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 Post subject: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:31 am 
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Can Russ be succesful as a big numbers QB? Can he handle getting 40 throws in a game that we fall behind/ lynch hurt? He wins games as a point guard qb but can he still be good when we don't have a stellar defense to rely on. I believe he would be able to do it, but we would need one more dominant receiver to help him out. I'm also not saying this is likely to happen this season or next, but if he is our QBOTF, he probably won't have as good of a defense and run game as he has now. He might have to step into a pass happy offense when he matures. How do you think he will handle it?

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:34 am 
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Our team's identity was literally built around running the ball and playing stout defense. I don't think that identity will change at any point in the Carroll era, regardless of injuries or game situation.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:50 am 
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I wouldn't be so quick to assume that. How many players are left from our Super Bowl season? 2? In 8 years if Wilson is still our qb the team will have changed slot. Not as much because when PC/JS came in they cleaned house, but Its too far in the future to assume we will be the same team.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 9:04 am 
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seahawksfanatic000 wrote:
I wouldn't be so quick to assume that. How many players are left from our Super Bowl season? 2?


But our Super Bowl team was largely composed of veterans in or past their prime. Our current team is almost entirely young guys already racking up Pro Bowl nominations. They are very different teams with very different futures.

I'm not saying Lynch can't get injured, but PC has built the depth of this team to preserve its identity. Wilson can probably handle a few extra carries, but Pete is determined to run the ball. He fired Jeremy Bates for not running.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 9:09 am 
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Teams that pass 40 times a game are usually losing. He is a rookie doing a fantastic job.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:00 am 
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There were games during Pete's first season with us when the running game just wasn't working and Pete made the call to put the team on Hass's shoulders with mixed results (not all Hass's fault). I'm sure he'll do it with Russ in the same situation. Can Russ handle it? Well if you consider the following taits:

-Prepares well for games and is a student of the game
-So far looks like a natural leader
-Even-keeled dispostion regardless of the chaos around him
-A rocket arm and a beautiful deep ball
-A feel for the pocket
-Mobilty and elusiveness

Let's just say I like his chances.

Am I missing anything? :sarcasm_on: Oh yeah, too short to be any good in the NFL :mrgreen: :sarcasm_off:


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:04 am 
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How well did he do in the Patriots game...you know the one where Lynch was mostly ineffective....


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:11 am 
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He is doing a fantastic job but it is also a valid question. Many here want him in the ROY conversation and in so want to compare his stats to Luck. It is difficult to make an accurate comparison due precisely to the question the OP posted. Luck is in a situation that requires he carry his team from kickoff to whistle every game. It is pretty easy to get overwhelmed in that scenario.

It is also hard to tell how Luck would be doing in our offense. Some of the things folks are excited about with Wilson is his ability to come through in the clutch. Would Luck have been able to put up 14 come from behind points in the Pats game? I don't know just like I don't know that Wilson's stats would look as good if he were having to throw the ball 50 times a game.

At this point I don't believe Wilson is capable of carrying a team the way Luck is. He has made great strides since the beginning of the year but he also has been somewhat protected and in truth didn't look very good the first few games of the season even with that protection. Would he still be developing as fast if he were being asked to throw the ball constantly from the beginning of the season? I kind of doubt it. To believe that kind of ignores the league wide belief that it is better to bring your rookies along at a slower pace.

You can see Wilson's confidence in being able to see the whole field, utilize his throwing lanes, standing tall in the pocket on and on, is improving from game to game but if your not being completely bias you can also see he still has a way's to go before he is capable of doing that 100% of the time and could be relied upon to carry his team from kickoff to whistle if needed.

I love what I am seeing so far and the sky appears to be the limit for this kid but whether or not his height will become a complete non factor or if he will be able to be dominant, is yet still to be seen. He definitely seems to have the clutch gene though and appears to prepare as well as anyone who plays the game and those two things are a huge advantage in the development process.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:16 am 
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seahawksfanatic000 wrote:
Can Russ be succesful as a big numbers QB? Can he handle getting 40 throws in a game that we fall behind/ lynch hurt? He wins games as a point guard qb but can he still be good when we don't have a stellar defense to rely on. I believe he would be able to do it, but we would need one more dominant receiver to help him out. I'm also not saying this is likely to happen this season or next, but if he is our QBOTF, he probably won't have as good of a defense and run game as he has now. He might have to step into a pass happy offense when he matures. How do you think he will handle it?


First, this is a great question. I think the answer is: Not yet. But soon enough.

Pete wants a multiple offense. We are not there yet, but we are getting there.

Russell will handle it just like he did at Wisconsin, very well. When he needed to take games over, he took games over.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 10:57 am 
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My opinion is that PC has done and is doing RW a great service in that he is bringing him along at a moderate pace. The foundation is being built slowing but in a deliberate manner. This will pay dividends down the road and not too far down the road at that. Once RW arrives at whatever destination PC has assigned him RW will be better able to handle whatever game plan he is tasked to carry out. The great QBs can perform week to week in almost any environment because of the foundation laid in their development. PC understands that the Hawks will have to throw the ball more at times because of the different defenses they will need to confront. And because of that RW will be ready to throw the ball a lot in certain games. This is all a process and it is coming along nicely.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:08 am 
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RichNhansom wrote:
Would Luck have been able to put up 14 come from behind points in the Pats game?


I think we saw the answer to this question 2 weeks ago ??


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:24 am 
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I don't know, those first couple of Patriot Super Bowl teams were build more like our current team than their current team. In those days TFB didn't pass anywhere near as much as they do now and they had both a power running game and a very stout defense. So it's entirely possible that this team changes over the years to a more pass oriented one.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:41 am 
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SacHawk2.0 wrote:
I don't know, those first couple of Patriot Super Bowl teams were build more like our current team than their current team. In those days TFB didn't pass anywhere near as much as they do now and they had both a power running game and a very stout defense. So it's entirely possible that this team changes over the years to a more pass oriented one.


I was about to say! Just like the Pats, Tom Brady started out as a point guard QB. I think if/when our team ever deteriorates to the point where we can't rely on our defense AND running game, that Russell will get more free reign to pass the ball. Honestly, I like it better that way. Get comfortable in the offense, and then go destroy secondaries league wide.


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 12:44 pm 
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My dad and I just had this discussion on Thanksgiving. We like everything we have seen from the young QB who is having one of the best rookie campaigns in history....by way of efficiency. Sooner or later however, we are going to run into a team in the regular season....or more likely in the playoffs, whose intent is to stop our running game at any cost. The cost is to put the game on Wilson's shoulders and make him beat you. To me, this is really the only true test that Wilson still needs to have. One of the main variables to this test however, is that our Offensive Line is built to suit the running game and not built to secure a pocket for 4-5 seconds consistently for an entire game.

So the conclusion that my dad and I came up with is this: We were in 100% agreement that if our line was built first and four most for pass protection, Russell Wilson would have a field day. If the kid has time to throw, he can and will pick you apart. So with that said, with our current make up on the O-line, having to pass our way to a win can be successful, but will rely on moving the pocket around for Wilson to find his passing lanes. It will also rely on Wilson to scramble outside more than the average. This is good and bad. Big plays may result, but he is also vulnerable to a big hit and injury.

I do want to see him go and win a game for us by throwing 45 balls and 400 yards. The only way this happens is that we are playing from a couple of td's behind. Heck, the kid's a winner. Something tells me he will find a way to win, no matter the circumstances.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 12:49 pm 
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Of course Wilson can carry the load and throw 40+ times a game and win! Did anyone watch his college games? The kid is a gunslinger, through and through! Now do we want him to HAVE TO? Of course, NO! But certainly Wilson could do a fabulous job with a pass-first game plan against an opponent that is geared up to stop the Seahawks run game. Pete should try this game plan against upcoming opponents with weak secondaries/pass defense numbers, the score-early-and-often via the pass approach.


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 12:57 pm 
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impacthawk wrote:
My dad and I just had this discussion on Thanksgiving. We like everything we have seen from the young QB who is having one of the best rookie campaigns in history....by way of efficiency. Sooner or later however, we are going to run into a team in the regular season....or more likely in the playoffs, whose intent is to stop our running game at any cost. The cost is to put the game on Wilson's shoulders and make him beat you. To me, this is really the only true test that Wilson still needs to have. One of the main variables to this test however, is that our Offensive Line is built to suit the running game and not built to secure a pocket for 4-5 seconds consistently for an entire game.

So the conclusion that my dad and I came up with is this: We were in 100% agreement that if our line was built first and four most for pass protection, Russell Wilson would have a field day. If the kid has time to throw, he can and will pick you apart. So with that said, with our current make up on the O-line, having to pass our way to a win can be successful, but will rely on moving the pocket around for Wilson to find his passing lanes. It will also rely on Wilson to scramble outside more than the average. This is good and bad. Big plays may result, but he is also vulnerable to a big hit and injury.

I do want to see him go and win a game for us by throwing 45 balls and 400 yards. The only way this happens is that we are playing from a couple of td's behind. Heck, the kid's a winner. Something tells me he will find a way to win, no matter the circumstances.



Pats game. Russ balled when Lynch got nothing on his runs. Finished with 15 carries for 41 yards, long of 7.


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 1:42 pm 
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hawksfan515 wrote:
impacthawk wrote:
My dad and I just had this discussion on Thanksgiving. We like everything we have seen from the young QB who is having one of the best rookie campaigns in history....by way of efficiency. Sooner or later however, we are going to run into a team in the regular season....or more likely in the playoffs, whose intent is to stop our running game at any cost. The cost is to put the game on Wilson's shoulders and make him beat you. To me, this is really the only true test that Wilson still needs to have. One of the main variables to this test however, is that our Offensive Line is built to suit the running game and not built to secure a pocket for 4-5 seconds consistently for an entire game.

So the conclusion that my dad and I came up with is this: We were in 100% agreement that if our line was built first and four most for pass protection, Russell Wilson would have a field day. If the kid has time to throw, he can and will pick you apart. So with that said, with our current make up on the O-line, having to pass our way to a win can be successful, but will rely on moving the pocket around for Wilson to find his passing lanes. It will also rely on Wilson to scramble outside more than the average. This is good and bad. Big plays may result, but he is also vulnerable to a big hit and injury.

I do want to see him go and win a game for us by throwing 45 balls and 400 yards. The only way this happens is that we are playing from a couple of td's behind. Heck, the kid's a winner. Something tells me he will find a way to win, no matter the circumstances.



Pats game. Russ balled when Lynch got nothing on his runs. Finished with 15 carries for 41 yards, long of 7.


Did it IN Detroit too, different result because the defense couldn't stop a toddler that game.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 12:45 am 
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Wow, of course he could do it if our O-line was holding for 4-5 seconds on every play and opening throwing lanes on every down but so could Ryan Leaf and Jamaecuss Russell. That O-line play your complaining about is mostly the fault of the guy holding the ball longer than any QB in the NFL.

Quote: "Of course Wilson can carry the load and throw 40+ times a game and win! Did anyone watch his college games? The kid is a gunslinger, through and through!"
Well then yes, I want him to. Who wouldn't? Unless of course there is a difference between college and the NFL. Naw that's just dumb talk. Of course there is no difference and that is why every good college QB has been ridiculously successful at the NFL level. Right???

Keep in mind I am not bashing Wilson here, I am bashing the guys who apparently believe he is already at his peak based on college performance or because his boneheaded team/ coordinator is slowing him down. The guy has played admirably in ten games. Made a ton of rookie mistakes and also shown some flashes of brilliance but it is probably fair to say he is not "YET" the best QB to ever touch a football.

It's OK to like him without wanting to swallow his unborn children.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:06 am 
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Largent80 wrote:
Teams that pass 40 times a game are usually losing. He is a rookie doing a fantastic job.

You mean like the Patriots and Packers?


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:25 am 
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-The Glove- wrote:
Largent80 wrote:
Teams that pass 40 times a game are usually losing. He is a rookie doing a fantastic job.

You mean like the Patriots and Packers?


Largent thinks it's still 1970.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 6:30 am 
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Wow, of course he could do it if our O-line was holding for 4-5 seconds on every play and opening throwing lanes on every down but so could Ryan Leaf and Jamaecuss Russell. That O-line play your complaining about is mostly the fault of the guy holding the ball longer than any QB in the NFL.

Quote: "Of course Wilson can carry the load and throw 40+ times a game and win! Did anyone watch his college games? The kid is a gunslinger, through and through!"
Well then yes, I want him to. Who wouldn't? Unless of course there is a difference between college and the NFL. Naw that's just dumb talk. Of course there is no difference and that is why every good college QB has been ridiculously successful at the NFL level. Right???

Keep in mind I am not bashing Wilson here, I am bashing the guys who apparently believe he is already at his peak based on college performance or because his boneheaded team/ coordinator is slowing him down. The guy has played admirably in ten games. Made a ton of rookie mistakes and also shown some flashes of brilliance but it is probably fair to say he is not "YET" the best QB to ever touch a football.

It's OK to like him without wanting to swallow his unborn children.

That is the second time I have seen that line from you. Who are you, Mike Tyson?
Wait a tic, I get it. You mean pre-conception! ewwwwwwwwww!

The rest of your post wasn't any fun to read. Maybe you sat on your keys when you logged on today, and the discomfort made you crabby. I have no idea who you are arguing with when you argue against him being the best QB to ever touch a football. I guess if you wanted to argue the college stuff, Russell carried his team at the end of games at the highest level of college competition, and since he has not had a 40 throw game in the Pros, that is all we have to go on. He didn't do it running some funky spread either, he did it throwing to very average college receivers in an offensive system that has some similarities to the Seahawks offense.

And who said Russell is already at his peak?

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 7:53 am 
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Agree with many strong points about RW discussed... trying to watch objectively, I think he could be further along if he had been taller throughout his career (and now too). Might he better than Luck, probably?


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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:00 am 
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Scottemojo wrote:
RichNhansom wrote:
Wow, of course he could do it if our O-line was holding for 4-5 seconds on every play and opening throwing lanes on every down but so could Ryan Leaf and Jamaecuss Russell. That O-line play your complaining about is mostly the fault of the guy holding the ball longer than any QB in the NFL.

Quote: "Of course Wilson can carry the load and throw 40+ times a game and win! Did anyone watch his college games? The kid is a gunslinger, through and through!"
Well then yes, I want him to. Who wouldn't? Unless of course there is a difference between college and the NFL. Naw that's just dumb talk. Of course there is no difference and that is why every good college QB has been ridiculously successful at the NFL level. Right???

Keep in mind I am not bashing Wilson here, I am bashing the guys who apparently believe he is already at his peak based on college performance or because his boneheaded team/ coordinator is slowing him down. The guy has played admirably in ten games. Made a ton of rookie mistakes and also shown some flashes of brilliance but it is probably fair to say he is not "YET" the best QB to ever touch a football.

It's OK to like him without wanting to swallow his unborn children.

That is the second time I have seen that line from you. Who are you, Mike Tyson?
Wait a tic, I get it. You mean pre-conception! ewwwwwwwwww!

The rest of your post wasn't any fun to read. Maybe you sat on your keys when you logged on today, and the discomfort made you crabby. I have no idea who you are arguing with when you argue against him being the best QB to ever touch a football. I guess if you wanted to argue the college stuff, Russell carried his team at the end of games at the highest level of college competition, and since he has not had a 40 throw game in the Pros, that is all we have to go on. He didn't do it running some funky spread either, he did it throwing to very average college receivers in an offensive system that has some similarities to the Seahawks offense.

And who said Russell is already at his peak?


I absolutely hate it when that happens! Seriously, nothing makes me crabbier than forgetting that my keys are in my back pocket and then sitting down, having my keys dig into me, and being too lazy or too preoccupied to care until the frustration and irritation forces me to take the keys out of my pocket. I can see why RichNHansom would be crabby in such a situation...

Seriously though, that really was no fun to read. It brought a little tear to my eye, and not the good kind, to know that there are still Seahawks fans out there that want to sit on the fence as long as they can with regards to Wilson. Nobody's saying he's the greatest QB to ever touch a football. What people are wondering in this thread is if he can handle having to throw the ball 40 times in a game and still manage to play as efficient as he is now en route to a victory.

At least that's what I gathered.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:45 am 
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I don't see why he couldn't. That said, it's not a huge concern for me. I think he surpasses 300 yards in a game today, FWIW.

I'm more concerned about throws you don't see him make, like short slants or short back shoulder throws. Throws that can make your life easier against good pass rushes. Not hugely concerned. Just curious.

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 Post subject: Re: Can Russ be succesful with more responsibilities?
 Post Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 5:15 pm 
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I would just like to bring this up again, because now it becomes a very valid point. some of you said that there is no way that our run game and defense will just dissapear. well that might have just happened.

Now it is up to Wilson to truly carry this team. the defense will lose two of its cornerstone players. our line is too pourous for lynch to get any yards. Wilson will lead us to the playoff. In the coming weeks i believe he will become the best thing about this team. It will give him the experience of playing and winning on a sub par team. He will win for his team and fans. and that, my friends is what he is going to have to do.

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