to have great field position all day from turnovers like you did in NE. RW has proved he can drive the entire field, time and time again. I don't see this being a close game, if SEA protects the ball and plays as consistently as they have been, it is going to be a statement game to say the least.

    Will Seattle be catapulted to the front after Sunday night after a dominating win? I doubt it, the Headlines will probably talk about how SF didn't show up and let Seattle win. Seattle will continue to fly under the radar like they have all season.

    By the way, don't be mad, all I did was post exactly what happened in the game, with my thoughts. If you think any of them are bogus, let me know. That's why I posted in the first place.
    Last edited by 12thManHawkFan on Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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  • No, NorCal; maintaining and regularly executing explosive plays is different from having some here & there. We'll see what kind of consistency goes down for explosive plays from the 49ers over time with Kaepernick, but a 5-game sample size is obviously too small. Really need a full season for that.
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  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    60niners wrote:Different caliber of opponent definitely makes a difference.


    Yes, but if it was that black & white, you'd see every elite team put 50+ on every bad team most of the time. Instead, it's still incredibly rare. That speaks more to the fact that there is so much parity in this league, and that even the worst teams still have a lot of talent overall, even if it falls well short of the best teams in the league. Upsets happen regularly. It's not like college with their huge blowouts every single week.

    Oh back-to-back fiftyburgers is extremely impressive. It appeared to me, as the reader, that the Seahawks were now on some otherworldly level and the basis of that weighed heavily on these last two games.

    I think it would be silly to expect the same outcome.

    And if for some ludicrous reason the Niners give up 50 to the Seahawks, I'll own up to them being the superior team.
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  • lukerguy wrote:The 49ers have a better D then we do...They are also a D built for having the lead unlike any other. Their pass rush between Smith&Smith is not even fair.

    We have many advantages on offense (IMO), but if we can improve an interior pass rush an get someone anywhere near Justin Smith then we will be up to par with them. I see our secondary/LB core as comparable- it's really only our Dline that is inferior.


    I'm sorry....what WHA!?!

    Aldon Smith. Patrick Willis. Navorro Bowman. Ahmad Brooks.

    You see your LB corps as comparable to THAT!?! :shock:

    Woah...major homer sighting there.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    lukerguy wrote:The 49ers have a better D then we do...They are also a D built for having the lead unlike any other. Their pass rush between Smith&Smith is not even fair.

    We have many advantages on offense (IMO), but if we can improve an interior pass rush an get someone anywhere near Justin Smith then we will be up to par with them. I see our secondary/LB core as comparable- it's really only our Dline that is inferior.


    I'm sorry....what WHA!?!

    Aldon Smith. Patrick Willis. Navorro Bowman. Ahmad Brooks.

    You see your LB corps as comparable to THAT!?! :shock:

    Woah...major homer sighting there.


    I think SF has the upper hand at LB core, our LB core has the potential to be as good as SF which is a very good thing. We own them in the Secondary hands down.
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  • 12thManHawkFan wrote:Secondly, SF had one solid drive that led to a TD. Other than that they had a garbage game, full of fumbles, explosive/circumstantial plays.

    Not to mention horrible consistency. They started out with a 28 point lead after capitalizing on multiple INTs and Fumbles that gave them optimal field position, and ended up giving 28 unanswered points and a total of 520 total yards of offense.

    Guys I don't know if I'm totally off base here, I just can't look at this laundry list of terrible football I have listed above and think that this team is "ELITE". I honestly think the Hawks are going to smoke this team, like really bad, this could be a huge game for us.


    The first two sentences above show that you are saying that explosive/circumstantial plays = garbage game. There is no other way to read that.

    I understand your post was trying to say that the niners did not sustain drives, and basically got lucky with the bounces. You can have that opinion, but I don't understand how throwing up quick TDs is a bad thing. Look at the 4th quarter when the Pats tied it up. It took 1 play and the niner had a 7 point lead again. How is that bad? So what they didn't have a sustained drive there, they got the lead back.

    As to your point of lucky breaks, the fumble recoveries on offense were not that lucky. Read Barnwell's piece this week about the percentages of the offense recovering the football based on where the ball is fumbled. The offense was heavily favored to recover in all the fumbles the niners recovered. And to the INTs, you can just look at the INT in a vacuum. Why was Brady forcing passes? Could it have been he was feeling the pressure from the Niners Dline? Sure looked like it to me.

    Its just kind of funny to me bc the Niners have been fairly consistent on sustaining long drives for the better part of the season. They basically won the NO game on a 9+ minute drive to eat away a ton of time in the second half. Niner fans and others have been wondering where the explosive plays have been, and then they finally show some on Sunday. Just kind of ironic to me that a SEA fan will say they had a terrible game. It was definitely the tale of two halfs, but they got the stops in the end when they needed them.

    You think the Seahawks will blow them out, and if they do, I'll give you all the credit on here. But if they don't, will you own up to it?
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  • 12thManHawkFan wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    lukerguy wrote:The 49ers have a better D then we do...They are also a D built for having the lead unlike any other. Their pass rush between Smith&Smith is not even fair.

    We have many advantages on offense (IMO), but if we can improve an interior pass rush an get someone anywhere near Justin Smith then we will be up to par with them. I see our secondary/LB core as comparable- it's really only our Dline that is inferior.


    I'm sorry....what WHA!?!

    Aldon Smith. Patrick Willis. Navorro Bowman. Ahmad Brooks.

    You see your LB corps as comparable to THAT!?! :shock:

    Woah...major homer sighting there.


    I think SF has the upper hand at LB core, our LB core has the potential to be as good as SF which is a very good thing. We own them in the Secondary hands down.



    I'm gonna have to respectfully disagree there.

    The Niners IMO may have the best LB corps of this generation. THREE of them may be all-pro this year. Not Pro Bowl....ALL-PRO. The only guys I can think of that would even compare would be the old Dome Patrol of the Saints back in the 80's (who were also coached by Vic Fangio,Niners OC).

    Seattles LBs have some serious potential, but IMO are a LONG way off from the quartet in SF. I also like the Niners Secondary, but I'll concede that Seattles got the Niners beat there by a good margin.
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  • One thing to keep in mind is that pass rush is closely linked to secondary performance, and the 49ers have a far superior pass rush to us. If you stick the 49ers secondary on the Seahawks and use them effectively/their best way, I think you'd see a very large discrepancy.

    No way do I put the Seahawks LBers on par with the 49ers, though. I think Swagner (I love that name for Bobby Wagner) might just be the next elite LB this league sees, but he's not there right now and we don't know if he will be; but daaaaaaaamn, is he looking good lately. K.J. Wright has been a very nice surprise, too.
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  • The first two sentences above show that you are saying that explosive/circumstantial plays = garbage game. There is no other way to read that.

    You think the Seahawks will blow them out, and if they do, I'll give you all the credit on here. But if they don't, will you own up to it?


    1 great drive at the beginning of the game, 4 fumbles, shanked FG, INT (terrible throw into double coverage), Lucky fumble recoveries that could have gone either way (sorry this is circumstantial, nobody controls how the ball bounces), capitalized on 2 terrible throws by brady with INTs, failed fourth down conversion, gave up 28 unanswered points, gave up 500+ yards, two FG's, two stops in the Redzone that only netted a FG, gave up the last drive to NE with 50seconds or whatever on the clock, what if NE gets the onside kick (SF probably would have lost the game the way they were letting Brady and company move the ball in the second half)

    Other than that there was like 5-6 Explosive plays. Sorry man everything I have listed here adds up to, half garbage football + half luck in my opinion.

    What's my point? I feel like the Seahawks have a High probability of blowing out SF, if they don't well it's a prediction. I'm not a psychic. If we lose the game, I will own up to it. I'm just predicting based off what I saw, and it wasn't as good as the mediots are reporting.
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  • 60niners wrote:
    HoustonHawk82 wrote:Provided we are all still here Friday afternoon, I'd say the planets are aligned quite nicely for a Seahawks victory.

    As I mentioned in another thread, it's really a game that will be a very tough one for the Niners to eek out a victory in. So many conditions favor the Hawks it's not even fair. Home at the Clink, nationally-televised, last game before Christmas, the whole league will be watching, the 12's will be a force, and we've got Wilson.

    One thing's for sure, it'll be a question of how many interceptions Kaerpenick will throw. Optimus will be on his game, Lane is looking better, ET is all over the place, we've got KJ Wright playing sweet coverage from the LB spot, and Kam is, well, just Kam. If we contain Gore and cover the deep ball, we're good.

    I'm curious how the bolded favors the Seahawks? Our last match was nationally televised as well. Home field advantage definitely favors the Hawks, but I really don't see how those others are advantages.

    My personal opinion is that this game will come down to how well Seattles offense can play against the Niner defense. They aren't going to play like they did against the Cards and Bills... But how well or badly they play will really set the tempo for the game me thinks. Seattles defense should play better than in the first meeting, but so should the 49er offense.


    Roland touched on it already. It's about a thing we Seahawks fans feel when we watch how our team plays in the national games, especially in the midst of the holiday season.

    With the mentality of this 2012 team under Pete Carroll, the Sunday, Monday, or Thursday games are used for extra motivation. We see the difference in the players with elevated play during the night games. The fact that it is a home game multiplies that effect by 10-fold. The Seattle Seahawks will be ready to play, you can bet your a** they will. This element is a definite advantage.

    We've seen some pretty spectacular personal performances from key players in night games over the years. One Sunday Night in particular, I remember watching Shaun Alexander score his 5th touchdown of the first half against the Vikings. That record won't be broken any time soon. Oh, and there was the complete annialation of the Eagles, in Philly, during a snowstorm. I could go on and on. Night games are the Seahawks thing.
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  • I feel the smoke will be not nearly as large as the last home game, but pretty close.

    I have a ton of respect for the 49ers, but I also feel the 12 gives the Hawks an advantage that no other team has in the league.

    Hawks 31, 49ers 17.

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  • HoustonHawk82 wrote:
    60niners wrote:
    HoustonHawk82 wrote:Provided we are all still here Friday afternoon, I'd say the planets are aligned quite nicely for a Seahawks victory.

    As I mentioned in another thread, it's really a game that will be a very tough one for the Niners to eek out a victory in. So many conditions favor the Hawks it's not even fair. Home at the Clink, nationally-televised, last game before Christmas, the whole league will be watching, the 12's will be a force, and we've got Wilson.

    One thing's for sure, it'll be a question of how many interceptions Kaerpenick will throw. Optimus will be on his game, Lane is looking better, ET is all over the place, we've got KJ Wright playing sweet coverage from the LB spot, and Kam is, well, just Kam. If we contain Gore and cover the deep ball, we're good.

    I'm curious how the bolded favors the Seahawks? Our last match was nationally televised as well. Home field advantage definitely favors the Hawks, but I really don't see how those others are advantages.

    My personal opinion is that this game will come down to how well Seattles offense can play against the Niner defense. They aren't going to play like they did against the Cards and Bills... But how well or badly they play will really set the tempo for the game me thinks. Seattles defense should play better than in the first meeting, but so should the 49er offense.


    Roland touched on it already. It's about a thing we Seahawks fans feel when we watch how our team plays in the national games, especially in the midst of the holiday season.

    With the mentality of this 2012 team under Pete Carroll, the Sunday, Monday, or Thursday games are used for extra motivation. We see the difference in the players with elevated play during the night games. The fact that it is a home game multiplies that effect by 10-fold. The Seattle Seahawks will be ready to play, you can bet your a** they will. This element is a definite advantage.

    We've seen some pretty spectacular personal performances from key players in night games over the years. One Sunday Night in particular, I remember watching Shaun Alexander score his 5th touchdown of the first half against the Vikings. That record won't be broken any time soon. Oh, and there was the complete annialation of the Eagles, in Philly, during a snowstorm. I could go on and on. Night games are the Seahawks thing.

    I see. I guess we feel the same way because in the current Harbaugh era, we've been pretty dominant in prime-time games as well. I do think it's pretty badass though that the Niners get their biggest (currently) division rival's games both nationally televised this year.
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  • JrockRichards wrote:I feel the smoke will be not nearly as large as the last home game, but pretty close.

    I have a ton of respect for the 49ers, but I also feel the 12 gives the Hawks an advantage that no other team has in the league.

    Hawks 31, 49ers 17.

    Go Hawks!

    I think the score will be a bit closer, but I agree with your take on the Clink. Most HFAs average in the area of 3-5 pts, I think the Clink is worth more like 7, if not more. Hat's off to the design team (and #12). Very difficult venue for a visiting team and Kaep is about to lose his virginity.
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  • Smoke em if you got em :thirishdrinkers: :th2thumbs: :180670:
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  • 12thManHawkFan wrote:
    The first two sentences above show that you are saying that explosive/circumstantial plays = garbage game. There is no other way to read that.

    You think the Seahawks will blow them out, and if they do, I'll give you all the credit on here. But if they don't, will you own up to it?


    1 great drive at the beginning of the game, 4 fumbles, shanked FG, INT (terrible throw into double coverage), Lucky fumble recoveries that could have gone either way (sorry this is circumstantial, nobody controls how the ball bounces), capitalized on 2 terrible throws by brady with INTs, failed fourth down conversion, gave up 28 unanswered points, gave up 500+ yards, two FG's, two stops in the Redzone that only netted a FG, gave up the last drive to NE with 50seconds or whatever on the clock, what if NE gets the onside kick (SF probably would have lost the game the way they were letting Brady and company move the ball in the second half)

    Other than that there was like 5-6 Explosive plays. Sorry man everything I have listed here adds up to, half garbage football + half luck in my opinion.

    What's my point? I feel like the Seahawks have a High probability of blowing out SF, if they don't well it's a prediction. I'm not a psychic. If we lose the game, I will own up to it. I'm just predicting based off what I saw, and it wasn't as good as the mediots are reporting.


    What is up with your insistance that "Explosive Plays" are "lucky"? They are the reason Kaep is in the game to begin with. He threw 4 TDs and ALL of them were more than 20 yards and 2 were over 30 yards. If Wilson had done that you'd be singing his praises. Instead, Kaep is "lucky". Nice homerism.
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  • " garbage game " Really? Reach much ? 41 points and only 1 drive was any good? Ill take 34 garbage points every week. Anyways what does last week have to do with this coming Sunday Night game? Your not playing the Cardinals defense .Seahawks are facing the same defense they scored a whole 3 "garbage" points against ealier in the year. Oh yeah and Wilson is no Brady. Good luck.
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  • Seahawks win by 6, remain undefeated at home.
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  • 49erFanFromPac wrote:" garbage game " Really? Reach much ? 41 points and only 1 drive was any good? Ill take 34 garbage points every week. Anyways what does last week have to do with this coming Sunday Night game? Your not playing the Cardinals defense .Seahawks are facing the same defense they scored a whole 3 "garbage" points against ealier in the year. Oh yeah and Wilson is no Brady. Good luck.


    No Wilson isn't but he did beat him, Kaepernick isn't either, but he beat him as well.

    No ones smoking anyone or anything in this game though.
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  • I think anybody thinking this won't be close is being obtuse and trying to pump themselves up. Now, as we all know, the final score does not always reflect the closeness of a game, so one team could pull away late, but I expect this game to be essentially a bare knuckle brawl.
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  • We've seen some pretty spectacular personal performances from key players in night games over the years. One Sunday Night in particular, I remember watching Shaun Alexander score his 5th touchdown of the first half against the Vikings. That record won't be broken any time soon.


    I wouldn't be so sure of that. Russell had four in the first half versus the Bills ... in his rookie season.
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  • Scottemojo wrote:I think anybody thinking this won't be close is being obtuse and trying to pump themselves up. Now, as we all know, the final score does not always reflect the closeness of a game, so one team could pull away late, but I expect this game to be essentially a bare knuckle brawl.


    That we can agree on....especially since it's starting to look like Justin Smith won't play. Yikes.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    Scottemojo wrote:I think anybody thinking this won't be close is being obtuse and trying to pump themselves up. Now, as we all know, the final score does not always reflect the closeness of a game, so one team could pull away late, but I expect this game to be essentially a bare knuckle brawl.


    That we can agree on....especially since it's starting to look like Justin Smith won't play. Yikes.


    justin won't play? I take it all back, ass kicking time.
    Just kidding. But without Justin, Aldon will be less effective. We are missing Browner, however, and I think his thugishness will be sorely missed by us.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    Scottemojo wrote:I think anybody thinking this won't be close is being obtuse and trying to pump themselves up. Now, as we all know, the final score does not always reflect the closeness of a game, so one team could pull away late, but I expect this game to be essentially a bare knuckle brawl.


    That we can agree on....especially since it's starting to look like Justin Smith won't play. Yikes.


    Can you also sit Aldon Smith... guy is a machine.
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  • Scottemojo wrote:
    Marvin49 wrote:
    Scottemojo wrote:I think anybody thinking this won't be close is being obtuse and trying to pump themselves up. Now, as we all know, the final score does not always reflect the closeness of a game, so one team could pull away late, but I expect this game to be essentially a bare knuckle brawl.


    That we can agree on....especially since it's starting to look like Justin Smith won't play. Yikes.


    justin won't play? I take it all back, ass kicking time.
    Just kidding. But without Justin, Aldon will be less effective. We are missing Browner, however, and I think his thugishness will be sorely missed by us.


    Its not for sure, but the players seem to thinnk Ricky Jean-Francois will be playing. Rickys actually pretty good and got a sack in NE, but lets be real...he's not Justin Smith.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    12thManHawkFan wrote:
    Other than that there was like 5-6 Explosive plays. Sorry man everything I have listed here adds up to, half garbage football + half luck in my opinion.

    What's my point? I feel like the Seahawks have a High probability of blowing out SF, if they don't well it's a prediction. I'm not a psychic. If we lose the game, I will own up to it. I'm just predicting based off what I saw, and it wasn't as good as the mediots are reporting.


    What is up with your insistance that "Explosive Plays" are "lucky"? They are the reason Kaep is in the game to begin with. He threw 4 TDs and ALL of them were more than 20 yards and 2 were over 30 yards. If Wilson had done that you'd be singing his praises. Instead, Kaep is "lucky". Nice homerism.


    When I'm predicting a game coming up, I look at how the other team has succeeded recently. Then I bounce that production against how I think the Seahawks would have performed. 5-6 explosive plays against a terrible secondary, not going to happen Sunday. Let's say Kaep gets 1-2 that nets 10 points + 1 sustained drive 7, or maybe 3 after all SF was stopped in the Redzone multiple times last Sunday. Turnovers? Not going to be the same as your NE turnover frenzy that was last Sunday, maybe Seattle gives up 1, but will SF capitalize? I don't see it. Like I said I think SEA will stop the explosive plays Sunday. So what are we at... 13-17 points. That's not going to get it done, you guys are getting ready to play an Offense that is ON FIRE, to say the least.

    Let's not forget, you guys just lost to the Rams, what two weeks ago? What happened in that game? 1 sustained drive, 5 punts, a safety, a FG, a fumble by your hero that lead to losing the lead, oh another FG...OT punt, Shanked FG (trend?).

    You guys had a ton of explosive plays that game right? You can't bank on them. If that is all you had all game, then ya i think the game was garbage. I would say lopsided if SF didn't almost BLOW THE ENTIRE GAME by giving up 28 points in 1 quarter. What is the whole point of my article? I wanted to know if any SEAHAWK fans were feeling the same way I was after the game last Sunday. The media is painting this picture as if SF is the most amazing team since sliced bread. I'm sorry I dont see it that way, I'm not worried about Sunday at all. I think that Seattle is going to put SF to sleep by the end of the third quarter.
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  • Marvin49 wrote:
    12thManHawkFan wrote:
    Other than that there was like 5-6 Explosive plays. Sorry man everything I have listed here adds up to, half garbage football + half luck in my opinion.

    What's my point? I feel like the Seahawks have a High probability of blowing out SF, if they don't well it's a prediction. I'm not a psychic. If we lose the game, I will own up to it. I'm just predicting based off what I saw, and it wasn't as good as the mediots are reporting.


    What is up with your insistance that "Explosive Plays" are "lucky"? They are the reason Kaep is in the game to begin with. He threw 4 TDs and ALL of them were more than 20 yards and 2 were over 30 yards. If Wilson had done that you'd be singing his praises. Instead, Kaep is "lucky". Nice homerism.


    When I'm predicting a game coming up, I look at how the other team has succeeded recently. Then I bounce that production against how I think the Seahawks would have performed. 5-6 explosive plays against a terrible secondary, not going to happen Sunday. Let's say Kaep gets 1-2 that nets 10 points + 1 sustained drive 7, or maybe 3 after all SF was stopped in the Redzone multiple times last Sunday. Turnovers? Not going to be the same as your NE turnover frenzy that was last Sunday, maybe Seattle gives up 1, but will SF capitalize? I don't see it. Like I said I think SEA will stop the explosive plays Sunday. So what are we at... 13-17 points. That's not going to get it done, you guys are getting ready to play an Offense that is ON FIRE, to say the least.

    Let's not forget, you guys just lost to the Rams, what two weeks ago? What happened in that game? 1 sustained drive, 5 punts, a safety, a FG, a fumble by your hero that lead to losing the lead, oh another FG...OT punt, Shanked FG (trend?).

    You guys had a ton of explosive plays that game right? You can't bank on them. If that is all you had all game, then ya i think the game was garbage. I would say lopsided if SF didn't almost BLOW THE ENTIRE GAME by giving up 28 points in 1 quarter. What is the whole point of my article? I wanted to know if any SEAHAWK fans were feeling the same way I was after the game last Sunday. The media is painting this picture as if SF is the most amazing team since sliced bread. I'm sorry I dont see it that way, I'm not worried about Sunday at all. I think that Seattle is going to put SF to sleep by the end of the third quarter.[/quote]



    If your point is that the 49ers won't attack the Seahawks the same way they attacked the Pats...

    Um...duh?

    That doesn't make the plays against the Pats lucky. They were well designed and executed. Yes, the 49ers lost to the Rams. How could I possibly forget wen every fan on every forum reminds all Niner fans and uses it as the examply of how to beat the Niners. What that won't tell you tho is that Kaep actually threw the game winner in that game and it was promptly dropped by Delanie Walker.

    Very possible that the Seahawks win, but saying the Niners game wasn't impressive is just BS.
    Marvin49
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  • Dont think im not equally as critical on the hawks as i am sf. our d pissed me the f off last sunday in the first half of the game, i think we should have shutdown the bills or at least been able to hold them to 10 or less. I contribute their failures to the continued road performances we have seen all year and dont expect to see any of it at home sunday.
    12thManHawkFan
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  • We won by 33 points, that is plenty good enough.
    60 percent of the time..........it works........every time
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    SoulfishHawk
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  • I know my friends get really irritated at me, after the game all i could talk about is how frustrated i was about giving them 17.
    12thManHawkFan
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  • I wanted to bump this thread, I saw a post about doubters and wanted to point out that some of us saw this coming.
    12thManHawkFan
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  • Where are the niner fans now? One of them said he would come here and admit the Seahawks were the better team if Seattle blew the niners out....WELL???
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  • It's Christmas, let him and his family it crow in private!
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