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Seattle's O-line
Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:39 pm
  • After week-8 we are at #25. We may have improved since then, but suffice it to say that even with the noticeable improvement of Solari, we are still leaning towards the bottom of the league.

    "Seattle is so fortunate to have Russell Wilson under center. Germain Ifedi ranks dead last among all qualifying offensive linemen in pressure percentage allowed at 11.64%."

    https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-offensive- ... ngs-week-8
    DomeHawk
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:52 pm
  • Something I've noticed that I don't think is being taken into account is the tackles are seemingly being coached to let the edge rushers get deep, or wide pressure, specifically to allow Russell to step up and over into the vacated space from the DE. Basically, they're allowing the speed rush to the outside, then Russ steps up into that area as the tackles are pushing the DE past him using their own momentum. To pff, and other 3rd parties that could look like a pressure, but if its totally planned, is it really?
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Mon Nov 18, 2019 9:58 pm
  • It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.
    rjdriver
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:32 am
  • rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible .
    xray
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:39 am
  • xray wrote:
    rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible .


    No he didn't.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:38 am
  • Just watching games this week and thinking, must be nice to have time to set up in the pocket and scan the field like Mahomes and Jackson had. What Wilson has accomplished while running for his life his entire career is amazing. Could you imagine him behind an actual legit real line.

    The other two are great QBs no doubt, but i wonder how they'd do behind a turnstile offensive line Wilson seems to be behind every season ...Brady, Brees, and Rogers too for that matter... just wondering out loud.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:52 am
  • Ifedi is a high-round JS pick, but it's time to move on from just that fact. He hasn't impressed.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:33 am
  • xray wrote:
    rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible
    .


    Forget the win and look at Cable's track record!!!

    We won the superbowl with the top paid oline in the NFL and the #32 ranked pass blocking oline!! Know the facts please!! :roll: :pukeface:
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    Seymour
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 11:36 am
  • 3 rd downs. 3 consecutive sacks from the inside. Ifedi is only part of the issue.

    I get to watch more saint games than Seahawks and their lines are better but not because of talent.

    I’d say that the play call is more complimentary to the saint line’s capabilities. Bree’s is still throwing almost every down it seems, but there is a better use of quick slants, screens, flat passes. With brees winding up to throw before the receiver hits the top of their route quick plays. This years average pass attempt is well off previous years. Quicker plays and quicker throws.

    Schott is doing a better job than ever matching this up. When Russ goes into hero ball mode it’s not a line up.

    But the team should move in from anyone cable coached as their fundamentals are forever corrupted. We should start to see something start to break in Oakland.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    NOLAHawk
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:18 pm
  • Seymour wrote:
    xray wrote:
    rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible
    .


    Forget the win and look at Cable's track record!!!

    We won the superbowl with the top paid oline in the NFL and the #32 ranked pass blocking oline!! Know the facts please!! :roll: :pukeface:


    yours stats are impressive...but 2 SBS and a win are also impressive .
    xray
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 5:22 pm
  • xray wrote:
    Seymour wrote:
    xray wrote:
    rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible
    .


    Forget the win and look at Cable's track record!!!

    We won the superbowl with the top paid oline in the NFL and the #32 ranked pass blocking oline!! Know the facts please!! :roll: :pukeface:


    yours stats are impressive...but 2 SBS and a win are also impressive .

    And Cable must be responsible for the loss in the SB with the Pats too ?
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:19 pm
  • The success of the Raven’s O-line effectively shuts down the myth that Russell’s O-line is poor because Russell’s unpredictable runs cause issues, he scrambles around too much, and doesn’t stay in the pocket.

    Also willing to bet money that Kingsbury builds a killer O-line around Kyler Murray. And then no one will own the alternate facts that have dominated the debate around Russ’ struggles in recent years
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:38 pm
  • NOLAHawk wrote:3 rd downs. 3 consecutive sacks from the inside. Ifedi is only part of the issue.
    ...

    But the team should move in from anyone cable coached as their fundamentals are forever corrupted. We should start to see something start to break in Oakland.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


    IDK, I get the Oakland games, and the OL is doing better now than it has in years, maybe decades this year. This is with pieces like Jordan Devey earlier (released from 9ers under Kelly) and Richie Incognito. This is with their starters going down weekly for weeks-long injury.

    Through it all, Carr has looked like he's had all day back there.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 7:47 pm
  • This is one of those areas where I wonder how much difference there is between the best team and the worst team. Ranking high is better than ranking low, but how much better?
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:19 pm
  • xray wrote:
    rjdriver wrote:It’s really a testament to how awful Cable was when having the #25 rated Oline seems awesome.


    Cable coached them to two SBs winning one...that's horrible .



    Lol yeah no, lynch and Wilson were able to be successful despite them.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:21 pm
  • NOLAHawk wrote:3 rd downs. 3 consecutive sacks from the inside. Ifedi is only part of the issue.

    I get to watch more saint games than Seahawks and their lines are better but not because of talent.

    I’d say that the play call is more complimentary to the saint line’s capabilities. Bree’s is still throwing almost every down it seems, but there is a better use of quick slants, screens, flat passes. With brees winding up to throw before the receiver hits the top of their route quick plays. This years average pass attempt is well off previous years. Quicker plays and quicker throws.

    Schott is doing a better job than ever matching this up. When Russ goes into hero ball mode it’s not a line up.

    But the team should move in from anyone cable coached as their fundamentals are forever corrupted. We should start to see something start to break in Oakland.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro



    Hero ball mode, so you blame Wilson, lol of course always has to be his fault.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:41 pm
  • I don't think Cable gets to draft and pick players in Oakland, Gruden and Mayock pretty much control that ship.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Tue Nov 19, 2019 9:07 pm
  • SantaClaraHawk wrote:
    NOLAHawk wrote:3 rd downs. 3 consecutive sacks from the inside. Ifedi is only part of the issue.
    ...

    But the team should move in from anyone cable coached as their fundamentals are forever corrupted. We should start to see something start to break in Oakland.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


    IDK, I get the Oakland games, and the OL is doing better now than it has in years, maybe decades this year. This is with pieces like Jordan Devey earlier (released from 9ers under Kelly) and Richie Incognito. This is with their starters going down weekly for weeks-long injury.

    Through it all, Carr has looked like he's had all day back there.


    He isn't assistant head coach, Run Offense Coordinator, purveyor of draft picks and hasn't had time to screw up everyone's technique yet. It's all Gruden's O, not Cable's.

    But give it time
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:10 pm
  • DJrmb wrote:Something I've noticed that I don't think is being taken into account is the tackles are seemingly being coached to let the edge rushers get deep, or wide pressure, specifically to allow Russell to step up and over into the vacated space from the DE. Basically, they're allowing the speed rush to the outside, then Russ steps up into that area as the tackles are pushing the DE past him using their own momentum. To pff, and other 3rd parties that could look like a pressure, but if its totally planned, is it really?


    Yeah, it's what New Orleans does with Brees. Front door escapes.

    Wilson doesn't have the wheels anymore to do those pirouette back door escapes anymore.

    They are accounting for that, or New Orleans OT grades would be consistently bad year in, year out.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:21 pm
  • Cable was terrible last year, with his rookie draft picks. They also had veterans get hurt.

    Those veterans are now healthy, and they had a big FA signing, Trent Brown, to play RT.

    His prized draft pick, Kolton Miller, has a PFF grade of 61.5.

    Cable still sucks, but he has Gruden, who loves to dink and dunk, to mask Cable's flaws.

    Quick passing game, and veteran O-Line, can mitigate the Cable effect.

    The Raiders had one of the best O-Lines in football a couple years ago. FYI

    So he isn't working miracle over there. He is just being covered up.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:59 pm
  • Scorpion05 wrote:The success of the Raven’s O-line effectively shuts down the myth that Russell’s O-line is poor because Russell’s unpredictable runs cause issues, he scrambles around too much, and doesn’t stay in the pocket.

    Also willing to bet money that Kingsbury builds a killer O-line around Kyler Murray. And then no one will own the alternate facts that have dominated the debate around Russ’ struggles in recent years

    The Ravens run a vastly different offensive scheme. About 3/4th's of Russell's passing attempts are in the pocket. In contrast, about half of Lamar's pass attempts are outside the pocket on designed RPO's. This, accompanied by the threat him running the ball, completely changes how you defend Lamar vs how you'd defend young Russell. For instance, if you blitz young Russ and he escapes, then it's a 20 yard gain. If you blitz Lamar and he escapes, then it's likely a 40+ yard gain or worse.

    Now, I think the Ravens have a better line anyway, but they certainly benefit from having a QB who runs a sub 4.3 forty and is adept at avoiding contact. If Wilson was as fast as Lamar, he'd be the greatest QB in NFL history. Unfortunately, Wilson is lucky if he can run a 4.8 forty, and he's not quite as nimble as he was 5 years ago.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:40 pm
  • Fade wrote:Cable was terrible last year, with his rookie draft picks. They also had veterans get hurt.

    Those veterans are now healthy, and they had a big FA signing, Trent Brown, to play RT.

    His prized draft pick, Kolton Miller, has a PFF grade of 61.5.

    Cable still sucks, but he has Gruden, who loves to dink and dunk, to mask Cable's flaws.

    Quick passing game, and veteran O-Line, can mitigate the Cable effect.

    The Raiders had one of the best O-Lines in football a couple years ago. FYI

    So he isn't working miracle over there. He is just being covered up.



    This is the huge take away here.

    Cable was the worst Oline coach to pair with Pete and Bevell. Their run to set up deep play action passing game was never going to work with Cable and his views regarding Oline play due to how long the linemen have to block.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:04 pm
  • Fade wrote:Cable was terrible last year, with his rookie draft picks. They also had veterans get hurt.

    Those veterans are now healthy, and they had a big FA signing, Trent Brown, to play RT.

    His prized draft pick, Kolton Miller, has a PFF grade of 61.5.

    Cable still sucks, but he has Gruden, who loves to dink and dunk, to mask Cable's flaws.

    Quick passing game, and veteran O-Line, can mitigate the Cable effect.

    The Raiders had one of the best O-Lines in football a couple years ago. FYI

    So he isn't working miracle over there. He is just being covered up.


    Brown's been on and off hurt for most of the season. He's an important piece but I'd argue at this point not the most important.

    That goes to Incognito. He's absolutely shined this year for them. A couple weeks ago when their C was down, they were going to shift him in and he was fine with it. So was their fanbase, who actually appear to be making a playoff push for real this year.

    In September, he said Jonathan Martin had his own personal demons with the Dolphins. And left it at that. Media gave him all sorts of crap.

    What Incognito left out is that he had just cosigned on a plan in LA court to let Martin do some AA/psych treatment instead of going to jail for Instagramming a shotgun with Incognito's twitter handle on it. Incognito felt compelled to go to an FBI safe house over that.

    Incognito has had major flaws. But doing that turn for a guy he has absolutely every right not to help now, that shows character.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:38 pm
  • The ability to play G at a high level was never an issue for Incognito. If it was he would have long since been out of the league.
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Re: Seattle's O-line
Fri Nov 22, 2019 1:53 am
  • knownone wrote:
    Scorpion05 wrote:The success of the Raven’s O-line effectively shuts down the myth that Russell’s O-line is poor because Russell’s unpredictable runs cause issues, he scrambles around too much, and doesn’t stay in the pocket.

    Also willing to bet money that Kingsbury builds a killer O-line around Kyler Murray. And then no one will own the alternate facts that have dominated the debate around Russ’ struggles in recent years

    The Ravens run a vastly different offensive scheme. About 3/4th's of Russell's passing attempts are in the pocket. In contrast, about half of Lamar's pass attempts are outside the pocket on designed RPO's. This, accompanied by the threat him running the ball, completely changes how you defend Lamar vs how you'd defend young Russell. For instance, if you blitz young Russ and he escapes, then it's a 20 yard gain. If you blitz Lamar and he escapes, then it's likely a 40+ yard gain or worse.

    Now, I think the Ravens have a better line anyway, but they certainly benefit from having a QB who runs a sub 4.3 forty and is adept at avoiding contact. If Wilson was as fast as Lamar, he'd be the greatest QB in NFL history. Unfortunately, Wilson is lucky if he can run a 4.8 forty, and he's not quite as nimble as he was 5 years ago.

    I know you would think I agree with this and I thought he was really slowing down
    but theres been games like the Niner game where when he really wants to he will
    rip off a big gain faster than 4.8.
    Granted it doesn't happen often but I was impressed it's still there at his size.
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