Russell Wilson "should have won MVP," says Anthony Barr

sdog1981

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The fact the 2017 team won 9 games and was really close to winning 11 should go down in NFL history as an amazing accomplishment.
 

Spin Doctor

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I think the right guy got it. Russell Wilson really struggled at the end of the year, and his team didn't even make the playoffs as a result. If a football team doesn't even make the playoffs an MVP is an automatic no go in the eyes of the media. It is also mentioning that there is some major hyperbole about our receivers. We had Graham, Baldwin, and Richardson, that is not a bad receiving core by any stretch of the imagination.
 

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Spin Doctor":2o9fj4t2 said:
I think the right guy got it. Russell Wilson really struggled at the end of the year, and his team didn't even make the playoffs as a result. If a football team doesn't even make the playoffs an MVP is an automatic no go in the eyes of the media. It is also mentioning that there is some major hyperbole about our receivers. We had Graham, Baldwin, and Richardson, that is not a bad receiving core by any stretch of the imagination.

(This post isn't aimed at you btw, just general)...

I agree he fizzled at the end but come on man. NO player in the NFL was MORE VALUABLE to their team then Russell Damn Straight Wilson. Think of the term. Most Valuable Player. To me, it's not about popular vote. It's not even about stats. It's, straight up...What player is most valuable to the success of their team?

In 2017? Despite the drop off? It's Russell Wilson and it's not even close.

Pardon me, but...

(mic drop)
 

Spin Doctor

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Aros":3bdcbsab said:
Spin Doctor":3bdcbsab said:
I think the right guy got it. Russell Wilson really struggled at the end of the year, and his team didn't even make the playoffs as a result. If a football team doesn't even make the playoffs an MVP is an automatic no go in the eyes of the media. It is also mentioning that there is some major hyperbole about our receivers. We had Graham, Baldwin, and Richardson, that is not a bad receiving core by any stretch of the imagination.

I agree he fizzled at the end but come on man. NO player in the NFL was MORE VALUABLE to their team then Russell Damn Straight Wilson. Think of the term. Most Valuable Player. To me, it's not about popular vote. It's not even about stats. It's, straight up...What player is most valuable to the success of their team?

In 2017? Despite the drop off? It's Russell Wilson and it's not even close.

Pardon me, but...

(mic drop)
Please. Russell Wilson faltered when it mattered most to the Seahawks. The Seahawks could have grabbed a wildcard spot, but he threw up some of the biggest stinkers of the season in the last few weeks of play with the playoffs on the line. One of the prerequisites to getting the reward is at least making the playoffs. If Wilson would have been able to do that he would have gotten the reward. He had the chance, and he blew it. If Russell Wilson was not on the team we'd still be in the same position: watching the playoffs from our couch.

I do not think that you can give it to a guy who didn't even make the post season. Russ had his chance to win the reward but he blew it.
 

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Spin Doctor":1ac9nly3 said:
Please. Russell Wilson faltered when it mattered most to the Seahawks. The Seahawks could have grabbed a wildcard spot, but he threw up some of the biggest stinkers of the season in the last few weeks of play with the playoffs on the line....

None of his faltering off had anything to do with carrying the entire team for over two weeks of football. Got it.
 

Hawk1217

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Aros":26q9aicp said:
Spin Doctor":26q9aicp said:
I think the right guy got it. Russell Wilson really struggled at the end of the year, and his team didn't even make the playoffs as a result. If a football team doesn't even make the playoffs an MVP is an automatic no go in the eyes of the media. It is also mentioning that there is some major hyperbole about our receivers. We had Graham, Baldwin, and Richardson, that is not a bad receiving core by any stretch of the imagination.

(This post isn't aimed at you btw, just general)...

I agree he fizzled at the end but come on man. NO player in the NFL was MORE VALUABLE to their team then Russell Damn Straight Wilson. Think of the term. Most Valuable Player. To me, it's not about popular vote. It's not even about stats. It's, straight up...What player is most valuable to the success of their team?

In 2017? Despite the drop off? It's Russell Wilson and it's not even close.

Pardon me, but...

(mic drop)


You are correct, unfortunately, in my time observing this board, there are a few that will never give him what he deserves. It is unfortunate, pathetic but true. The excuse is he fizzled down the stretch. so lets look at fizzle using qb rating as our measure since it accounts for all aspects of being a QB. HIs last 5 games were 108.6, 107.8, 71.8, 76.9. 118.6. So 2 "fizzle games". Okay, maybe lets compare to Bradys last 5. 82, 106.8, 87.6, 59.5, 82.4. Hmm ahh yeah if Wilson fizzled so did Brady the difference is his team won. Now, why well for one they had a run game, they had 16 rushing tds with Brady having none of them. We had 4 rushing tds and Wilson had 3 of them. That is the difference. Brady had help Wilson had none.

Wilson by definition of MVP should have won it. However the true definition of MVP is not what they look at, you must also win, which means you need help, help Wilson did not get.

Now as to Wr, ahh Grham is not a Wr he is a TE, Doug is known and the person said name 3. Richardson is not that well known outside of our fans. Some have no clue who he is. So the reality is most people cant name 3 WR on our team last year.
 

adeltaY

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Woah woah using QB rating and not mentioning he threw for 93 yards and around 60 net yards in the cowboys game does not present the whole picture. He did not play at an MVP level in any of those four games. Not saying its entirely his fault, the situation was pretty bad around him. Think about it, if you aren't getting help from the running game, you better be throwing for close to 300 yards a game to sustain the offense. He only got there against the Jags in that last stretch.

If we're ignoring Graham as a receiver we can ignore Gronk as a receiver? Cooks is Baldwin's equal at best. Otherwise our receivers were better last year than Brady's given Edelman's injury. That's not a very useful debate anyway.

Brady consistently played better than Wilson so he deserved MVP. Also their defense was garbage this year so while Wilson was getting no running game or OL help, Brady wasn't getting any favors from his defense.
 

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adeltaY":jkvv4wpm said:
Woah woah using QB rating and not mentioning he threw for 93 yards and around 60 net yards in the cowboys game does not present the whole picture. He did not play at an MVP level in any of those four games. Not saying its entirely his fault, the situation was pretty bad around him. Think about it, if you aren't getting help from the running game, you better be throwing for close to 300 yards a game to sustain the offense. He only got there against the Jags in that last stretch.

If we're ignoring Graham as a receiver we can ignore Gronk as a receiver? Cooks is Baldwin's equal at best. Otherwise our receivers were better last year than Brady's given Edelman's injury. That's not a very useful debate anyway.

Brady consistently played better than Wilson so he deserved MVP. Also their defense was garbage this year so while Wilson was getting no running game or OL help, Brady wasn't getting any favors from his defense.


woah woah mentioning he only had 93 yards without mentioning he only got to throw the ball 21 times is also not presenting the whole picture. Also, we won that game LOL. As for Brady VS Wilson, I beg to differ on him playing better. As I showed Brady had a lot of bad game as well, including the worst game either of them had with a 59 qb rating. As to the Defense, NE was ranked 5th in scoring, we were ranked 13th so yeah he had a better defense too. So we are saying Crook is Baldwins equal, HMM okay ahh who do we have that is Amendola's equal? So let's say they are equal for the sake of argument.

So lets put this to bed

WR-=
Oline-NE
Te-NE
Run game-NE
Defense-NE

Hmm Brady had more help.
 

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adeltaY":bnug1gje said:
Woah woah using QB rating and not mentioning he threw for 93 yards and around 60 net yards in the cowboys game does not present the whole picture. He did not play at an MVP level in any of those four games. Not saying its entirely his fault, the situation was pretty bad around him. Think about it, if you aren't getting help from the running game, you better be throwing for close to 300 yards a game to sustain the offense. He only got there against the Jags in that last stretch.

If we're ignoring Graham as a receiver we can ignore Gronk as a receiver? Cooks is Baldwin's equal at best. Otherwise our receivers were better last year than Brady's given Edelman's injury. That's not a very useful debate anyway.

Brady consistently played better than Wilson so he deserved MVP. Also their defense was garbage this year so while Wilson was getting no running game or OL help, Brady wasn't getting any favors from his defense.
Well hell, there ya go, Wilson should have had someone on Defense to run the ball for him....Another William "The Refrigerator" Perry type behemoth.
Hell, maybe should have sent Wilson in to Kick field goals too, he sure as hell couldn't have done much worse than Shank master Walsh did.
 

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Hawk1217":j05fmsgo said:
You are correct, unfortunately, in my time observing this board, there are a few that will never give him what he deserves. It is unfortunate, pathetic but true. The excuse is he fizzled down the stretch. so lets look at fizzle using qb rating as our measure since it accounts for all aspects of being a QB. HIs last 5 games were 108.6, 107.8, 71.8, 76.9. 118.6. So 2 "fizzle games". Okay, maybe lets compare to Bradys last 5. 82, 106.8, 87.6, 59.5, 82.4. Hmm ahh yeah if Wilson fizzled so did Brady the difference is his team won. Now, why well for one they had a run game, they had 16 rushing tds with Brady having none of them. We had 4 rushing tds and Wilson had 3 of them. That is the difference. Brady had help Wilson had none.

Wilson by definition of MVP should have won it. However the true definition of MVP is not what they look at, you must also win, which means you need help, help Wilson did not get.

Now as to Wr, ahh Grham is not a Wr he is a TE, Doug is known and the person said name 3. Richardson is not that well known outside of our fans. Some have no clue who he is. So the reality is most people cant name 3 WR on our team last year.

Preach on brother! :2thumbs:
 

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Amendola is not a great receiver dude. He has been clutch in the playoffs but Richardson is a better receiver. Also throwing the ball 21 times for 93 yards is awful. That's less than 5 yards per attempt and furthers my point.

As for the defense, we were 13th in DVOA and NE was 31st. Looking at yards, NE was 29th and we were 11th. They were also dead last in giving up yards per drive, BUT they were 1st in average starting field position. Their defense faced offenses who had to travel the most distance to get into scoring range due to their O and ST being really good. They were also #2 in redzone defense. Thus, their scoring defense rank is high, but looking more closely at the numbers shows that they were not better than our defense. One stat does not an accurate comparison make.

Brady has better offensive weapons and he played better within the confines of his system than Wilson did within his, even given how unfair Wilson's confines were. Brady had a better passer rating, total QBR, adjusted net yards per attempt, completion percentage, sack percentage, etc. than Wilson. Wilson had waaay beat in rushing yards, but Brady threw for more yards than Wilson gained overall. It's not a knock on Wilson, I've defended the guy to death here, I'm not a hater. Brady just played better this year, it's no shame to be second in the MVP race to one of the greatest ever. Honestly, I think he had a better MVP candidacy in 2015, it just happened to be a stronger year then with Carson and Cam having fantastic seasons.
 

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Much easier to play better when you don't have flesh eating zombies chasing you every play and your fresh out of bullets to defend yourself.
 

Hawk1217

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adeltaY":3biue9dp said:
Amendola is not a great receiver dude. He has been clutch in the playoffs but Richardson is a better receiver. Also throwing the ball 21 times for 93 yards is awful. That's less than 5 yards per attempt and furthers my point.

As for the defense, we were 13th in DVOA and NE was 31st. Looking at yards, NE was 29th and we were 11th. They were also dead last in giving up yards per drive, BUT they were 1st in average starting field position. Their defense faced offenses who had to travel the most distance to get into scoring range due to their O and ST being really good. They were also #2 in redzone defense. Thus, their scoring defense rank is high, but looking more closely at the numbers shows that they were not better than our defense. One stat does not an accurate comparison make.

Brady has better offensive weapons and he played better within the confines of his system than Wilson did within his, even given how unfair Wilson's confines were. Brady had a better passer rating, total QBR, adjusted net yards per attempt, completion percentage, sack percentage, etc. than Wilson. Wilson had waaay beat in rushing yards, but Brady threw for more yards than Wilson gained overall. It's not a knock on Wilson, I've defended the guy to death here, I'm not a hater. Brady just played better this year, it's no shame to be second in the MVP race to one of the greatest ever. Honestly, I think he had a better MVP candidacy in 2015, it just happened to be a stronger year then with Carson and Cam having fantastic seasons.

Hmm so let me get this right, the idea is to outscore the other team, but you expect me to say the Hawks defense who gave up more points was better than the Pats who gave up less. Hmm yeah no.

Once again the problem with the 93 yards being bad is once again you ignore the fact that Brady had by far the worse game by either QB down the stretch and yet won the MVP. In fact, he had several bad games down the stretch, So that excuse is incorrect.

Now saying Richardson is better than Amendola. LOL If you say so, Let me see Richard 1 year with more than 1 td, Amendola 6. In fact Comparing their first 4 years, Amendola 1726 yards, 7 tds. Richardson 1302 yards, 8 tds and Richardson played 5 more games so sorry, this shows Amendola is better.

Thanks for admitting Brady has better weapons on offense and making my point though.
 

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chris98251":3a3leb1i said:
Much easier to play better when you don't have flesh eating zombies chasing you every play and your fresh out of bullets to defend yourself.


LOL true, so true.
 

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Spin Doctor":26nkj91v said:
Aros":26nkj91v said:
Spin Doctor":26nkj91v said:
I think the right guy got it. Russell Wilson really struggled at the end of the year, and his team didn't even make the playoffs as a result. If a football team doesn't even make the playoffs an MVP is an automatic no go in the eyes of the media. It is also mentioning that there is some major hyperbole about our receivers. We had Graham, Baldwin, and Richardson, that is not a bad receiving core by any stretch of the imagination.

I agree he fizzled at the end but come on man. NO player in the NFL was MORE VALUABLE to their team then Russell Damn Straight Wilson. Think of the term. Most Valuable Player. To me, it's not about popular vote. It's not even about stats. It's, straight up...What player is most valuable to the success of their team?

In 2017? Despite the drop off? It's Russell Wilson and it's not even close.

Pardon me, but...

(mic drop)
Please. Russell Wilson faltered when it mattered most to the Seahawks. The Seahawks could have grabbed a wildcard spot, but he threw up some of the biggest stinkers of the season in the last few weeks of play with the playoffs on the line. One of the prerequisites to getting the reward is at least making the playoffs. If Wilson would have been able to do that he would have gotten the reward. He had the chance, and he blew it. If Russell Wilson was not on the team we'd still be in the same position: watching the playoffs from our couch.

I do not think that you can give it to a guy who didn't even make the post season. Russ had his chance to win the reward but he blew it.
That’s correct, they’d have been sitting on their couches. The difference is, they’d very likely be doing so with a losing record—quite possibly a very bad losing record.
 

Spin Doctor

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Aros":2fphrqcz said:
Spin Doctor":2fphrqcz said:
Please. Russell Wilson faltered when it mattered most to the Seahawks. The Seahawks could have grabbed a wildcard spot, but he threw up some of the biggest stinkers of the season in the last few weeks of play with the playoffs on the line....

None of his faltering off had anything to do with carrying the entire team for over two weeks of football. Got it.
The fact remains, he faltered when we needed him most. With or without Wilson this year the results were the same, no playoffs. He had a few horrible games when we needed him to be his normal self. Call it what you will, but that will take you out of contention for MVP 9 times out of 10, especially when the other guy had a similar season statistically, and made the post season.

Russell Wilson did not get the MVP, deal with it. He had a fantastic season, but with or without him the results are exactly the same, no post season.
 

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Hawk1217":26tgrrgf said:
Wilson by definition of MVP should have won it. However the true definition of MVP is not what they look at, you must also win, which means you need help, help Wilson did not get.

Again, it depends on how one defines MVP, Anthony!, er, I mean Hawk1217.

Russ didn't do enough to help his team win when it counted, at the end of the season. Perhaps that mattered to enough voters, even if his QB rating was higher than Brady's.
 

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Ad Hawk":3p3p13i1 said:
Hawk1217":3p3p13i1 said:
Wilson by definition of MVP should have won it. However the true definition of MVP is not what they look at, you must also win, which means you need help, help Wilson did not get.

Again, it depends on how one defines MVP, Anthony!, er, I mean Hawk1217.

Russ didn't do enough to help his team win when it counted, at the end of the season. Perhaps that mattered to enough voters, even if his QB rating was higher than Brady's.

:escape: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :2thumbs:

BTW I'm a big Russ fan and NO he was not MVP IMO.
 

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