12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)

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Who should be our QB next week vs the Panthers?

100% stick with Wilson. We're still 2-2 with him at the helm.
86
45%
I'm torn, but this is as much about WR as QB. Give the kid another start.
25
13%
Get Flynn in there now. Don't waste any more time with a rookie not delivering
54
28%
Open this week's practice up to competition: best QB starts
23
12%
DILFER! DILFER! DILFER! DILFER!
3
2%
 
Total votes : 191

Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:35 pm
  • Hasselbeck wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:If he doesnt believe in the guy that won the job, how do you think he feels about the guy that lost it?


    Flynn never had the luxury of playing against 2nd/3rd stringers for the entire duration of preseason + the Chiefs defense without its 3 best players (which 4 weeks in looks like a laughing stock at FULL strength)..

    Go ahead and hang onto the preseason all you want.. Once upon a time, Charlie Whitehurst was a preseason superstar too.

    The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.


    I didnt say a word about the preseason. I was just trying to get into the coaches head, just as you were with your post. They clearly thought Russell Wilson was the better option, for whatever reason, and yet you say they dont trust him. So if they dont trust the guy who they thought was better enough to open up the playbook... which is the reason you said we're dead last in passing, why would they trust the guy who lost the job to do more passing?
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:37 pm
  • Hasselbeck wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:If he doesnt believe in the guy that won the job, how do you think he feels about the guy that lost it?


    Flynn never had the luxury of playing against 2nd/3rd stringers for the entire duration of preseason + the Chiefs defense without its 3 best players (which 4 weeks in looks like a laughing stock at FULL strength)..

    Go ahead and hang onto the preseason all you want.. Once upon a time, Charlie Whitehurst was a preseason superstar too.

    The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.



    Nice post and I believe your namesake could take this team to the SB. Matt was on the decline for sure, but he knew the sanctuary of a pocket and how to step up into it while looking downfield for open receivers. I want to see if Flynn can do the same now that I know Wilson can't (yet).
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:52 pm
  • Growing Pains, growing pains, growing pains. I am really not sure where people go the idea we were going to the super bowl this year starting a rookie QB. I figured we were going to be hot and cold up and down no matter which "rookie" we started. Yes, I know....Flynn had those 2 big regular season games of experience and all but I still don't buy that making him so much more experienced. Don't get me wrong, I do like Flynn and feel he very likely could develope into a good franchise QB some day (same as Wilson). I just do not feel he would be doing much better atm.

    Most all teams in NFL that start rookie or inexperienced QBs are going to have these type of years. Look at the "great" Cam Newton everybody raved about last year.....what was their record, 6-10?? I am not taking anything away from what he accomplished, just that is the pitfalls of starting rooks. Consistancy is always the issue early in QB's careers. I see an 8-8 team atm but have hopes we improve and maybe steal a couple extra wins(ha ha).
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:53 pm
  • You guys definitely need kit kat break. The offense is a work in progress but again we could have won this game if not for a few unlucky breaks ( flukey interceptions ) and a dude kicking almost 60 yard field goals
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:07 pm
  • Seahawk Sailor wrote:The WORST defense we've played was #9 DVOA against the pass.

    I'd almost be willing to give up a game to see Pete say "hey, screw it. Seattle, I'm putting Flynn in this week and this week only just to show you why Wilson's the quarterback." He won't do it because he's a nice guy, but if he did, I'd expect everyone here to be completely wowed at how experienced Flynn looked at taking sacks.


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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:09 pm
  • HawkWow wrote:Nice post and I believe your namesake could take this team to the SB. Matt was on the decline for sure, but he knew the sanctuary of a pocket and how to step up into it while looking downfield for open receivers. I want to see if Flynn can do the same now that I know Wilson can't (yet).


    Oh man.. don't get me started on the decision to move on from the other Matt. :th2thumbs:
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:11 pm
  • JSeahawks wrote:
    Hasselbeck wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:If he doesnt believe in the guy that won the job, how do you think he feels about the guy that lost it?


    Flynn never had the luxury of playing against 2nd/3rd stringers for the entire duration of preseason + the Chiefs defense without its 3 best players (which 4 weeks in looks like a laughing stock at FULL strength)..

    Go ahead and hang onto the preseason all you want.. Once upon a time, Charlie Whitehurst was a preseason superstar too.

    The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.


    I didnt say a word about the preseason. I was just trying to get into the coaches head, just as you were with your post. They clearly thought Russell Wilson was the better option, for whatever reason, and yet you say they dont trust him. So if they dont trust the guy who they thought was better enough to open up the playbook... which is the reason you said we're dead last in passing, why would they trust the guy who lost the job to do more passing?


    I know you're a huge Wilson fan.. that's great.. fantastic.

    Be honest now.. does the play calling say they trust Wilson?
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:13 pm
  • Hasselbeck wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:
    Hasselbeck wrote:
    Flynn never had the luxury of playing against 2nd/3rd stringers for the entire duration of preseason + the Chiefs defense without its 3 best players (which 4 weeks in looks like a laughing stock at FULL strength)..

    Go ahead and hang onto the preseason all you want.. Once upon a time, Charlie Whitehurst was a preseason superstar too.

    The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.


    I didnt say a word about the preseason. I was just trying to get into the coaches head, just as you were with your post. They clearly thought Russell Wilson was the better option, for whatever reason, and yet you say they dont trust him. So if they dont trust the guy who they thought was better enough to open up the playbook... which is the reason you said we're dead last in passing, why would they trust the guy who lost the job to do more passing?


    I know you're a huge Wilson fan.. that's great.. fantastic.

    Be honest now.. does the play calling say they trust Wilson?


    No it doesnt. And thats exactly my point. If they dont trust Wilson what makes you think they woudl trust Flynn, when its obvious they thought Wilson was better since htey gave him the job?

    Its not even a Wilson vs Flynn issue for me. Flynn very well might be better. Its a, you dont bench your starting QB 4 games into the season thing.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:19 pm

Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:20 pm
  • JSeahawks wrote:
    Hasselbeck wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:[quote="Hasselbeck"]

    Flynn never had the luxury of playing against 2nd/3rd stringers for the entire duration of preseason + the Chiefs defense without its 3 best players (which 4 weeks in looks like a laughing stock at FULL strength)..

    Go ahead and hang onto the preseason all you want.. Once upon a time, Charlie Whitehurst was a preseason superstar too.

    The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.


    I didnt say a word about the preseason. I was just trying to get into the coaches head, just as you were with your post. They clearly thought Russell Wilson was the better option, for whatever reason, and yet you say they dont trust him. So if they dont trust the guy who they thought was better enough to open up the playbook... which is the reason you said we're dead last in passing, why would they trust the guy who lost the job to do more passing?


    I know you're a huge Wilson fan.. that's great.. fantastic.

    Be honest now.. does the play calling say they trust Wilson?


    No it doesnt. And thats exactly my point. If they dont trust Wilson what makes you think they woudl trust Flynn, when its obvious they thought Wilson was better since htey gave him the job?[/quote]
    Keyword thought. They may have thought Wilson has more upside or is more dynamic. Flynn didn't get a fair shake in the competition but we won't rehash that argument. What matters now is if they can be rational and objective at this point in time after having more information to work with. I hope a reporter asks Pete directly if this competition is still open.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:23 pm
  • “I think he’s moving the club,” Carroll said about Wilson. “He shows that he can move us, and he made some great plays today. He ran around really well, and he was accurate with the football for the most part.

    “I’m still thinking that he’s improving and getting more comfortable and all of that. … So we’ll see what it all means. I don’t know yet.”

    Read more here: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks ... rylink=cpy


    Nothing in this says he's ready to give up on Wilson. Talk about a writer making his own headlines.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:30 pm
  • Bakergirl wrote:
    “I think he’s moving the club,” Carroll said about Wilson. “He shows that he can move us, and he made some great plays today. He ran around really well, and he was accurate with the football for the most part.

    “I’m still thinking that he’s improving and getting more comfortable and all of that. … So we’ll see what it all means. I don’t know yet.”

    Read more here: http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks ... rylink=cpy


    Nothing in this says he's ready to give up on Wilson. Talk about a writer making his own headlines.


    Pete's quotes make me: :34853_doh:

    I guess it's "improvement" that he finally hit that incredible 160 yard plateau..

    Make the change man. Put your ego aside and realize this defense is special and the offense can improve immensely if Flynn pans out.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:38 pm
  • I agree bakergirl. I watched the video and wondered where he said that lol. It was a little disturbing that he praised Wilson for doing a "good job running around out there". What is this, the playground?
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:39 pm
  • RockHawk wrote:What do you think?


    Nice poll......are you related to DuncansDad? 8)
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:39 pm
  • Hasselbeck wrote:Make the change man. Put your ego aside and realize this defense is special and the offense can improve immensely if Flynn pans out.


    The offense could improve immensely if Wilson panned out too!

    Excellent points all around!
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:44 pm
  • Just watched the All 22. Gotta watch it a few more times to try and see more of what Wilson saw, but a few things I saw the first time through..

    he isn't getting to the backside or outlets. Most of the time he looks at his primary and then the pass rush. Sometimes he looks at his second. He rarely, if ever, makes it past that. He had Golden open down the sidelines twice, once on a blown coverage, with very ample protection, and scrambled right instead. The game is still going too fast for him to stand strong in the pocket and scan the entire field.

    Doug Baldwin isn't extending his routes. He is running the primary route hard and then floating around. He saved Tarvaris a good number of times last season by continuing to run his route. Something isn't right. Hopefully it isn't an attitude thing.

    Wilson isnt "feeling" the pass rush. He is looking at it. When the rush comes from the outside, comfortable QB's slide up, but never take their eyes down field. When rush comes from the inside. comfortable QB's take a few steps, let the defender run past, and then reset. Wilson is losing his composure at the first sign of pressure.

    I need to look at the playcalling a bit more, but my guess is that it isn't as conservative as Wilson is making it. We need to throw more on 1st down, but Wilson isn't taking chances in the intermediate part of the field, particularly over the middle. Sidney Rice ran at least a handful of dig routes, and had his body in position, but it is almost like Wilson won't even consider this throw for some reason.

    I'm going to get burnt for this, but right now, Wilson isn't even Tarvaris Jackson. Essentially the same player, but every once in a while Jackson would make himself take a chance. Wilson just won't.

    The relevant questions are these......

    How would Wilson react to being benched? My guess is that it wouldn't stunt his growth in the least bit. He's going to keep preparing and improving every day. I don't think he's likely to shut it down mentally if he's benched.

    What is more important to the franchise, winning now or cultivating Russell Wilson? If they want to win now, the odds are that Flynn would be the better option. We have the worst passing game in the NFL, no? Whether or not it is Wilson's fault, it can't be any worse by starting Flynn. What if Flynn is pretty good? We become flat-out scary. I'm sad to say, at this point, Wilson just isn't. Can't wait for Millen's analysis tomorrow morning.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:56 pm
  • Tical21 wrote:Just watched the All 22. Gotta watch it a few more times to try and see more of what Wilson saw, but a few things I saw the first time through..

    he isn't getting to the backside or outlets. Most of the time he looks at his primary and then the pass rush. Sometimes he looks at his second. He rarely, if ever, makes it past that. He had Golden open down the sidelines twice, once on a blown coverage, with very ample protection, and scrambled right instead. The game is still going too fast for him to stand strong in the pocket and scan the entire field.

    Doug Baldwin isn't extending his routes. He is running the primary route hard and then floating around. He saved Tarvaris a good number of times last season by continuing to run his route. Something isn't right. Hopefully it isn't an attitude thing.

    Wilson isnt "feeling" the pass rush. He is looking at it. When the rush comes from the outside, comfortable QB's slide up, but never take their eyes down field. When rush comes from the inside. comfortable QB's take a few steps, let the defender run past, and then reset. Wilson is losing his composure at the first sign of pressure.

    I need to look at the playcalling a bit more, but my guess is that it isn't as conservative as Wilson is making it. We need to throw more on 1st down, but Wilson isn't taking chances in the intermediate part of the field, particularly over the middle. Sidney Rice ran at least a handful of dig routes, and had his body in position, but it is almost like Wilson won't even consider this throw for some reason.

    I'm going to get burnt for this, but right now, Wilson isn't even Tarvaris Jackson. Essentially the same player, but every once in a while Jackson would make himself take a chance. Wilson just won't.

    The relevant questions are these.......


    I'm going to disregard the start Flynn babble because it's ridiculous 4 games into the season when the coach has already admitted he hasn't let Wilson loose yet.

    However I think you make some very correct points. Wilson isn't comfortable in the pocket and you can't escape like you can in college. I find he's so afraid to give up a sack that he's become really good at throwing the ball away instead of waiting, maybe stepping up and checking out another option or two.

    Baldwin is just not in sync on this team right now. He's very A-B and since Wilson does break from the pocket and most plays seem to just break down he needs to be moving, coming back to Wilson instead of jogging down field for some unknown reason.

    I would honestly prefer to see more quick throws, less reads. It's very odd to me that we mostly run the ball, but when we pass we let the QB have reads. Wilson has little understanding of the pass defense until third and long and it's obnoxious. If we're going to be a run first team we need to emulate the offense SF had last year. There's a reason Smith didn't throw many INTs, they didn't give him time enough to think about it.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:58 pm
  • I think the 4th option is a bad idea, but I voted for it anyway because there wasn't an "undecided" option and that one looked the closest.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:13 pm
  • SonicHawk wrote:TAKE HASSELBECK OUT NOW, HE'S TERRIBLE, WHERE'S DILFER?

    Boy I sure remember those days I was one of those idiots lol
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:27 pm
  • Stick with the guy who won the competition. He will get better if we keep hoping it bad enough. Besides the competition ends once the third pre season game is finished. Enjoy the 7-9 season. Embrace mediocrity. Don't let the number two guy even try to throw for more than 160 yards in a game and perhaps ignite an otherwise dormant offense. Coaches never make mistakes, Wilson will be a Pro Bowler ASAP.

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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:11 pm
  • The points for sticking with Wilson are basically:

    rookie growing pains; we'll be taking our lumps this season - At the expense of a great defense and running game, at the expense of a winning season if this trend continues? Why even start a rookie if we're not putting our team in the best position to succeed this year? If we're playing for next year, I guess it doesn't really matter who starts.

    receivers are not getting open - Yes they are. go watch the tape. Wilson bailing from the pocket too soon, and he is just not hitting them

    Flynn is more sack prone - Pure conjecture at this point. Won't know until he plays regular games behind our line, in our offense.

    Flynn is not a team player - Based on what he might look like on the sidelines? According to the coaches he lit it up as a scout QB for Rodgers, and gave our defense a lot information to work with. We can give some credit to Flynn for that 9 sack performance

    Flynn looks too pouty - not even going to counterpoint this ridiculous argument

    Coaches picked Wilson over Flynn for a reason - Coaches can make mistakes too; it's a matter of if they can learn from their mistakes and be rational enough (and not emotional like us fans) to do what is best for the team

    We are still 2-2 with Wilson - And we could be 4-0... the passing game was still bad in those 2 wins. Defense/special teams will not bail us out forever.

    The coaches are handicapping Wilson and limiting the play book - Then Wilson is still the problem. They are not letting him loose for a reason. Maybe he's turned the ball over too much in practice? Maybe he's having trouble reading defenses. Maybe their trying to make him into something he's not?

    4 games is not enough sample size to determine if this offense can get it going with Wilson under center - We have a great running game and are still not getting it done. We can give Wilson a couple more games, but how long can we afford before this becomes another "developmental" season?
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:14 pm
  • hoxrox wrote: but how long can we afford before this becomes another "developmental" season?


    Whether you thought Wilson would lead us to the Superbowl, or whether you thought he'd have a lot of rookie mistakes, it became a developmental year as soon as he was named the starter.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:51 pm
  • JSeahawks wrote:
    hoxrox wrote: but how long can we afford before this becomes another "developmental" season?


    Whether you thought Wilson would lead us to the Superbowl, or whether you thought he'd have a lot of rookie mistakes, it became a developmental year as soon as he was named the starter.


    If Carroll really believes in Always Compete / Win Forever, then he has some serious evaluation to do, and determine if he's putting this team in the best position to win this year. If by starting a rookie, we are still a year or two away, then I guess it doesn't matter but I would hate to see us squander our great defense and running game when I think we are talented enough to make some noise THIS year.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:06 pm
  • Thought this thread might need a bump to add a little mid-season perspective to things. My how far we've come!
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)
Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:30 pm
  • Holy crap there was a discussion on this at one point?
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)
Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:34 pm
  • I feel pretty damn smart after reading my replys in this thread. :)
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)
Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:37 pm
  • Man, I knew this thread was trouble when it was first started. I am sooooooooo glad I didn't jump in it.


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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5?
Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:09 pm
  • Hasselbeck wrote:Flynn. End the charade.


    Hasselbeck wrote:The best QB on this teams roster is the teams backup. And we're squandering an entire season because of it.


    Um... does Hasselbeck get to keep the "Net Sage" title after this? :stirthepot: :P :oops:
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)
Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:11 pm
  • I took a break from this forum when this thread came out... pure stupidity.
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Re: 12th man vote: QB for game 5? (Bumped)
Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:41 pm
  • This entire off season and looking at where we are now ...

    Pete and John can start a toaster and we should just drink the Koolaid.
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