Sherman and Browner facing suspension

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  • Hawkscanner wrote:
    Zowert wrote:Four games for Adderall?! What?! I know it is Amphetamines, which gives you vision like an Eagle, sharp focus and the ability to perform certain tasks exceptionally. I use to take an Adderall here and there when I was in college and I needed to cram for an exam. I tried taking one before hitting the gym one day (to participate in an intense game of Squash) and it actually didn't help one bit. Squash is nothing compared to professional football and just doing that made my heart rate so high that I couldn't function. I would have to stop every five minutes to catch my breath, it was awful and that was just a very low dose (20mg). I can't even imagine what it would do to a professional CB on an NFL field, covering some of the fastest runners on Earth. Their hearts would explode.

    My guess, is they didn't take Adderall before a game. Maybe they took it so they could stay out all night or just for recreational purposes. I'm not trying to condone this type of behavior at all. But I don't see why it would be a problem with the NFL. Their not juicing. I understand the zero tolerance for doping (using anabolic steroids), but Amphetamines? Any anaerobic type athlete that used a significant amount would fall over and have a frickin' myocardial infarction.


    I used to be a professional counselor, so understand all that stuff very well. If they happen to have ADHD though ... Adderall is a perfectly acceptable medication for them. Contrary to popular belief (for those who don't have ADHD) -- Adderall and these kinds of stimulants (Ritalin as well) DON'T hype UP people who have ADHD ... they calm them down. In essence the midbrain of those who have ADHD is going a million miles an hour -- faster than the centers of the brain that govern your overall intellectual reasoning, judgment, etc. In theory, what these stimulants (like Adderall) do is to speed up those centers to the same speed as the midbrain (so now everything is now in synch). If that's what going on with these guys -- PFFT! This should be cleared up shortly. Hopefully that IS what's going on.


    You really think all these DBs from the same team just happen to be diagnosed with ADHD, are taking properly prescribed dosages of Adderall, under a doctor's supervision, and simply failed to mention this to the NFL?
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  • Schefter just said on ESPN Seattle that he doesnt know when Sherman and BB were tested, it could have been as far back training camp, but the news has been out there for about a week
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  • The word of a suspension might have effected their play yesterday...
    might could 'splain them long Miami drives.
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  • First off, I'm in the camp that there are a lot of professional athletes that are using PED's, just some happen to get caught. I have no choice but to think that, as I'm a fan of the San Francisco Giants.

    Strategically, though, wouldn't it make the most sense for the two players to serve their suspensions ASAP?
    1) Playoffs aren't all that likely
    2) Team would benefit from better draft position
    3) Get the issue put behind as quickly as possible so it doesn't stay in the media spotilght and they can get back to ripping Harbaugh.
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  • 49fansince70 wrote:First off, I'm in the camp that there are a lot of professional athletes that are using PED's, just some happen to get caught. I have no choice but to think that, as I'm a fan of the San Francisco Giants.

    Strategically, though, wouldn't it make the most sense for the two players to serve their suspensions ASAP?
    1) Playoffs aren't all that likely
    2) Team would benefit from better draft position
    3) Get the issue put behind as quickly as possible so it doesn't stay in the media spotilght and they can get back to ripping Harbaugh.


    How are playoffs not likely? Seahawks hold the 6th seed in their hand right now. Why are you making stuff up?
    Draft position is a bunch of mumbo jumbo, it only helps if your staff sucks at scouting. Draft position is irrelevant.
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  • If it was only one of them I could possibly see it, but both at the same time makes me suspicious of the NFL.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:03 am
  • Grandpa always used to say, if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true :les:

    I am starting to wonder if the out-of-nowhere stardom of our two unheralded CBs was just a little too good to be true. A 5th round second year player and a CFL reclamation project all of a sudden are the best CB duo in the NFL?

    It was an awesome story, and I bought in just like everyone else, but it sure seems improbable looking back on it all now. How well Sherm and Browner have played did seem too good to be true at times. If they were using PEDs, maybe Grandpa was right.

    Time will tell
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:24 am
  • I am just curious and maybe its been asked already, but would fans rather them sit out the four games this year or the first four next season?
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:24 am
  • Missing_Clink wrote:Grandpa always used to say, if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true :les:

    I am starting to wonder if the out-of-nowhere stardom of our two unheralded CBs was just a little too good to be true. A 5th round second year player and a CFL reclamation project all of a sudden are the best CB duo in the NFL?

    It was an awesome story, and I bought in just like everyone else, but it sure seems improbable looking back on it all now. How well Sherm and Browner have played did seem too good to be true at times. If they were using PEDs, maybe Grandpa was right.

    Time will tell


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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:34 am
  • Missing_Clink wrote:Grandpa always used to say, if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true :les:

    I am starting to wonder if the out-of-nowhere stardom of our two unheralded CBs was just a little too good to be true. A 5th round second year player and a CFL reclamation project all of a sudden are the best CB duo in the NFL?

    It was an awesome story, and I bought in just like everyone else, but it sure seems improbable looking back on it all now. How well Sherm and Browner have played did seem too good to be true at times. If they were using PEDs, maybe Grandpa was right.

    Time will tell


    You have a bizarre idea of how PEDs work. They don't grant superpowers.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:34 am
  • NorCal wrote:I am just curious and maybe its been asked already, but would fans rather them sit out the four games this year or the first four next season?


    4 games next year, no question. It would give the team an entire off season to game plan for it. Right now, you have no trade options. Let's say we know it's coming next season, we could sign free agents to fill the roles. When the suspensions are over, then you have 2 extra starting quality CB's to put on the market to fill other possible holes from injury. Right now, if they are both suspended for 4 weeks, our season is in DEEP trouble.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:51 am
  • kidhawk wrote:
    NorCal wrote:I am just curious and maybe its been asked already, but would fans rather them sit out the four games this year or the first four next season?


    4 games next year, no question. It would give the team an entire off season to game plan for it. Right now, you have no trade options. Let's say we know it's coming next season, we could sign free agents to fill the roles. When the suspensions are over, then you have 2 extra starting quality CB's to put on the market to fill other possible holes from injury. Right now, if they are both suspended for 4 weeks, our season is in DEEP trouble.


    Good points. Being able to plan accordingly is a much better situation. Once there is an opportunity in the NFL, teams have to seize it. Its all about just getting into the playoffs, because you never know what will happen. There are 3 teams I would be more nervous about the Niners playing in the playoffs: Giants, Saints and Seahawks.

    At the very least I hope the Niner @ Sea game is very important. I look at Sea as a rival, and I would love for that game to have Sea's playoffs hopes on the line.

    I think Sherman/Browner will at least get to play at CHI.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:01 am
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    Missing_Clink wrote:Grandpa always used to say, if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true :les:

    I am starting to wonder if the out-of-nowhere stardom of our two unheralded CBs was just a little too good to be true. A 5th round second year player and a CFL reclamation project all of a sudden are the best CB duo in the NFL?

    It was an awesome story, and I bought in just like everyone else, but it sure seems improbable looking back on it all now. How well Sherm and Browner have played did seem too good to be true at times. If they were using PEDs, maybe Grandpa was right.

    Time will tell


    You have a bizarre idea of how PEDs work. They don't grant superpowers.


    tell that to shawn merriman
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:16 am
  • Missing_Clink wrote:
    volsunghawk wrote:
    Missing_Clink wrote:Grandpa always used to say, if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true :les:

    I am starting to wonder if the out-of-nowhere stardom of our two unheralded CBs was just a little too good to be true. A 5th round second year player and a CFL reclamation project all of a sudden are the best CB duo in the NFL?

    It was an awesome story, and I bought in just like everyone else, but it sure seems improbable looking back on it all now. How well Sherm and Browner have played did seem too good to be true at times. If they were using PEDs, maybe Grandpa was right.

    Time will tell


    You have a bizarre idea of how PEDs work. They don't grant superpowers.


    Merriman was on steroids not aderall

    tell that to shawn merriman
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:24 am
  • Basis4day wrote:Moffit. Everyone forgets.


    Exactly. The only reason people remember Merriman is because it was a HUGE saga at the time, and everyone thinks the drop off in production was because he was no longer "roiding" (even though he managed 17 sacks in 12 games the season he tested positive, and then 12.5 the season before suffering from terrible injuries in his 4th and 5th seasons)
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:35 am
  • manders2600 wrote:You really think all these DBs from the same team just happen to be diagnosed with ADHD, are taking properly prescribed dosages of Adderall, under a doctor's supervision, and simply failed to mention this to the NFL?


    I have no idea honestly -- I'll admit that it seems highly unlikely. You're right. I'm just throwing that out as a possibility. Until we have all the facts, it's hard for me to really offer a good informed opinion. I simply threw that out there. Now I will say this as far as Adderall is concerned. You would get the same basic effect from it that you would if you pounded several cups of coffee. In fact, here's the real test if you want to know if someone has ADHD or not. What happens to that person if they have a lot of coffee? For the person without it ... coffee will naturally wire them up. For the person WITH ADHD though ... it will calm them down ... and a high enough stimulant level (coffee, Adderall, etc.) will actually put them to sleep. There's your test.

    As I said though, until we have some real hard evidence and facts regarding this case ... it's hard to offer anything of any true use.
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Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:38 am
  • 1.) Who's the drug dealer in the group? That's what I wanna know. We all know that guys in the locker room hang out in cliques, and usually by personnel groupings. So far we have Winston Guy, Brandon Browner, and Richard Sherman all being caught taking Adderal this season. So who in the DB group is feeding this crap to these guys? Those of us who are older (like yours truly) know how easy it is to make stupid decisions when you're in your 20's, even in your 30's. We have to remember that these guys are puppies, just out of college. It's easy to be influenced when you're hanging out with the wrong people. It's imperative that we find out who the idiot is that is feeding our Pro Bowl DB's drugs and smash him out. It could be an agent, it could be another player, it could be a trainer, who the hell knows, but the organization better get to the bottom of it and get rid of the source.

    2.) If we assume that Browner and Sherman have been taking this crap then how will they perform when they're off drugs? Adderal is supposed to make you feel like your Einstein and Superman all at once. If they're off of it, what will their "real" abilities be? Will they not be the players that we're used to? How much will their play drop off? Has this all been a farce that we've been observing? As a fan, I feel extremely cheated. I thought of this defense as a top caliber defense in the NFL and now I don't know what to believe anymore...
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:41 am
  • You are giving Adderal way too much credit. These guys will be fine without it. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised if it actually diminished their performance.

    I do wonder where they are getting it though...
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:45 am
  • Guilty before trial...?
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:45 am

Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 11:54 am
  • ensett wrote:
    49fansince70 wrote:First off, I'm in the camp that there are a lot of professional athletes that are using PED's, just some happen to get caught. I have no choice but to think that, as I'm a fan of the San Francisco Giants.

    Strategically, though, wouldn't it make the most sense for the two players to serve their suspensions ASAP?
    1) Playoffs aren't all that likely
    2) Team would benefit from better draft position
    3) Get the issue put behind as quickly as possible so it doesn't stay in the media spotilght and they can get back to ripping Harbaugh.


    How are playoffs not likely? Seahawks hold the 6th seed in their hand right now. Why are you making stuff up?
    Draft position is a bunch of mumbo jumbo, it only helps if your staff sucks at scouting. Draft position is irrelevant.


    Draft position obviously matters, a quick glance through historical drafts clearly shows that the earlier a player is taken, the better he is likely to be. Sure, there are busts and surprises, it's fuzzy. But you'll never convince me it's better to draft, say, 18'th than 13'th. Additionally, saying draft position doesn't matter kind of detracts from the '49ers benefitted from more years of suckage while the Seahawks were dominating the West' argument.

    However, your point about Seattle winding up as the 6'th seed is well taken, looking at the Vikings and the Bucs, Seattle has an easier schedule, even though I think right now the Bucs are probably the better team.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:01 pm
  • Hawkscanner wrote:
    manders2600 wrote:You really think all these DBs from the same team just happen to be diagnosed with ADHD, are taking properly prescribed dosages of Adderall, under a doctor's supervision, and simply failed to mention this to the NFL?


    I have no idea honestly -- I'll admit that it seems highly unlikely. You're right. I'm just throwing that out as a possibility. Until we have all the facts, it's hard for me to really offer a good informed opinion. I simply threw that out there. Now I will say this as far as Adderall is concerned. You would get the same basic effect from it that you would if you pounded several cups of coffee. In fact, here's the real test if you want to know if someone has ADHD or not. What happens to that person if they have a lot of coffee? For the person without it ... coffee will naturally wire them up. For the person WITH ADHD though ... it will calm them down ... and a high enough stimulant level (coffee, Adderall, etc.) will actually put them to sleep. There's your test.

    As I said though, until we have some real hard evidence and facts regarding this case ... it's hard to offer anything of any true use.


    Yeah, that's not the case with all stimulants in all cases.

    Cocaine will go from stimulant to depressant to hallucinogen as dosage increases.

    Amphetamines in lower, controlled dosages will have the effect you mentioned on individuals with legitimate ADHD (though this condition is insanely over-diagnosed). However, in higher, concentrated dosages (see: recreational) they will not put someone to sleep, but rather will have the same effect as they would on anyone else.

    The bottom line, though, is that the league is suspending them for a failed test, not for a failed test specifically because of Adderall. Adderall is simply what players tell the public they have been taking, which in this case seems extremely unlikely.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:01 pm
  • FlyingGreg wrote:Guilty before trial...?



    what trial? they tested positive for an illegal substance and I personally have never seen an appeal for THIS offense work in the NFL.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:04 pm
  • manders2600 wrote:The bottom line, though, is that the league is suspending them for a failed test, not for a failed test specifically because of Adderall. Adderall is simply what players tell the public they have been taking, which in this case seems extremely unlikely.



    You say that players claim to be taking Adderall, but that is NOT the case here. Sherman has said that he is being banned for taking that particular banned substance, but is denying it and says he will be exonerated. Now, is he speaking the truth? who knows. I'm sure many guilty people make these claims, but IN THIS CASE, the player is not CLAIMING TO HAVE TAKEN ADDERALL
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:05 pm
  • yea the appeal is not the "trial". They have already been deemed guilty of the offense. They have already been sentenced in fact.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:07 pm
  • PatsFanNH wrote:
    FlyingGreg wrote:Guilty before trial...?



    what trial? they tested positive for an illegal substance and I personally have never seen an appeal for THIS offense work in the NFL.


    Several players in recent history have had their suspensions overturned because it was a paperwork error and not a substance use issue. So there is some precedence...Is this the case here? I have no idea, but until the appeal is heard, they is still an assumption that there is a possibility of innocence. I'm not holding my breath though
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:11 pm
  • I agree with PatsFan- cmon guys, when has a guy getting caught doing Adderal ever had his suspension reversed? And don't you think it's just a little too coincidental that 3 DB's on the same team get caught doing this crap within a couple months? There's obviously a bad apple in the group and I wanna know who it is.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:11 pm
  • kidhawk wrote:
    manders2600 wrote:The bottom line, though, is that the league is suspending them for a failed test, not for a failed test specifically because of Adderall. Adderall is simply what players tell the public they have been taking, which in this case seems extremely unlikely.



    You say that players claim to be taking Adderall, but that is NOT the case here. Sherman has said that he is being banned for taking that particular banned substance, but is denying it and says he will be exonerated. Now, is he speaking the truth? who knows. I'm sure many guilty people make these claims, but IN THIS CASE, the player is not CLAIMING TO HAVE TAKEN ADDERALL


    Is he claiming not to have taken anything at all, or is he claiming that he will be exonerated for some unspecified reason?
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:16 pm
  • kmedic wrote:I agree with PatsFan- cmon guys, when has a guy getting caught doing Adderal ever had his suspension reversed? And don't you think it's just a little too coincidental that 3 DB's on the same team get caught doing this crap within a couple months? There's obviously a bad apple in the group and I wanna know who it is.


    At least one earlier this year...
    http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2012 ... ppeal.html
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:21 pm
  • manders2600 wrote:
    kidhawk wrote:
    manders2600 wrote:The bottom line, though, is that the league is suspending them for a failed test, not for a failed test specifically because of Adderall. Adderall is simply what players tell the public they have been taking, which in this case seems extremely unlikely.



    You say that players claim to be taking Adderall, but that is NOT the case here. Sherman has said that he is being banned for taking that particular banned substance, but is denying it and says he will be exonerated. Now, is he speaking the truth? who knows. I'm sure many guilty people make these claims, but IN THIS CASE, the player is not CLAIMING TO HAVE TAKEN ADDERALL


    Is he claiming not to have taken anything at all, or is he claiming that he will be exonerated for some unspecified reason?


    I haven't heard a direct quote, only what I heard on the radio that he is appealing his suspension and they are also saying that it is on the basis of poor testing procedures, so I have to assume he's saying he shouldn't be positive at all. If it were something he was taking via prescription like others in the past, then I don't believe he'd be appealing because of testing procedures.

    I just think we should hold off on judgement until the appeal is complete. There have been overturned suspensions before, and Sherman seems to believe he will win his appeal. Haven't heard anything about Browner as of yet, but he's generally quiet about everything.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:27 pm
  • manders2600 wrote:
    kidhawk wrote:
    manders2600 wrote:The bottom line, though, is that the league is suspending them for a failed test, not for a failed test specifically because of Adderall. Adderall is simply what players tell the public they have been taking, which in this case seems extremely unlikely.



    You say that players claim to be taking Adderall, but that is NOT the case here. Sherman has said that he is being banned for taking that particular banned substance, but is denying it and says he will be exonerated. Now, is he speaking the truth? who knows. I'm sure many guilty people make these claims, but IN THIS CASE, the player is not CLAIMING TO HAVE TAKEN ADDERALL


    Is he claiming not to have taken anything at all, or is he claiming that he will be exonerated for some unspecified reason?


    "Something I have never done," Sherman said, referring to the usage of Adderall, a drug typically prescribed to patients suffering from attention deficit disorder. Sherman added that he has not "taken anything," that would cause him to be suspended under the NFL rules for performance-enhancing drugs.


    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100000 ... suspension

    I hope he and Browner are telling the truth, they're my favorite players on this team.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:29 pm
  • on 710 this AM they were saying Adderal is a masking agent taken to cover steroid use.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:30 pm
  • has anybody considered they might be innocent i mean jesus christ everybody is jumping to conclusions
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:31 pm
  • From the reading I've done on adderall it says its most prevalent in colleges with high academic standards. So which one of our DB's came from a school with high standards? I wouldn't be surprised if Sherman has been taking them since his Stanford days. Hopefully they're innocent as they've stated but for now, who knows...
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:34 pm
  • kmedic wrote:I agree with PatsFan- cmon guys, when has a guy getting caught doing Adderal ever had his suspension reversed? And don't you think it's just a little too coincidental that 3 DB's on the same team get caught doing this crap within a couple months? There's obviously a bad apple in the group and I wanna know who it is.


    Every guy in that locker room knows what Adderall is and what it can do for them, and they all know it's banned by the NFL. All those guys made their own choices.

    "I wanna know who it is." I kinda lol'ed at that. So you can take him to task on the boards? There is no "bad apple", some shady character on the practice squad in the locker room whose sole purpose is to score drugs. The guys rolled the dice, a majority of guys in professional sports do at some point in their career. They got caught, they'll pay the consequences.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:41 pm
  • Please let at least ONE if them have diagnosed ADHD.

    Sherman does seem very confident though. He would seem very stupid if he turns out to be clearly guilty, and he knows that.... So stay tuned...
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:43 pm
  • I'm letting it play out. Sherm and Browner seem to think they are innocent. Course who doesn't, but we'll see.
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Re: Sherman and Browner facing suspension
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:49 pm
  • Killa Kam wrote:
    manders2600 wrote:
    Is he claiming not to have taken anything at all, or is he claiming that he will be exonerated for some unspecified reason?


    "Something I have never done," Sherman said, referring to the usage of Adderall, a drug typically prescribed to patients suffering from attention deficit disorder. Sherman added that he has not "taken anything," that would cause him to be suspended under the NFL rules for performance-enhancing drugs.


    http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100000 ... suspension

    I hope he and Browner are telling the truth, they're my favorite players on this team.


    Yeah, that seems way less likely to be over-turned.

    I assumed he would not choose to dispute the testing practices agreed to by the NFLPA, or try to simply say, "The test is wrong".
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 12:56 pm
  • I take adderall. I've taken it since I had to switch off Ritalin because it elevated my heart rate. I have a serious case of ADD which was ADHD when I was a kid. The difference it has made in my life is profound. I am a smart guy for the most part. I was pulling straight F's in school from 4th grade on (because that was the first year they gave out letter grades). My parents ran me through every psychologist and other doctor they could. No solutions were found.

    I was in and out of high school five times before finally being expelled in November of my sophomore year. I finally got a GED at age 18 1/2 due to my brother prodding me to do it. Then I took one college class and it was excruciating. I got a good grade though, as it was a writing class. Then I attempted to take a full load of classes. I failed all of them. I was put on academic probation and tried again. I passed one class and failed the rest. I got a "last chance buddy" from BYU and took only classes that completely interested me, but had nothing to do with my major. I ended up getting straight C's, but it was awful. Luckily I was in a group where I was going overseas and 12 of my credits were tied to that. That was the only thing that helped me to pass, and one art class. So I passed 16 credits. 12 study abroad, 3 art, 1 for golf. That was it. Then I just quit and went to work for a software company. I ended up quitting that job after 3 months. I couldn't handle it.

    This is where I realized I needed help. I went and saw a doctor who was younger and more into the latest and greatest treatments and not the "usual stuff". He looked through all of my school records, had me take tests, etc. He then just observed me taking this survey and said that I had the highest ADD score he'd ever seen, and I was 23 at the time. He said most people outgrow it by adulthood, but that is typically if they have ADD as a child. If they have ADHD as a child then it frequently morphs into ADD as an adult. He put me on medication. Within a week I noticed things were different. I saw the world differently. I was dare I say it, happy? I didn't sit in a chair and freak out. I could sleep. I went to a movie and sat through it. I went and got my job back after some begging and quickly soared to the top of the charts for productivity and got promoted. I decided after a year and a half to give school another try.

    I signed up for the teaching program at Utah Valley State. I ended up graduating in 3.5 years with a 3.95 GPA and perfect evaluation scores. I kept my job the entire time. I was healthy and happy and working 35 hours a week volunteering ten hours a week in elementary schools, and attending school for 4-6 hours a day. It was like night and day. Then I got my first teaching job and everything fell apart within a month. I had stopped taking my meds and I was disorganized, I couldn't remember even small details, I was exhausted, I was confused, I was depressed, I was completely failing at life. I then got back on my meds and things went haywire. It was at this point that they went through a few other meds, and finally found adderall. It took a year to get on Adderall, but I sort of limped along and did ok. The year I got on Adderall I was me again. My students ended up with the highest test scores in the school. I was being interviewed by the district to find out how my scores jumped so much, and it sort of snowballed from there. My students were excelling, and I was promoted to administration. Adderall saved my life and career I think. It also brought out the best in me. There was a clear difference on days when I didn't take my medicine. I was given almost all students with ADD or ADHD because I was able to relate to them and we got along great. I helped a lot of them to love school and to make it through the year and they came out feeling good about themselves and school.

    Why am I going into so much detail? Well.... partially because I have ADD and you can see it come across in my posts. But partially because I hate to see these medications demonized. The FDA is attempting to remove Adderall from the shelves and replace it with Vyvanse, which is a medication that works on the same receptors, but has additional binders and fillers that help to prevent abuse, but also I am extremely allergic to and I can't function on Vyvanse or any other medication. Adderall is the thing that holds my life together and its cousins in the same family of medications gave me a life. They gave me a career, a wife, children, and all things I never could have gotten without treatment.

    I say this with a totally open mind. There is a possibility that we have several players with severe enough cases of ADD that it warrants treatment. You never know. There is also a chance that they think it helps them to play better, or to learn their playbooks, or they were kids who suffered from ADHD and now suffer from Adult ADD like I do, and received it from a doctor who performed the appropriate testing, but failed to get the appropriate waiver from the league (look at the amount of waivers for ADD meds in baseball, it's astronomical, but I can say as a former baseball player that a lot of us kids with ADHD were good at baseball... it was an extremely large amount actually). Look at the compulsive behaviors of athletes. Tightening and retightening gloves, shoes, etc. Adjusting and readjusting chin straps. "Ceremonies" before and during plays that border on obsessive compulsive. I feel that having a good case of ADD can help in sports. I never took my medication before games, and I always felt like I played better off of it. But I did take it everyday when I didn't have a game or after it, because then I could focus on the remainder of my life. I think adrenaline took care of me during game time and my focus was good and such. If anything, I felt like Ritalin/Adderall caused me issues during games. I'd get very dehydrated, my blood sugar would drop, I'd cramp like crazy, etc. But in a normal day it was fine and all went well.

    My hope is that athletes who are abusing it realize that whether they think they are a role model or not doesn't matter to me. The fact is that if they are using the medication improperly then they are creating more issues within the medical community and with the FDA which then creates a stigma and doctors stop prescribing it for those who genuinely need it. But... if players truly need it, and have documentation, then they need to get the proper clearances and get the appropriate waiver from the league. It is the same with many medications. Did you know that athletes can take synthetic testosterone and many do? They need a waiver and league approval because they may suffer from low testosterone. It runs in families. There are a large percentage of athletes who are exceptional who have conditions that allow them to be on medications that don't give them a competitive advantage (such as amphetamine salts like adderall and synthetic t like androgel, testim, and others). They just help the person to fix a chemical imbalance and restore them to a normal level where they are playing and functioning in life at a level they wouldn't be otherwise. I am one of those people, and I hope like heck that these guys did this on the up and up. The chances of 3 of our 8 or so DB's having ADD are slim I guess, but you never know. One or two could be legit, and another could have tried it because the others were using it.

    Another interesting factoid... ask a friend in the Air Force who flies what they carry in their pocket with them. My last discussion with my doctor about adderall and the fear of it being banned was met with a discussion on the fact that most pilots are given adderall by the military to help them focus and make it on long flights, particularly in combat. Soldiers on the ground are frequently given it as well for the same reasons. They use it to pep them up and keep them functioning and to keep their mind from wandering during difficult circumstances, lack of sleep, lack of food, etc. It is a lifesaver for many of our troops. If it was as dangerous as some people say I don't think it would be given out that freely. But I'm biased as I've been given a life by my treatment for ADD. I hope that athletes and others take it seriously that these medications are the difference maker in many children and adult lives and if they are just horsing around then they are damaging the great treatments for a serious disorder and hurting those of us who depend on it for life. But they are also hurting themselves and their teammates by not getting waivers properly and such. If they had, then I don't think there would be an appeal needed, even if they did get the prescription legitimately. They should have learned from Moffit last year. You need to follow protocol and it won't be an issue. If they did, then I apologize for acting like they didn't, but this is something that is very important to me and as many as 5-10 kids in a classroom at any given moment.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:06 pm
  • CrimsonWazzu wrote:
    kmedic wrote:I agree with PatsFan- cmon guys, when has a guy getting caught doing Adderal ever had his suspension reversed? And don't you think it's just a little too coincidental that 3 DB's on the same team get caught doing this crap within a couple months? There's obviously a bad apple in the group and I wanna know who it is.


    Every guy in that locker room knows what Adderall is and what it can do for them, and they all know it's banned by the NFL. All those guys made their own choices.

    "I wanna know who it is." I kinda lol'ed at that. So you can take him to task on the boards? There is no "bad apple", some shady character on the practice squad in the locker room whose sole purpose is to score drugs. The guys rolled the dice, a majority of guys in professional sports do at some point in their career. They got caught, they'll pay the consequences.



    Wait, so you think this scenario played out? Sherm wants to up his game so after careful introspective thought, convinces himself, hey, let me try taking Adderal and get away with it. I'll ask my primary care doctor or some other shady doctor for a Rx and "roll the dice". Maybe my buddy BB will do the same....

    I'm sorry I don't buy that- I think the much more believable scenario was, some dude on the roster, maybe on the active or practice squad, or maybe even an agent, says to Sherm and Browner over dinner or drinks, "yo dude, you guys need to show the 49ers what's up on national TV, I got some good stuff to give you that edge, maybe get you an INT or 2 in front of the whole nation. You might get caught but I got a way for you not to." Of course, it didn't work, but the fact is, my belief is that these guys got influenced by someone. That same someone was probably the same guy who told Winston Guy that this stuff might make him into a starter instead of a bench warmer.

    It's like the guy who got Alex Rodriguez into trouble with roids. Alex didn't obtain the PED's himself- it was a crony who infiltrated his social circle.
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  • Still hoping this was a case of contaminated specimens. Seems more likely because both players got hit for the same thing at once.
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Re: Thoughts on the Browner/Sherm Fiasco
Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:16 pm
  • kmedic wrote:
    CrimsonWazzu wrote:
    kmedic wrote:I agree with PatsFan- cmon guys, when has a guy getting caught doing Adderal ever had his suspension reversed? And don't you think it's just a little too coincidental that 3 DB's on the same team get caught doing this crap within a couple months? There's obviously a bad apple in the group and I wanna know who it is.


    Every guy in that locker room knows what Adderall is and what it can do for them, and they all know it's banned by the NFL. All those guys made their own choices.

    "I wanna know who it is." I kinda lol'ed at that. So you can take him to task on the boards? There is no "bad apple", some shady character on the practice squad in the locker room whose sole purpose is to score drugs. The guys rolled the dice, a majority of guys in professional sports do at some point in their career. They got caught, they'll pay the consequences.



    Wait, so you think this scenario played out? Sherm wants to up his game so after careful introspective thought, convinces himself, hey, let me try taking Adderal and get away with it. I'll ask my primary care doctor or some other shady doctor for a Rx and "roll the dice". Maybe my buddy BB will do the same....

    I'm sorry I don't buy that- I think the much more believable scenario was, some dude on the roster, maybe on the active or practice squad, or maybe even an agent, says to Sherm and Browner over dinner or drinks, "yo dude, you guys need to show the 49ers what's up on national TV, I got some good stuff to give you that edge, maybe get you an INT or 2 in front of the whole nation. You might get caught but I got a way for you not to." Of course, it didn't work, but the fact is, my belief is that these guys got influenced by someone. That same someone was probably the same guy who told Winston Guy that this stuff might make him into a starter instead of a bench warmer.

    It's like the guy who got Alex Rodriguez into trouble with roids. Alex didn't obtain the PED's himself- it was a crony who infiltrated his social circle.


    It wasn't exactly a crony who infiltrated his circle. It was his dumb cousin who worked as basically A-Rod's messenger boy. He went on Alex's directions to get a list of items in the DR under the guise of going to visit the family. Then he was traveling with A-rod everywhere, just as that guy who was with Bonds all the time. He didn't come to Barry, it was the other way around. It was the same with A-rod's cousin. He made a living as A-rod's "bodyguard", but was really just his gopher, and finally the Yankees had to ban him from all team facilities. Then they found out Alex was putting him up in hotel rooms wherever the team stayed and put an end to that as well showing him the clause in his contract that said if he used PED's they could void it. So the guy stayed away. He still keeps getting spotted on road trips however and with A-Rod during the offseason.

    There isn't some case here where some baddy got a hold of Alex and convinced him to use PED's. Alex felt his game slipping (look at his last year in Texas and his first in New York). No way he took them only in Texas for a short time and then stopped. It was more likely he started to slip in Texas after about year 2 and then took them when he got to New York and it was pretty obvious as he gained at least 20 pounds of muscle. I pointed this out and was blasted by Yankees fans who claimed he was just growing into his body, but those who used the same argument on Bonds were labeled as delusional.

    Alex was the instigator, not some slimy back alley guy. It was his kid cousin who was not that intelligent and idolized Alex. He was also not afraid to get busted bringing drugs into the country, because Alex would get him off by paying fines and such, but Alex couldn't be caught himself bringing a year's worth of drugs into the country. This is the same system Sosa was using. Having a drug mule bring stuff in from the DR where it is VERY easy to get and getting it into the states. That is why they didn't have the paper trail guys from the US did who were buying it from "aging prevention" docs through the internet in the USA or through Balco and Victor Conte.
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  • I'm not saying this situation is exactly the same as Alex's history, but I am saying that there is likely someone who is offering this stuff to the players, and to me it looks like someone who is in the social circle of the DB's. I really do not believe that Sherm and BB de novo thought that they should take Adderal out of the blue. Someone convinced them they could get away with it and fed it to them.
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  • they will probably appeal and then won't have to serve their suspensions till next season
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  • So there are three scenarios:

    1) They used Adderall to study playbooks/game film. It's widely used in the NFL to help study, just like it's widely used among college campuses in the US.

    2) They used Adderall to mask physical PEDs (this theory hasn't been tested publicly but makes sense as a rumor and would explain the sudden outburst of Adderall in NFL circles).

    3) They tested positive for something else but are publicly claiming Adderall because the league can't say what PED is actually is. This eliminates the stigma associated with physical PEDs.

    Well now Sherman says he never took Adderall which doesn't make ANY sense on any level for him to say that regardless of which of the above is true.
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  • Sarlacc83 wrote:Still hoping this was a case of contaminated specimens. Seems more likely because both players got hit for the same thing at once.


    Adderall is VERY easy to test for. Contaminated samples aren't likely unless they were all peeing into the same cup. The cup does the test. It has a strip of material on it that lights up for certain drug interactions. The cup is taken into a room and depending on the CBA the player is either watched, or they are in a room with somebody immediately outside the door. The sample is labeled with their name. They urinate in the sterile cup (they break the seal). They then put the cup in a compartment and the cup is removed from the compartment immediately upon their exit and the preliminary tests are run by observing the strip on the side. If something comes up they send off a "b" sample to a lab for further testing. This is how they then differentiate between a specific drug and just a class of drugs. For example, they can test positive for opioids, but then they can run a more specific test and find out what levels and such are going through the blood. I am sure a large percentage of players test positive for opioids due to post game use for immediate pain relief and are just sort of seen as no big deal and "par for the course", but when an amphetamine is picked up then they investigate further. This is probably why they are waiting an appeal. If it has gone to a lab and is verified as adderall, and they find a legitimate doctor who isn't a "farm" and their agent forgot to send in waiver paper work, or it was in process and for some reason there was a mixup (such as the player was given the go-ahead over the phone from the union, but it was a mess up in the process) then it could get thrown out. Another possibility is that they were prescribed the medication legitimately by a doctor during the lockout and called the union. They were told they couldn't get a waiver at that time as there was no contact between players and the league or teams, then they continued using it "as needed" (if that is how the prescription was written) then it could be seen as a paperwork snafu.

    Those are the only cases where I can see that it was a mixup, but a contaminated sample is nearly impossible. However, I have had it happen to me once, it was an under-reading of a medication and they thought I wasn't taking it and was then diverting it. So the failure of the test was because I didn't have the drug in my system. They figured it was a one time thing and the test was just wrong. I never had an issue before or after that and they cleared it from my chart (I am in pain management and am pee tested every 28 days by a VERY ethical clinic). So I've been down this road every 28 days following the normal and best protocol for the last 4 years. They also check your pee temp by the way to make sure you weren't sneaking any in. Funny, but true.
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  • SharkHawk wrote:
    Sarlacc83 wrote:Still hoping this was a case of contaminated specimens. Seems more likely because both players got hit for the same thing at once.


    Adderall is VERY easy to test for. Contaminated samples aren't likely unless they were all peeing into the same cup. The cup does the test. It has a strip of material on it that lights up for certain drug interactions. The cup is taken into a room and depending on the CBA the player is either watched, or they are in a room with somebody immediately outside the door. The sample is labeled with their name. They urinate in the sterile cup (they break the seal). They then put the cup in a compartment and the cup is removed from the compartment immediately upon their exit and the preliminary tests are run by observing the strip on the side. If something comes up they send off a "b" sample to a lab for further testing. This is how they then differentiate between a specific drug and just a class of drugs. For example, they can test positive for opioids, but then they can run a more specific test and find out what levels and such are going through the blood. I am sure a large percentage of players test positive for opioids due to post game use for immediate pain relief and are just sort of seen as no big deal and "par for the course", but when an amphetamine is picked up then they investigate further. This is probably why they are waiting an appeal. If it has gone to a lab and is verified as adderall, and they find a legitimate doctor who isn't a "farm" and their agent forgot to send in waiver paper work, or it was in process and for some reason there was a mixup (such as the player was given the go-ahead over the phone from the union, but it was a mess up in the process) then it could get thrown out. Another possibility is that they were prescribed the medication legitimately by a doctor during the lockout and called the union. They were told they couldn't get a waiver at that time as there was no contact between players and the league or teams, then they continued using it "as needed" (if that is how the prescription was written) then it could be seen as a paperwork snafu.

    Those are the only cases where I can see that it was a mixup, but a contaminated sample is nearly impossible. However, I have had it happen to me once, it was an under-reading of a medication and they thought I wasn't taking it and was then diverting it. So the failure of the test was because I didn't have the drug in my system. They figured it was a one time thing and the test was just wrong. I never had an issue before or after that and they cleared it from my chart (I am in pain management and am pee tested every 28 days by a VERY ethical clinic). So I've been down this road every 28 days following the normal and best protocol for the last 4 years. They also check your pee temp by the way to make sure you weren't sneaking any in. Funny, but true.


    That's good information. I was assuming, however, that the NFL drug policy tests for a bunch of different drugs at once, but then again, what do I know about the secret society that is the National Football League.
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  • GeorgeKush wrote:they will probably appeal and then won't have to serve their suspensions till next season


    What?

    Appeal process will be done this week, which means suspensions will be immediately served.

    Again, I may be wrong, but I can't recall a NFL drug suspension being lessened or overturned. The owness is on the player for knowing what's going into his body, no excuses.
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    GeorgeKush wrote:they will probably appeal and then won't have to serve their suspensions till next season


    What?

    Appeal process will be done this week, which means suspensions will be immediately served.

    Again, I may be wrong, but I can't recall a NFL drug suspension being lessened or overturned. The owness is on the player for knowing what's going into his body, no excuses.

    i thought you could play while it is being appealed. that's what happened to eric wright. his suspected adderall use was announced on 11/9 and he hasn't even started serving his suspension yet. i think it starts next week for him, which is 3 or 4 weeks after the announcement. and i agree, this suspension will be upheld. it just might be delayed and he might have to serve 2 of those games at the beginning of next season.
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    GeorgeKush wrote:they will probably appeal and then won't have to serve their suspensions till next season


    What?

    Appeal process will be done this week, which means suspensions will be immediately served.

    Again, I may be wrong, but I can't recall a NFL drug suspension being lessened or overturned. The owness is on the player for knowing what's going into his body, no excuses.


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