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Why Shaquem Griffin will Make Roster, Where he Could Play

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  • I would not be surprised if in the long run he ends up as free safety.
    I agree.
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  • Yep Safety seems to be a logical position for him. Time will tell.
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  • Really good instincts with that kind of speed & power?, yep--> Safety seems like it would be a great fit for him.
    Says that he hasn't yet arrived + feels like he still has a lot to prove :stirthepot:
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  • TreeRon wrote:I would not be surprised if in the long run he ends up as free safety.
    I agree.



    No, he will never play FREE safety. He would play STRONG safety around the box.
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  • The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...
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  • FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.
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  • DB is not a natural position for him. Defensive Line in the American Athletic Conference is a long way from safety in the NFL.

    Using him at Will makes sense. He's too small for LEO. He's Malcom Smith without any LB experience.

    I'm not saying he couldn't be a strong safety in the future. He has some things that Irvin didn't. He's really smart and he's relentless. I love that Norton, Wagner and Wright are his teachers. He's got a really good chance to be successful.

    The Seahawk romantic wants to see him replace Kam in the new LOB. I wouldn't bet against him but can he master LB this season?
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  • He was a stand up rushing end on the LOS in college. The Seahawks are doing the smart thing, and putting him 5 yds off the LOS with his smaller size, and placing him at Will.

    Placing him at SS is too different at this juncture. Will is the perfect spot for his skillset, he doesn't have to take on as many blocks as the other linebackers, and gets to use his sideline to sideline speed. SS requires more backpedal, and DB techniques, stuff he would need to learn. He can start right now at Will.

    Leave him at Will.
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  • His speed is something you want to get on the field. It is noticeable when you watch him play. Do agree with those who say keep him at WOLB as he has no experience playing S.

    As far as his highest and best use I’d trust the team and coaches to play him at the position where he can be best used. It will interesting to see if the team sees a position change for him going forward, but somehow I doubt it.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.


    He actually was a Safety/DB all his life up until the last 2 years when we converted him. That’s why he is so good in coverage for a LB. That said, he’s a difference maker around the LOS. He’s unique as a LB, with crazy speed, ferocious, instinctive pass rusher, and the ability to cover like a DB, even slide out to the slot based on offensive personnel/formation.

    Playing him at Safety full time though eliminates his uniqueness and value as a player. There are safeties out there like him... but no LBs.
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  • I picture him more as a Deone Buchanon deathbacker clone personally. A bit undersized for LB but a bit oversized for safety. So give him the tweener role. Short zone coverages, sideline to sideline run stopper, occasional blitzer.
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  • I wouldn't want to mess with Griffin and experiment with him at safety.

    He's got crazy natural instincts around the line of scrimmage.........so continue to groom him to take over for KJ at the WIL LB spot where he can cover TE's, run to the ball and occasionally blitz off the edge.

    In the mean time, we've got ourselves a special teams Pro Bowler who's going to be an absolute terror on special teams.
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  • I thought he would replace Kam at SS. But he really is not a lights out deathbacker type of hitter. (In fairness, few are).

    But he is tremendously fast, chases the play down well, has tremendous instincts and tends to take really good angles.

    I still think he can be a stand up pass rush threat, but he does get caught in the wash sometimes. He does a good job of navigating the trash where bodies are all over the ground though.

    I suspect he can play safety but you limit his impact there.

    He won't replace Kam (but who could??) but he clearly is a great choice at Will.

    Again, Sample size of 1. Sure he will have some bad games too, as everyone does, but he clearly showed he is not a novelty.

    He is a damn good player with a great work ethic that can play high-level football against NFL talent. He isn't just a great story (though he is a marketer's wet dream). He is a guy that can produce when you put him in there, so since he is producing at WLB - we probably should keep him there.

    Weirdly he looks like he would also be comfortable at Mike and I honestly did not expect that. I would like to see more of him to see if that is just illusion or me reading his play weird.
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  • FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...


    You can attack from safety!!!

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  • Yes Griffin could probably play safety, but like I said above I think that'd be a mistake.

    Dude has crazy natural instincts around the line of scrimmage, moving positions IMO would stunt those instincts forcing him to think too much because it's not a position he's used to playing.

    Players like Griffin? You just wanna unleash, ball out and don't force them to think too much stunting their abilities.

    Pete seems to agree, cause that's what he's doing with Shaqueem so far...............WIL and special teams, and he led the team in tackles in his first pre-season game. Don't mess with that.
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  • Seymour wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...


    You can attack from safety!!!


    Na... he's chasing the guy down right there. That's not attacking and disrupting a play... that's chasing trying to stop one.
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  • Warning: I really got into this.


    Shaquem Griffin will make the roster because he’s a very talented, very driven, and very hungry player. He plays with 10x the heart and soul of what you could say are the more entitled, more coddled players who think or believe they can just go through the motions or just cash in without putting in the 100% dedication you need to not only be great but to survive the league.

    I.e. if you put Shaquem’s passion, mindset, dedication to his craft with or without his hand into the bodies of let’s say a Harvin, or Christine Michael those guys might have dominated rather than frustrated.

    Shaquem’s intangibles are off the charts, that he just makes everyone around him just as passionate and as hungry as he is. In many ways he’s not much different than a young Russ or a young Baldwin... as guys who fought through thier critics and naysayers and adverserities to become top players at there craft and for the most part have always put the team first.

    However, despite all that Shaquem Griffin could be great not because of his intangibles but because the dude can straight up ball... he was one of the most explosive and most disruptive players in college last season and possesses imo elite instincts in terms of playing through to the ball. Just great awareness and understanding and great speed and quickness to seal the deal. Close it out.

    WLB is a great position for him because in Carroll’s system to my understanding it’s a position that is more read and react towards the ball carrier as well as one that reads offensive keys to defend zones. WLB typically don’t have to be the biggest or fastest but I’d say quick wits and smart instinctual football with awareness and understanding of the gap discipline as well as feeling what your teammates are doing around you is more important.

    It’s likely why KJ Wright was a perfect fit for WLB despite being solid at SLB. Wright has great feel and understanding for the game... like great instincts and awareness that makes his football speed much greater than his athletic measurables. I kind of get it why his teammates nicknamed him Spider-Man... cuz he’s got that elite instinct, that Spider-sense.

    It was also interesting to learn and maybe because over the last couple of years .net Xs and Os game has been lacking but at times the WLB is asked to play sort of a pseudo MLB which allows Wagner to either free lance or drop back in deep coverage to allow Kam Chancellor/SS to free lance. So that made sense to me as to why at times Wright often filled in for Wagner at MLB when Wags was banged up because at times the WLB to play MLB in certain looks. Why DJ Alexander who backed up Wright last year is transitioning to MLB or was until his injury. And why Shaquem vs the Colts at times looked like he was playing MLB because he was.

    And that’s cool to know... Griffin is a WLB on the depth chart but his range, athleticism, instincts, pass-rush acumen, elite speed once he becomes more refined, more adept to what he needs to do to maximize his skillset to be more in tuned to an NFL standard he’d going to be a beast of a chess piece.

    To finally ask your 2nd question as to where Griffin can play, pretty much anywhere but DT or a position that within the play-call that doesn’t ask to occupy a blocker but to finish the play, get to the ball. Whether it’s as an edge defender/ pass-rusher (rather than setter), standard OLB, pseudo MLB, money LBer aka pseudo Safety, and he should be able to much with like Irvin’s background able to become a pseudo slot CB able to run with WRs when and if opposing OCs deal a mismatch.

    It kind of comes off that I believe Griffin is already going to be an HoF type talent, that’ll be up to him, but he definitely is the ultimate tweener, very capable of handling a multitude of duties if the Seahawks want him to. From what I get from Shaquem, he’s going to be the best whatever the team wants him to be. And he’s going to put in the work and time in maximizing his opportunities to help his team. If the Seahawks, just want him to focus on bejng the best WLB and Special Teamer he can be, then he’s going to do it. I don’t doubt that one bit. He’s going to take his lumps and what not and have his fair share of failures but at some point he’ll fight through everything he needs to, to be the player that he’s needs to be in whatever he is asked to do... mostly because of his love for this game. That’s crazy to me. It’s going to be exciting watching this dude play ball and it makes it so much sweeter that he gets to share it with his broham. And more importantly both brothers are going to be great leaders on this defense... sooner rather than later.
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  • FinNasty wrote:
    Seymour wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...


    You can attack from safety!!!


    Na... he's chasing the guy down right there. That's not attacking and disrupting a play... that's chasing trying to stop one.


    Knocking the ball out at the goal line sure hell is disrupting play in this part of the country.
    Defenders are always "chasing" since the other team has the ball.
    :roll:
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  • He seemed to get caught in the wash a bit on inside runs. SS might be a good fit, except we require the SS to often set the edge, which he really struggled woth at the senior bowl. He is probably in the right place. I'd love to see him at DE in passing situations, to see if he can do it. All with time.
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  • Seymour wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:
    Seymour wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...


    You can attack from safety!!!


    Na... he's chasing the guy down right there. That's not attacking and disrupting a play... that's chasing trying to stop one.


    Knocking the ball out at the goal line sure hell is disrupting play in this part of the country.
    Defenders are always "chasing" since the other team has the ball.
    :roll:


    Lol you know what I mean man lol. By attacking I mean disrupting the play while it’s developing, not downfield after the play has happened. Being disruptive behind the LOS and using his instincts to read and the as the play is developing is where he’s at his best...
    Last edited by FinNasty on Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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  • Tical21 wrote:He seemed to get caught in the wash a bit on inside runs. SS might be a good fit, except we require the SS to often set the edge, which he really struggled woth at the senior bowl. He is probably in the right place. I'd love to see him at DE in passing situations, to see if he can do it. All with time.


    You mean like this? ;)

    Last edited by FinNasty on Tue Aug 14, 2018 5:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.



    Wrong Wrong Wrong, he played Safety but was not in games, WHY HE ALMOST WALKED AWAY, the move to LB got him into games, he does have experience and the way we would use him at SS is like a tweener safety Linebacker anyway.
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  • Mad Dog wrote:I picture him more as a Deone Buchanon deathbacker clone personally. A bit undersized for LB but a bit oversized for safety. So give him the tweener role. Short zone coverages, sideline to sideline run stopper, occasional blitzer.


    He might be oversized at FS but he's definitely not at SS. He has 4.4 speed at this weight AND he's big enough to take on big RB's and TE's.

    I'm not suggesting that he SHOULD be switched to strong safety but was merely curious why they hadn't at least tried him out there seeing as how he is a little undersized at LB.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.



    Wrong Wrong Wrong, he played Safety but was not in games, WHY HE ALMOST WALKED AWAY, the move to LB got him into games, he does have experience and the way we would use him at SS is like a tweener safety Linebacker anyway.

    So just FYI... that’s kinda yes and no.

    So, yes he did almost quit. And yes it was because he wasn’t playing....

    BUT...

    ...he wasn’t playing b/c the old coaching staff couldn’t look past his hand. At all. And it was the frustration from that prejudice that almost drove him to quit. It wasn’t that he wasn’t good on the football field, even while still a DB. The old coaching staff just looked at him without a hand and thought “how can he play football”? It became clear to him that the only reason why he was offered a scholarship was to get his brother... that they didn’t actually want him. I mean... to put it in some perspective... he wasn’t even played on Special Teams. And all the while his identical twin with the same speed, same athleticism, and same ability is getting to play with the 1st team as a starter. It was bad and VERY apparent to him and everyone else. And with no shot to ever play in his eyes no matter how hard he worked it became very defeating.

    When the new coaching staff came in 2016... they came in with an open mind about him and immediately saw his insane athleticism and drive. They put him in a LB/DB hybrid joker role and he immediately won Defensive Player of the Year for the conference. The following year, with a year to bulk up some more and learn how to pass rush, they moved him to OLB... and he was unstoppable and became a legend at UCF.

    So, yes he almost quit and yes it was b/c he wasn’t playing... but it wasn’t for lack of ability. It was b/c the coaching staff couldn’t see past his missing hand...
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  • FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...


    This guy knows. I tend to agree. I'd like to see him get after the QB a bit more as he did in that bowl game.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.



    Wrong Wrong Wrong, he played Safety but was not in games, WHY HE ALMOST WALKED AWAY, the move to LB got him into games, he does have experience and the way we would use him at SS is like a tweener safety Linebacker anyway.


    Exactly....you get it, outsiders not so much.
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  • Seymour wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:The further away you move him from the ball and LOS... the bigger mistake you’re making. Use his speed to attack, not chase...

    I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.



    Wrong Wrong Wrong, he played Safety but was not in games, WHY HE ALMOST WALKED AWAY, the move to LB got him into games, he does have experience and the way we would use him at SS is like a tweener safety Linebacker anyway.


    Exactly....you get it, outsiders not so much.

    No, I get it. You play a single high C3 coverage scheme that puts your safety in the box more often than not. That said, playing him in that role still reduces some of his value. If you have him at LB, and a team trots out 11 personnel on 1st down... you don’t have to put in a sub-package. With Griffin as your 3rd LB, you can use the same personnel for base and nickel, which makes you less predictable based on personnel that you have on the field when the O is calling in the play.

    Plus, in passing situations I would assume (this is an assumption that you’d have to correct me on) that the WLB blitzes more often than your SS. Griffin blitzing is something you want... b/c while he can cover... he’s best at getting after the QB. WLB will put him in rushing situations more often than SS...
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  • FinNasty wrote:
    Seymour wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:I agree with this sentiment, Griffin also doesn't have any experience as a DB, and he has proven to be a dynamite linebacker. He is the type of guy that can go sideline to sideline, and also be a threat as a pass rusher. If he had an extra hand, I bet you he would have been a top ten pick. In training camp and the preseason game against the Colts he demonstrated that he had another trick up his sleeve, pass coverage.



    Wrong Wrong Wrong, he played Safety but was not in games, WHY HE ALMOST WALKED AWAY, the move to LB got him into games, he does have experience and the way we would use him at SS is like a tweener safety Linebacker anyway.


    Exactly....you get it, outsiders not so much.

    No, I get it. You play a single high C3 coverage scheme that puts your safety in the box more often than not. That said, playing him in that role still reduces some of his value. If you have him at LB, and a team trots out 11 personnel on 1st down... you don’t have to put in a sub-package. With Griffin as your 3rd LB, you can use the same personnel for base and nickel, which makes you less predictable based on personnel that you have on the field when the O is calling in the play.

    Plus, in passing situations I would assume (this is an assumption that you’d have to correct me on) that the WLB blitzes more often than your SS. Griffin blitzing is something you want... b/c while he can cover... he’s best at getting after the QB. WLB will put him in rushing situations more often than SS...


    History has shown that TE coverage has been our achellis heal, Griff has good coverage skills and make up speed if needed. Which is the real asset that he could bring. We have pass rushers, but a SS that can line up as a LB in a 3-4 look and then a SS that can cover in a 4-3 seems to have great value.
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  • Pandion Haliaetus wrote:lacking but at times the WLB is asked to play sort of a pseudo MLB which allows Wagner to either free lance or drop back in deep coverage to allow Kam Chancellor/SS to free lance. So that made sense to me as to why at times Wright often filled in for Wagner at MLB when Wags was banged up because at times the WLB to play MLB in certain looks.


    It's because when Seattle is in their Base 4-3 Under look, it looks like a 3-4 with the Will & Mike as the inside backers and the Sam & Leo as the outside backers. The difference is they are 1 gapping. They don't have to read & react like in a 2 gap 3-4 defense. Every player is responsible for their gap, it is a simple yet effective scheme that allows the players to play fast.
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  • Fade wrote:
    Pandion Haliaetus wrote:lacking but at times the WLB is asked to play sort of a pseudo MLB which allows Wagner to either free lance or drop back in deep coverage to allow Kam Chancellor/SS to free lance. So that made sense to me as to why at times Wright often filled in for Wagner at MLB when Wags was banged up because at times the WLB to play MLB in certain looks.


    It's because when Seattle is in their Base 4-3 Under look, it looks like a 3-4 with the Will & Mike as the inside backers and the Sam & Leo as the outside backers. The difference is they are 1 gapping. They don't have to read & react like in a 2 gap 3-4 defense. Every player is responsible for their gap, it is a simple yet effective scheme that allows the players to play fast.
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    I realize that it looks like Kam is about to come down into the box in this picture, but this snapshot of your base is why I wouldn’t want Griffin playing SS. Pre-snap the SS isn't always down near the LOS. Many times the SS is still lining up 10-15 yards downfield as the ball is snapped. Keep Griffin closer to the LOS and let him get after it...

    Don't be scared that he's a little undersized... he's still bulking up from his conversion from DB. Dude is a LB through and through... and
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  • FinNasty wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    Pandion Haliaetus wrote:lacking but at times the WLB is asked to play sort of a pseudo MLB which allows Wagner to either free lance or drop back in deep coverage to allow Kam Chancellor/SS to free lance. So that made sense to me as to why at times Wright often filled in for Wagner at MLB when Wags was banged up because at times the WLB to play MLB in certain looks.


    It's because when Seattle is in their Base 4-3 Under look, it looks like a 3-4 with the Will & Mike as the inside backers and the Sam & Leo as the outside backers. The difference is they are 1 gapping. They don't have to read & react like in a 2 gap 3-4 defense. Every player is responsible for their gap, it is a simple yet effective scheme that allows the players to play fast.
    Image


    I realize that it looks like Kam is about to come down into the box in this picture, but this snapshot of your base is why I wouldn’t want Griffin playing SS. Pre-snap the SS isn't always down near the LOS. Many times the SS is still lining up 10-15 yards downfield as the ball is snapped. Keep Griffin closer to the LOS and let him get after it...

    Don't be scared that he's a little undersized... he's still bulking up from his conversion from DB. Dude is a LB through and through
    ... and


    What? You must be confused.

    Fade wrote:The Seahawks are doing the smart thing, and putting him 5 yds off the LOS with his smaller size, and placing him at Will.

    Placing him at SS is too different at this juncture. Will is the perfect spot for his skillset, he doesn't have to take on as many blocks as the other linebackers, and gets to use his sideline to sideline speed. SS requires more backpedal, and DB techniques, stuff he would need to learn. He can start right now at Will.

    Leave him at Will.


    I already said he should remain at Will.
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    Fade
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  • Fade wrote:
    FinNasty wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    Pandion Haliaetus wrote:lacking but at times the WLB is asked to play sort of a pseudo MLB which allows Wagner to either free lance or drop back in deep coverage to allow Kam Chancellor/SS to free lance. So that made sense to me as to why at times Wright often filled in for Wagner at MLB when Wags was banged up because at times the WLB to play MLB in certain looks.


    It's because when Seattle is in their Base 4-3 Under look, it looks like a 3-4 with the Will & Mike as the inside backers and the Sam & Leo as the outside backers. The difference is they are 1 gapping. They don't have to read & react like in a 2 gap 3-4 defense. Every player is responsible for their gap, it is a simple yet effective scheme that allows the players to play fast.
    Image


    I realize that it looks like Kam is about to come down into the box in this picture, but this snapshot of your base is why I wouldn’t want Griffin playing SS. Pre-snap the SS isn't always down near the LOS. Many times the SS is still lining up 10-15 yards downfield as the ball is snapped. Keep Griffin closer to the LOS and let him get after it...

    Don't be scared that he's a little undersized... he's still bulking up from his conversion from DB. Dude is a LB through and through
    ... and


    What? You must be confused.

    Fade wrote:The Seahawks are doing the smart thing, and putting him 5 yds off the LOS with his smaller size, and placing him at Will.

    Placing him at SS is too different at this juncture. Will is the perfect spot for his skillset, he doesn't have to take on as many blocks as the other linebackers, and gets to use his sideline to sideline speed. SS requires more backpedal, and DB techniques, stuff he would need to learn. He can start right now at Will.

    Leave him at Will.



    I already said he should remain at Will.



    Yep, wasn’t talking about you specifically... more just using your image to help illustrate the point I was trying to make. :irishdrinkers:
    Image
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