Why all of the impatiences?

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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:21 am
  • Impatience? Instant gratification? Maybe know your audience, dude. You may be content with 8-8. Some of us have supported this team without missing a season, for every year of the franchise's existence. I want to win. And I have no respect for fans who are 'okay' with 8 losses and mediocrity.

    To each their own but we are of a different breed.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:43 am
  • bestfightstory wrote:Impatience? Instant gratification? Maybe know your audience, dude. You may be content with 8-8. Some of us have supported this team without missing a season, for every year of the franchise's existence. I want to win. And I have no respect for fans who are 'okay' with 8 losses and mediocrity.

    To each their own but we are of a different breed.


    Please don't imply things out of context. I said I would be happy with being 8-8 IF it was working towards being a winning dynasty for years to come. If Wilson was a 3-4 year starting vet, then NO, I would not be happy with being 8-8 this season.

    I also want to see the Seahawks win.....and, I also have been a year-to-year fan ever since the franchise was established.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:50 am
  • To the OP: there are several threads you could have squatted and done this in. Take a moment to scan even the first page of the Hawks forum.

    +1 on NO hate of PC or RW here (by anyone here I believe). I've stated a raised brow in Pete's direction on the RW start decision, but "hate" towards either that is not.
    Your thread is full of misinformation, get with the program is all I can suggest.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:51 am
  • Nunya wrote: I said I would be happy with being 8-8 IF it was working towards being a winning dynasty for years to come. If Wilson was a 3-4 year starting vet, then NO, I would not be happy with being 8-8 this season.

    I also want to see the Seahawks win.....and, I also have been a year-to-year fan ever since the franchise was established.


    I think this is a dangerous mindset. There are no guarantees in the NFL, too many variables to assume we'll be good for years to come.

    - injuries
    - player changes every year
    - performance fluctuations
    - coaching continuity

    The NFL is a win now league, you HAVE to put your best players on the field every single week. We don't know if the defense will be this good next year. We don't know if key players will leave via free agency. We don't know if the injury bug will jump up and bit us next year. We don't know if key players will be as good in future years as they are this year.

    To say "let's let Wilson develop to the detriment of this year in hopes that he's really good in future years" is good way for people to lose their jobs if things don't work out.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:08 am
  • I don't understand why some don't want to even see if Flynn could be the real deal. If you want to talk pipe dreams ir is far less likely that Wilson will become good enough in time for the playoffs to be effective than it is that Flynn could be what this team needs to be elite and it's not like he is going anywhere for the next four years minimum.

    Next year will be the last year of many of our key players contracts. We won't likely keep them all so we could easily regress. We could possibly be missing our window right now.

    Does anyone believe we have a legitimate shot at beating the Niners with our offense right now? The Niners are not the Panthers. We could get blown out. Sure Flynn might not change that but he just might also. You just don't know unless you try and Wilson will get better on or off the field. If you believe he won't then you are not being honest.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:29 am
  • A lot of the disagreement seems to stem from a fundamental difference of opinions in how QBs develop.

    Some folks think QBs develop best on the bench.

    These people are usually calling for Flynn. They think that his 4 years of bench sitting give him a veteran understanding of the game that will result in immediate improvement at the QB position. And they also believe that Wilson will develop by sitting. It's a best-case situation for them to have Flynn start and Wilson sit and learn.

    Others folks think QBs need playing time to develop.

    These people are usually insistent on sticking with Wilson as the starter. Wilson has more actual game experience at the college and pro levels now, and they feel that sitting him is wasting time. Additionally, they don't believe that Flynn's time on the bench means he is more prepared to lead a pro offense.

    I fall into the second camp, and I don't think you have to look any further than our own Matt Hasselbeck for evidence. He sat for two years in the same Green Bay QB factory that Flynn hails from, and he still stunk it up in his first season as a starter. Only through playing time did he develop into the guy who led us to the SB.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:52 am
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    I fall into the second camp, and I don't think you have to look any further than our own Matt Hasselbeck for evidence. He sat for two years in the same Green Bay QB factory that Flynn hails from, and he still stunk it up in his first season as a starter. Only through playing time did he develop into the guy who led us to the SB.


    Also from the same QB factory came a QB named Aaron Rodgers, who was the MVP last year, and had no growing pains from holding a clipboard for years.

    I have no problems with a starting a rookie, as long as said rookie is better equipped to run the offense than the other QB's on the roster. Those of us in the Flynn camp don't think Wilson is there yet, and is actually hurting our chances at making the playoffs in 2012.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:00 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    volsunghawk wrote:
    I fall into the second camp, and I don't think you have to look any further than our own Matt Hasselbeck for evidence. He sat for two years in the same Green Bay QB factory that Flynn hails from, and he still stunk it up in his first season as a starter. Only through playing time did he develop into the guy who led us to the SB.


    Also from the same QB factory came a QB named Aaron Rodgers, who was the MVP last year, and had no growing pains from holding a clipboard for years.

    I have no problems with a starting a rookie, as long as said rookie is better equipped to run the offense than the other QB's on the roster. Those of us in the Flynn camp don't think Wilson is there yet, and is actually hurting our chances at making the playoffs in 2012.


    Also, Aaron Brooks. Notice what happens when that backup QB leaves the QB factory and goes elsewhere, as opposed to being a 1st round draft choice who isn't sitting to develop, but instead just waiting out a HOFer's last years.

    I don't think Wilson is immune to rookie struggles, but I don't think that Flynn is immune from struggling with a new team and unfamiliar supporting cast, either. And I think Wilson's talent dwarfs (no pun intended) Flynn's. It's a sure thing that his work ethic does. In other words, I think Wilson and Flynn may be neck and neck when it comes to who the best QB is right now, but I believe that Wilson will improve faster than Flynn and deliver better results, and he must play to develop.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:03 pm
  • Throwdown wrote:
    Largent80 wrote:This place would have been unbearable if we had lost last Sunday Throw, and I think that the OP was stating was was obvious in the past week before that game.

    And by the way...... :2:


    I would've taken the longest hiatus EVER


    I'd be banned today for throwing around F bombs in the main forum.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:04 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    volsunghawk wrote:
    I fall into the second camp, and I don't think you have to look any further than our own Matt Hasselbeck for evidence. He sat for two years in the same Green Bay QB factory that Flynn hails from, and he still stunk it up in his first season as a starter. Only through playing time did he develop into the guy who led us to the SB.


    Also from the same QB factory came a QB named Aaron Rodgers, who was the MVP last year, and had no growing pains from holding a clipboard for years.

    I have no problems with a starting a rookie, as long as said rookie is better equipped to run the offense than the other QB's on the roster. Those of us in the Flynn camp don't think Wilson is there yet, and is actually hurting our chances at making the playoffs in 2012.


    Unless you count being on a team that goes 6-10 as growing pains.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:06 pm
  • hawkfan1975 wrote:To the OP: there are several threads you could have squatted and done this in. Take a moment to scan even the first page of the Hawks forum.


    I already apologizes for that. Please don't make me apologize again, I hate apologizing....just ask my wife.

    Yes, I was a bad boy for posting before reading, but I was so excited to be a .net member. :th2thumbs:

    +1 on NO hate of PC or RW here (by anyone here I believe). I've stated a raised brow in Pete's direction on the RW start deI already apologized for thatcision, but "hate" towards either that is not.
    Your thread is full of misinformation, get with the program is all I can suggest.


    I'm not sure what "misinformation" you are talking about. I thought I was clear that I wasn't necessarily talking about this forum. I was talking about Seahawk forums as a whole (and there are a lot of them). The hate for PC is there....believe me.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:09 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Nunya wrote: I said I would be happy with being 8-8 IF it was working towards being a winning dynasty for years to come. If Wilson was a 3-4 year starting vet, then NO, I would not be happy with being 8-8 this season.

    I also want to see the Seahawks win.....and, I also have been a year-to-year fan ever since the franchise was established.


    I think this is a dangerous mindset. There are no guarantees in the NFL, too many variables to assume we'll be good for years to come.

    - injuries
    - player changes every year
    - performance fluctuations
    - coaching continuity

    The NFL is a win now league, you HAVE to put your best players on the field every single week. We don't know if the defense will be this good next year. We don't know if key players will leave via free agency. We don't know if the injury bug will jump up and bit us next year. We don't know if key players will be as good in future years as they are this year.

    To say "let's let Wilson develop to the detriment of this year in hopes that he's really good in future years" is good way for people to lose their jobs if things don't work out.


    If people thought that way, NOBODY would every draft a rookie QB until there was no other choice. A rookie QB needs time to develop. Some of them can come right onto the field and preform very well, but most can't.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:47 pm
  • volsunghawk wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    volsunghawk wrote:
    I fall into the second camp, and I don't think you have to look any further than our own Matt Hasselbeck for evidence. He sat for two years in the same Green Bay QB factory that Flynn hails from, and he still stunk it up in his first season as a starter. Only through playing time did he develop into the guy who led us to the SB.


    Also from the same QB factory came a QB named Aaron Rodgers, who was the MVP last year, and had no growing pains from holding a clipboard for years.

    I have no problems with a starting a rookie, as long as said rookie is better equipped to run the offense than the other QB's on the roster. Those of us in the Flynn camp don't think Wilson is there yet, and is actually hurting our chances at making the playoffs in 2012.


    Also, Aaron Brooks. Notice what happens when that backup QB leaves the QB factory and goes elsewhere, as opposed to being a 1st round draft choice who isn't sitting to develop, but instead just waiting out a HOFer's last years.

    I don't think Wilson is immune to rookie struggles, but I don't think that Flynn is immune from struggling with a new team and unfamiliar supporting cast, either. And I think Wilson's talent dwarfs (no pun intended) Flynn's. It's a sure thing that his work ethic does. In other words, I think Wilson and Flynn may be neck and neck when it comes to who the best QB is right now, but I believe that Wilson will improve faster than Flynn and deliver better results, and he must play to develop.


    You said it better then I could.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:07 pm
  • Nunya wrote:
    If people thought that way, NOBODY would every draft a rookie QB until there was no other choice. A rookie QB needs time to develop. Some of them can come right onto the field and preform very well, but most can't.


    Right most can't, so you agree with me. There's a reason that in the history of the league, only a handful of rookie QB's have performed well right out of college.

    We can talk all day about upside and who gives us a better chance of winning in future years, but you'll never convince me that Wilson gives us the best chance to win now. This is evident by his poor passer rating, inability to score in the red zone and the Hawks #31 rank in passing.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:11 pm
  • RichNhansom wrote:I don't understand why some don't want to even see if Flynn could be the real deal. If you want to talk pipe dreams ir is far less likely that Wilson will become good enough in time for the playoffs to be effective than it is that Flynn could be what this team needs to be elite and it's not like he is going anywhere for the next four years minimum.

    Next year will be the last year of many of our key players contracts. We won't likely keep them all so we could easily regress. We could possibly be missing our window right now.

    Does anyone believe we have a legitimate shot at beating the Niners with our offense right now? The Niners are not the Panthers. We could get blown out. Sure Flynn might not change that but he just might also. You just don't know unless you try and Wilson will get better on or off the field. If you believe he won't then you are not being honest.


    Correct me if I am wrong RnH, but when some wanted to see what they had in Whitehurst, didn't you, as an ardent Hasselbeck supporter, point out quite often that we needed to trust the guys who get to see them both in practice every day?
    And if that was you, what changed?
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:18 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Nunya wrote:
    If people thought that way, NOBODY would every draft a rookie QB until there was no other choice. A rookie QB needs time to develop. Some of them can come right onto the field and preform very well, but most can't.


    Right most can't, so you agree with me. There's a reason that in the history of the league, only a handful of rookie QB's have performed well right out of college.

    We can talk all day about upside and who gives us a better chance of winning in future years, but you'll never convince me that Wilson gives us the best chance to win now. This is evident by his poor passer rating, inability to score in the red zone and the Hawks #31 rank in passing.


    You are right, we COULD talk about it all day, and I'm not convinced that Flynn would give us any better chance then Wilson. The inability to score is definitely a concern, but the stats are meaningless to me. Stats will only tell you what you want to see. I guess we just have to agree to disagree.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:39 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Nunya wrote:
    If people thought that way, NOBODY would every draft a rookie QB until there was no other choice. A rookie QB needs time to develop. Some of them can come right onto the field and preform very well, but most can't.


    Right most can't, so you agree with me. There's a reason that in the history of the league, only a handful of rookie QB's have performed well right out of college.

    We can talk all day about upside and who gives us a better chance of winning in future years, but you'll never convince me that Wilson gives us the best chance to win now. This is evident by his poor passer rating, inability to score in the red zone and the Hawks #31 rank in passing.


    I guess to elaborate a little more (I have time at the moment and am bored)....if I was the coach, and based on my limited knowledge, I would have started Flynn at the start of the season. My reasoning is that Flynn was the more experienced QB at the time, even though it was not much more experience. However, the coaches have a lot more info then I do and they decided to start Wilson for what ever reason.

    Wilson has not done too bad. He has hit a learning curve that one would expect from a rookie, but overall, he hasn't done bad. As I said the TDs are a concern, but I believe that will eventually be worked out. I base this on the fact that they offense CAN move the ball.

    The reason I am against "changing horse" is that the whole team is affected. Flynn will have his own "learning curve" he will have to overcome. The whole offensive dynamics change. The OC will have to relearn what plays work best for Flynn vs Wilson. The blocking scheme may have to change. And the routes may have to change. We could be faced with the possibility of having to start from square one....all on a "what-if....could-be" possibility. I do not think the Seahawks would come out ahead by scraping any offensive plan built to date.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:48 pm
  • Scottemojo wrote:
    RichNhansom wrote:I don't understand why some don't want to even see if Flynn could be the real deal. If you want to talk pipe dreams ir is far less likely that Wilson will become good enough in time for the playoffs to be effective than it is that Flynn could be what this team needs to be elite and it's not like he is going anywhere for the next four years minimum.

    Next year will be the last year of many of our key players contracts. We won't likely keep them all so we could easily regress. We could possibly be missing our window right now.

    Does anyone believe we have a legitimate shot at beating the Niners with our offense right now? The Niners are not the Panthers. We could get blown out. Sure Flynn might not change that but he just might also. You just don't know unless you try and Wilson will get better on or off the field. If you believe he won't then you are not being honest.


    Correct me if I am wrong RnH, but when some wanted to see what they had in Whitehurst, didn't you, as an ardent Hasselbeck supporter, point out quite often that we needed to trust the guys who get to see them both in practice every day?
    And if that was you, what changed?


    So, did everything switch? Those who wanted to see Whitehurst (me included) are now onboard with keeping Wilson playing while the ardent supporters of Matt want to see the back up?
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 1:53 pm
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:
    Scottemojo wrote:
    RichNhansom wrote:I don't understand why some don't want to even see if Flynn could be the real deal. If you want to talk pipe dreams ir is far less likely that Wilson will become good enough in time for the playoffs to be effective than it is that Flynn could be what this team needs to be elite and it's not like he is going anywhere for the next four years minimum.

    Next year will be the last year of many of our key players contracts. We won't likely keep them all so we could easily regress. We could possibly be missing our window right now.

    Does anyone believe we have a legitimate shot at beating the Niners with our offense right now? The Niners are not the Panthers. We could get blown out. Sure Flynn might not change that but he just might also. You just don't know unless you try and Wilson will get better on or off the field. If you believe he won't then you are not being honest.


    Correct me if I am wrong RnH, but when some wanted to see what they had in Whitehurst, didn't you, as an ardent Hasselbeck supporter, point out quite often that we needed to trust the guys who get to see them both in practice every day?
    And if that was you, what changed?


    So, did everything switch? Those who wanted to see Whitehurst (me included) are now onboard with keeping Wilson playing while the ardent supporters of Matt want to see the back up?

    Bizarro world.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:19 pm
  • Largent80 wrote:Here is the deal. This team is very young. We should be good for years to come.

    But in this pushbutton world, people "want it now". Unfortunately this is a game and not a keyboard.

    AMEN BROTHA!!!!
    It is going to take a season or two for Wilson to develop into a top notch QB. He might start clicking by the middle of this season for all we know. I am patient because this young team is going to be bad ass! Plus, our division is getting tough and the whole league is scared of the NFC West. It's gonna be a fun ride. :th2thumbs:
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:20 pm
  • There are two different things being discussed here. The underlying debate is about Flynn vs. Wilson, and that colors every other viewpoint including the perception that being patient means sticking with the rookie Wilson and being "impatiences" would be going with Flynn. I suspect that Wilson vs. Flynn is the argument that the OP is really addressing, and not the issue of how pressing the desire to win should be for fans.

    When it comes to Wilson vs. Flynn it makes sense to leave it up to the coaching staff. They have more information and I think that PC is indeed doing his best to win now. The complete rebuild metaphor is misapplied to this team. PC kept many veterans as depth in his first year to give us a better chance to win. He put an injured TJack into a game when CW was struggling. Consider TJack's presence here last year at all as a high floor guy who knew the system. I am not at all worried that Carroll is intentionally sacrificing 2012.

    As for winning now vs. being patient and considering the future? Winning now is a very reasonable desire from a fan viewpoint. Tickets, parking and concessions are expensive. Some of the same people arguing for patience in this thread are the same types who have said they are not going to watch a game on their TV because things weren't going well at the time. When I hear somebody say they wouldn't mind finishing 8-8, all that signifies to me is that they don't very much invested in this season. There is nothing wrong with that but don't expect people with more invested to share your opinions.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:23 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Nunya wrote:
    If people thought that way, NOBODY would every draft a rookie QB until there was no other choice. A rookie QB needs time to develop. Some of them can come right onto the field and preform very well, but most can't.


    Right most can't, so you agree with me. There's a reason that in the history of the league, only a handful of rookie QB's have performed well right out of college.

    We can talk all day about upside and who gives us a better chance of winning in future years, but you'll never convince me that Wilson gives us the best chance to win now. This is evident by his poor passer rating, inability to score in the red zone and the Hawks #31 rank in passing.


    What evidence have you seen this year that would support the notion that Flynn would be playing better? The problem is, with the Flynn supporters is that their opinions are based on hopes, not any definable production from the preseason or anything else. Please don't bring his 2 (2.5 games total)starts as evidence. Those are irrelevant at this point in time. -- different, schemes, supporting cast, ect. If those 3 games were really an indication of his true ability than he should have won the job easily. He didn't so I consider the Lion's '11 game an outlier. Just as RW Chiefs game was an outlier.

    My take on this is simple. PC has the most comprehensive data on both of these QB's, dating back to OTA's. If anyone was qualified to decide who starts, it would be him. He knows all the factors and has weighed them and determined RW is the best man for the job. It's that simple. I support PC, because I beleive he would start whomever was best regardless of circumstance. In Pete I trust. Now in a few weeks if RW isn't averaging 200- 225 yards a game or is struggling to convert on 3rd down, or turning the ball over alot, I would expect and hope that PC would make a change if he felt that the QB play wasn't up to scratch.

    However, I was very encouraged by what I saw in the Carolina game. I would expect more improvement this week as PC allows the offense to open it up more.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:23 am
  • Scottymojo, I can't quote big posts on my cell but to answer your question it is a simple no, I never trusted this coaching staff regarding the QB position
    So I have never said trust the coach's
    I've seen to many bad decisions by coach's over the years to ever take that stance.

    With Hasselbeck I simply believed he was the better QB just like Flynn right now. The only time I really didn't care was the choice between Tjack and Whity. It was just as bad either way. I do question why Carroll pulled Lynch for the Browns game
    Was he trying to ensure that Jackson looks like the better option?

    Hopefully that helps.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:44 am
  • RichNhansom wrote:Scottymojo, I can't quote big posts on my cell but to answer your question it is a simple no, I never trusted this coaching staff regarding the QB position
    So I have never said trust the coach's
    I've seen to many bad decisions by coach's over the years to ever take that stance.

    With Hasselbeck I simply believed he was the better QB just like Flynn right now. The only time I really didn't care was the choice between Tjack and Whity. It was just as bad either way. I do question why Carroll pulled Lynch for the Browns game
    Was he trying to ensure that Jackson looks like the better option?

    Hopefully that helps.

    Thanks for clearing that up.
    It still supports my contention that this isn't about Flynn/Wilson, but is about trust in Carroll.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:33 am
  • I agree, this is the opposite of Jackson vs Whitehurst. We know both of these QB's are much better. It's not even a question of who will be the better QB in the long run, it is (at least to me) the question of are we giving up a possible super bowl run to develop a rookie.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Flynn is the best QB in the world but as good as the rest of the team is even a top 15 QB might be enough and I do believe Flynn has a good shot at that.

    I also one that believes a rookie always benefits from watching for a while before getting thrust onto the field. I also don't believe even if Flynn won a super bowl that Wilson doesn't have a future here. His work ethic will get him his shot and Flynn becomes great trade bait.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:36 am
  • Other than using the word "impatiences," which isn't even a word unless you are speaking French, I thought you made a great first post Nunya. Spot on with every point.

    I think the reaction is in part because we aren't really used to a situation like this. Pete and John have created progress so fast that we've taken it for granted already. Now it's as if those two aren't creating progress fast enough. Amazing right? A few people that just hoped to have a decent team five years down the road in 2010 are now besides themselves that we are "wasting" a top 3 defense. Notice that I said a few. I don't think they represent most Seahawks fans. I think it's really just a case of a "vocal minority."

    Not that anything is wrong with that. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Me? I'm just going to sit back and enjoy what's coming around the corner. It's going to be glorious. Hell, can you imagine if this was happening in the NFC West from two years ago? We'd be like the Texans of the NFC.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:45 am
  • What gets to me is the whole "instant gratification" thing. We're Seahawks fans. We're one of the most long suffering fandoms out there. To accuse us of wanting instant gratification is like telling an innocent man who's been behind bars 20 years that he's in a hurry to get out or a 30 year old virgin that he's only interested in sex.

    This team can win this year. We as Seahawks fans know all too well how rarely things come together like this season has and how easily it can all evaporate away. No one understands the vaporous nature of future potential like a Seahawks fan. You grab your chances when they present themselves and they are presenting themselves THIS season. So you take your shot NOW, while you can. The future holds promise, but the future holds unknowns as well. Injuries, bad schedules, upsets, bad bounces and bad refereeing. and that's just scraping the top of the iceberg of things that could rob us of the potential that the future holds. No one even is willing to mention that Wilson, like every rookie QB, could turn out to be a bust. At which point we wasted this golden opportunity.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:53 am
  • Impatient? We have far too patient.

    This fan base has been subjected to 35 years of mediocrity.

    I think it's time to win.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:53 am
  • RichNhansom wrote:Scottymojo, I can't quote big posts on my cell but to answer your question it is a simple no, I never trusted this coaching staff regarding the QB position
    So I have never said trust the coach's
    I've seen to many bad decisions by coach's over the years to ever take that stance.

    With Hasselbeck I simply believed he was the better QB just like Flynn right now. The only time I really didn't care was the choice between Tjack and Whity. It was just as bad either way. I do question why Carroll pulled Lynch for the Browns game
    Was he trying to ensure that Jackson looks like the better option?

    Hopefully that helps.


    Why do you not trust this regime on QBs? If Matt Hasselbeck was still here, would you start him over Wilson or Flynn? And before you say "yes", which man I hope you don't, keep in mind that Russell Wilson has a higher 2012 passer rating than Hasselbeck does so far. Wilson also has something Hasselbeck does not: a future in the NFL.

    I see a FO and coach that values the QB position tremendously and is always at work to improve the position, not just at the starting job but at the backup spots as well. I thought before the draft that Russell Wilson was a homerun pick by some team. When that team was the Seahawks, it solidified my opinion that this regime "gets it" when it comes to QBs, too. The Eagles are strongly believed to have badly wanted Wilson too later in the same round. Would anyone dispute Andy Reid's QB credentials?

    And even if they are wrong on both Flynn and Wilson, the truth is that the resources they spent on both combined is roughly the same as what the team has spent on Brandon Mebane. If they felt they had to, they could easily move on to the next option on the table- a loaded 2013 draft class for QBs.
    Last edited by kearly on Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:55 am
  • SalishHawkFan wrote:What gets to me is the whole "instant gratification" thing. We're Seahawks fans. We're one of the most long suffering fandoms out there. To accuse us of wanting instant gratification is like telling an innocent man who's been behind bars 20 years that he's in a hurry to get out or a 30 year old virgin that he's only interested in sex.


    And this right here is why it is an absolute godsend that fans aren't involved in the running of the team's business. WE may have been suffering for 35 years. This current regime, however, isn't burdened by that. They're not going to be forced into knee-jerk decisions based on an emotional reaction to that history. They inherited a crap team 2.5 years ago and have set about implementing a plan to change the philosophy, culture, and direction of the team. They're not 35 long years into a fruitless quest. They're just over the halfway point in implementing their plan. For them, a QB failing to pan out isn't suddenly a long slog into memories of Mirer, Stouffer, McGwire, etc. It's just a QB failing to pan out, spurring the team to go with "plan B". It doesn't carry the same weight (and therefore, isn't panic-inducing for them).
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Wed Oct 10, 2012 7:08 am
  • Scottemojo wrote:
    Sarlacc83 wrote:So, did everything switch? Those who wanted to see Whitehurst (me included) are now onboard with keeping Wilson playing while the ardent supporters of Matt want to see the back up?

    Bizarro world.


    Speaking just for myself, I don't actually find it all that strange. Whitehurst was easily the better QB in the 2011 preseason (Tjack was a disaster). Wilson was easily the better QB in the 2012 preseason. In my case, I was simply supporting the QB who had done more to earn the starting job. When Whitehurst did get his chance in the regular season, boy did he suck. That put things to rest. If Flynn was named the starter, but got hurt and Wilson came in for one game and played like Whitehurst did in Cleveland last year, I promise you that the very next day you wouldn't find a bigger Flynn supporter than me.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:12 pm
  • We have one of the best defenses Seattle has ever had. The running game is solid. Our rookie QB is having issues, but he really hasn't had a bad game yet....at least not compare to the Seahawks normal fare at QB of late.


    This is exactly why we should not be playing a rookie QB. This team is good enough to win NOW. This is the best team since the Super Bowl season in 2005. We have a QB on the bench who wowed America with his 2 starts and we're starting a short rookie QB who is learning on the job and is no lock to become a future star.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:15 pm
  • Fearless Frog wrote:
    We have one of the best defenses Seattle has ever had. The running game is solid. Our rookie QB is having issues, but he really hasn't had a bad game yet....at least not compare to the Seahawks normal fare at QB of late.


    This is exactly why we should not be playing a rookie QB. This team is good enough to win NOW. This is the best team since the Super Bowl season in 2005. We have a QB on the bench who wowed America with his 2 starts and we're starting a short rookie QB who is learning on the job and is no lock to become a future star.


    Yeah let's put in the guy who couldn't win the starting job from a rookie. Good thinking.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:22 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:
    Fearless Frog wrote:
    We have one of the best defenses Seattle has ever had. The running game is solid. Our rookie QB is having issues, but he really hasn't had a bad game yet....at least not compare to the Seahawks normal fare at QB of late.


    This is exactly why we should not be playing a rookie QB. This team is good enough to win NOW. This is the best team since the Super Bowl season in 2005. We have a QB on the bench who wowed America with his 2 starts and we're starting a short rookie QB who is learning on the job and is no lock to become a future star.


    Yeah let's put in the guy who couldn't win the starting job from a rookie. Good thinking.


    So if Wilson continues to be among the very worst passers in football, you continue to unconditionally start him because he "won" the job? Preseason is useless. If it actually meant anything, than Wilson would be some unstoppable dynamo. But it doesn't mean anything and he hasn't looked like an unstoppable dynamo because he is no longer facing 3rd string backups and vanilla defenses. Flynn's 2 starts blow Wilson's entire body of work (preseason and regular season) out of the water.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:42 pm
  • Fearless Frog wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:
    Fearless Frog wrote:
    This is exactly why we should not be playing a rookie QB. This team is good enough to win NOW. This is the best team since the Super Bowl season in 2005. We have a QB on the bench who wowed America with his 2 starts and we're starting a short rookie QB who is learning on the job and is no lock to become a future star.


    Yeah let's put in the guy who couldn't win the starting job from a rookie. Good thinking.


    So if Wilson continues to be among the very worst passers in football, you continue to unconditionally start him because he "won" the job? Preseason is useless. If it actually meant anything, than Wilson would be some unstoppable dynamo. But it doesn't mean anything and he hasn't looked like an unstoppable dynamo because he is no longer facing 3rd string backups and vanilla defenses. Flynn's 2 starts blow Wilson's entire body of work (preseason and regular season) out of the water.


    Coach picks the starting QB. Not you, not me. You don't like who he picked? Write him a letter. I'm sure you can be persuasive enough.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 1:56 pm
  • Coach picks the starting QB. Not you, not me. You don't like who he picked? Write him a letter. I'm sure you can be persuasive enough.


    Obviously this is true but it does not mean the entire fanbase has to willingly shut their eyes and put their hands over their ears and willfully ignore any evidence that Wilson is not getting the job done and Flynn should be starting.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:22 pm
  • Fearless Frog wrote:
    Coach picks the starting QB. Not you, not me. You don't like who he picked? Write him a letter. I'm sure you can be persuasive enough.


    Obviously this is true but it does not mean the entire fanbase has to willingly shut their eyes and put their hands over their ears and willfully ignore any evidence that Wilson is not getting the job done and Flynn should be starting.


    As far as evidence goes, we're still dealing with a fairly small sample size. Give it some time, doll face.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:50 pm
  • The Seattle Seahawks consist of 53 men that play football.
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Re: Why all of the impatiences?
Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:51 pm
  • The Radish wrote:Always best to read the forum a bit before posting and you appear to be one of the few that's noticed that. :D

    Welcome to Seahawks.net, glad to have you.

    :les:



    Les, how nice of you not to get impatiences with him.
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