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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:39 pm 
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Well, I only have a problem with 1 of your points:

Miller is a #2 TE, and Rice is a #2 WR.

Rice flourished with the right QB and scheme and was truly a #1 WR with that type of impact. He could be here as well since Minnesota had a dangerous run game and used deadly play action, and TEs down the seam to help out the WRs. We do the same thing. He's had terrible QBs throwing to him, and he's been hurt a lot, which does hurt his status. WHEN HEALTHY, he can be that #1 guy.

Miller is a top tier TE, as evidenced by Pete and John paying for him. They don't overpay for anybody. He was a top 3 TE in Oakland's offense with Jason Campbell throwing to him. As good as a receiver as he is, he's an even better blocker. Jackson had no idea what a TE even was, and Miller stayed in to block for a horrible OL, and never complained. I couldn't tell you if Wilson couldn't see a TE, or if Bevell hasn't schemed Miller going downfield, but he's smart enough to find the holes in the zone, and fast enough to gain separation from LBers consistently.

Tate is also getting consistent separation, so while people want to throw our WR corps under the bus, it can just easily be the QB. People are going to blame the players they don't like first.....i you're a Wilson supporter, it just HAS to be the WRs, right ?

Flynn may not be the answer, but he's shown a few things in his 2 NFL starts that Wilson has struggled with, and it's my opinion that they are things that would really mesh well with our team: he can throw his WRs open (cuz hey, they struggle to get separation, right?), he makes superior pregame adjusments...yea he had better WRs in GB, but it was a more complicated offense and he had it mastered, and he reads the defense well and gets rid of the ball quickly. No, he's not as mobile as Wilson, but accurate short passes can defeat even our elite pass rush, as we've seen. I'm behind Wilson, he seriously has that IT factor. Flynn also has an eerie poise for the few games he's played. I'm just intrigued and curious as to what Flynn could've done.


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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:52 pm 
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I don't agree at all saying we're not ready to win.

There's not a team in the league that gives up less than 20 points every game that isn't ready to win. We're not going to win this thing by starting Flynn. I'm not ready to start over 5 games in. However, I am ready to open up this damn offense and take some chances. I trust our defense to stop them most of the time.

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:27 pm 
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hoxrox wrote:
You make some great points but a lot your points, go back to point #1 which is the fundamental flaw of the whole argument. If this was factually true, then the rest of your argument holds water, and can be argued for ANY QB they decide to start.


This is very true, Hoxrox, and is basically exactly what I was getting at. The whole thing stands or falls on which QB is the worthier long-term gamble.

But while this season is still somewhat of a testing ground, I still find it tremendously important to start developing a QB now. Those guys take forever to build up. IMO, the QB competition ended in the preseason and rightfully so.

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:29 pm 
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Hawks46 wrote:
Well, I only have a problem with 1 of your points:

Miller is a #2 TE, and Rice is a #2 WR.

Rice flourished with the right QB and scheme and was truly a #1 WR with that type of impact. He could be here as well since Minnesota had a dangerous run game and used deadly play action, and TEs down the seam to help out the WRs. We do the same thing. He's had terrible QBs throwing to him, and he's been hurt a lot, which does hurt his status. WHEN HEALTHY, he can be that #1 guy.


You might be right. I actually missed the first half of the Carolina game; after watching it, I liked some of the plays I saw from Rice. He needs to keep that up, because this offense would be helped tremendously by an aggressive, physical clutch guy who will outrace and outmuscle defenders and find ways to catch footballs thrown even just in his general vicinity. Would demand extra coverage and open things up. Huge influence on the offense.

In general, too much spottiness across the entire roster. Edwards, Obomanu, and Martin are basically sucking roster spots dry right now. I don't know if they're just not getting open or not giving effort (Obo has seemed lazy at times) or not being seen by Wilson, but every WR who's not doing his job is another person that Wilson can't trust.

For example, on the pick-6 by Wilson vs CAR, Anthony McCoy ran an awful route. Rounded off his deep out like it was made of sandpaper. He could have gained at least two yards of separation by making ANY kind of sudden cut, but he didn't. Wilson was still 100% at fault for the throw (covered WR + thrown to inside shoulder = disaster), but McCoy did nothing to help.

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Last edited by MontanaHawk05 on Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:32 pm 
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SonicHawk wrote:
However, I am ready to open up this damn offense and take some chances. I trust our defense to stop them most of the time.


Well, hell yes. I think we saw that happen Sunday. Wilson and his boys needed a break from elite defenses to work things out on the field and build some chemistry. Might continue against New England (23rd against the pass per DVOA).

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:35 pm 
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I liked all your reasons, Brandon, and here is why they don't matter. Most of the people who want Flynn to start do not have a tangible attachment to the guy. They truly think Pete doesn't know what he is doing on offense, that his competition is a joke, and they have some very conventional football reasons for thinking Wilson is all wrong. Flynn is just a convenient tool for their argument, they have no idea if he will be a game changer.

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:39 pm 
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Hawks46 wrote:
Tate is also getting consistent separation, so while people want to throw our WR corps under the bus, it can just easily be the QB. People are going to blame the players they don't like first.....i you're a Wilson supporter, it just HAS to be the WRs, right ?


This is the only part of your post that I can say anything disparaging about. There have been a couple of analysts who have broken down plays that Tate was open, but ran the wrong route. It is imperative for every QB, but especially one who is not tall enough to see over the linemen, for the receiver to be where they are supposed to be when they are supposed to be there. If Tate had the separation when and where he was supposed to be, I'd suggest that Wilson would get him the ball.

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 Post subject: Re: Five reasons "Flynn now, Wilson later" doesn't work for me
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:42 pm 
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If Wilson were 6 foot 3 then I think there wouldn't be any debate.

We just don't want to waste a season on a guy who has very long odds of making it.

If it were Andrew Luck or RG3 out there struggling I think the fan base would be patient.

I hope this kid makes it, otherwise we are starting over once again.

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