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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 8:51 am 
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Washed up? Not sure how you can say this seeing as Leon is the reason Russell and Rice hooked up to beat the Pats. So right there IMO he's worth his salary this year. Leon also had a great return to set up a win in Arizona, but the offense couldn't score with like seven chances inside the 10 yard line.

You need your return game to help win 2-3 games per year, and so far Leon's on pace for that. It's not his fault he's had very few opportunities..........and when he's had a chance to return punts his blockers aren't getting the job done most of the time.

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:24 am 
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I can see making additions to the OLine every year, until they are solid with depth. It is the key to so much offensively and we know how quickly an injured line can be exposed. That is why I think that one should be drafted in the first 3 rounds every year along with one longshot in the later rounds.

LW?? The guy is pretty versatile, but I think he is looking for the home-run on every play. Even the wife can't stand watching him run backwards looking for a hole. Last week, he cost a few yards doing that and then the PR from the end zone? He was lucky to make it to the 21 that time.

I say let Leon return for the season and if still hoses it, then look at Tate. Tate is a fantastic runner at times, tough and makes people miss. Leon works hard in the few carries he sees and is a good receiver out of the backfield, I am just not ready to call him washed up yet.

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:43 am 
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Agree with dumping both of these players after the season.

It's frustrating watching Leon take the ball out at least five yards deep in the endzone and get stopped before the fifteen. No need to hurt Russell and the offensive by making their drive five yards longer.
Last week against the Vikings, he returned a punt while standing in the endzone. Awful. If he wouldn't have taken that back to the twenty where he got tackled, I wouldn't have been surprised to see Tate returning punts.

Breno isn't starting caliber. Too many boneheaded penalties that stalls drives. Against Detroit where Suh basically picked him up and drove him back five yards was embarassing.

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:47 am 
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Jerhawk wrote:
It's frustrating watching Leon take the ball out at least five yards deep in the endzone and get stopped before the fifteen. No need to hurt Russell and the offensive by making their drive five yards longer.
Last week against the Vikings, he returned a punt while standing in the endzone. Awful. If he wouldn't have taken that back to the twenty where he got tackled, I wouldn't have been surprised to see Tate returning punts.


I think even Leon agrees that it was a bonehead play, but it shows that he's frustrated and hungry to make a play.

The bottom line for me is you don't replace a player unless you have a better player in line to take his place...........and as of now we don't. Leon is still a top 10 return guy in the NFL. Plus he's a veteran that doesn't fumble the ball. Just ask the 49'ers how valuable that is.

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:54 am 
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This is way too soon for this.

We need to bring in a stud linebacker.

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:12 am 
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loafoftatupu wrote:
I can see making additions to the OLine every year, until they are solid with depth. It is the key to so much offensively and we know how quickly an injured line can be exposed. That is why I think that one should be drafted in the first 3 rounds every year along with one longshot in the later rounds.

LW?? The guy is pretty versatile, but I think he is looking for the home-run on every play. Even the wife can't stand watching him run backwards looking for a hole. Last week, he cost a few yards doing that and then the PR from the end zone? He was lucky to make it to the 21 that time.

I say let Leon return for the season and if still hoses it, then look at Tate. Tate is a fantastic runner at times, tough and makes people miss. Leon works hard in the few carries he sees and is a good receiver out of the backfield, I am just not ready to call him washed up yet.


Oh I vehimently disagree with letting Tate return kicks, and it's not that I think he'd be bad at it (far from it, I think he'd be great). No, if Walter Thurmond has taught us anything, it's that you don't throw a vital starter to the wolves by having him return kicks (yes, Tate is a vital starter). T3 has never really recovered from that horrible knee injury he sustained returning a kick in college. Kick return is like the fricken Thunderdome. Let a back up change of pace guy like Leon do the deed for sure, but your starting WR? No way. Tate is proving to be way too valuable for the offense. I bet Earl Thomas would be amongst the very best returners in the whole entire league, but he is way to valuable to our defense to have him out there playing demolition derby returning kicks.

Unfortunately, I think the change in the kick off rule really screwed Leon. He just doesn't get the opportunities to earn the incentives in the contract we gave him (our defense being amongst the league leaders in points against probably isn't helping him either - not that I'd complain). A quick look at his stats on Profootballreference.com actually shows that for all his kickoff returns are way down from years past (he's on pace for 26 returns on the year compared to 50 every full year he's played - not counting his first year or the injury year) but his average return is actually way up (30 yards per return vs. about 25 in years past). He just hasn't taken one to the house yet since they changed the kickoff.

I'd maybe be on the lookout for a replacement burner returner (is that like hitter tackler?) because Leon ain't getting any younger, but I don't think it's a glaring need right now. Leon's still Leon as far as I'm concerned...

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 Post subject: Re: Two to replace next offseason: Leon and Breno
 Post Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:22 am 
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The reason for this thread wasn't to say that Leon or Breno are terrible players. Leon WAS an excellent returner for his entire career, and this year is average to above average. However, he is no spring chicken, and I was advocating to spend a later round pick on a specialist as to plan for Leon's replacement in a year or so.

And with respect to what I'm "smokin", there is absolutely no way I buy that Breno is, by his own merits, a quality starting tackle. I have eyes like everyone else here, and I would ask you to go back and watch the Vikings game. Each time RW is flushed out of the pocket or Lynch is hit for a loss or no gain, it is invariably due to Breno being dominated by the defender. Just watch him try to defend the bull rush like he did against the 49ers...he gets manhandled by any quality lineman.

However, I agree with radish that despite these shortcomings there are more important things than talent along the OL. He is being coached well and hopefully will improve. But don't act like he is a great player.


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