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Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:47 pm
  • JammerHawk suggested we start a salary cap specific thread which seems like a great idea.

    Given the importance of the salary cap it has been a keen interest of mine for a good while now and I'd class it as a hobby outside of football itself.

    I initially used Over The Cap (fantastic website) to get to grips with it as I'm sure a lot of you guys use but have started to move away and use my own calculations (often using OTC as a reference point to make sure I'm along the right lines, typically I am, thankfully!).

    My numbers are also more up to date than OTC's currently are, but given they are managing 31 other teams they are doing a fantastic job.

    If you have any questions relating to the salary cap, how it works, how contracts work etc then fire away :2thumbs:
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  • For reference, Seattle currently has $15,141,601 available.
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  • How much cap would we have available going into next season, if say Avril & Kam are either cut or retire, ET plays this year out & not extended, and we trade Britt for a draft pick?
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  • 12forlife wrote:How much cap would we have available going into next season, if say Avril & Kam are either cut or retire, ET plays this year out & not extended, and we trade Britt for a draft pick?


    $13,524,517

    (less than we currently have) and thats for a number of reasons -

    Kam would create a negative impact on the cap if he is released due to the structure in his contract with injury guarantees and signing bonus. (signing bonus is always 100% guaranteed in contracts).

    Avril would add $7,125,000 with only $500,000 in dead money

    Justin Britt would also have a negative impact on the cap due to his signing bonus and also the $5,000,000 option the team picked up a couple of days ago. Cutting or trading him would LOWER the cap by $2,583,334 as his cap number is $6,166,666 but his dead cap number is $8,750,000
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  • Good thread idea - thank you (let's see how long it takes us to start talking about non-cap/contract issues)...

    I heard vague rumblings that cutting Bennett may be more about longer-term cap savings than 2018 cap savings. How much did cutting Bennett save us in 2019 and 2020 respectively, relative to:

    1: Cutting him after the 2018 season
    2: Cutting him after the 2019 season
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  • JerHawk81 wrote:Good thread idea - thank you.

    I heard vague rumblings that cutting Bennett may be more about longer-term cap savings than 2018 cap savings. How much did cutting Bennett save us in 2019 and 2020 respectively, relative to:

    1: Cutting him after the 2018 season
    2: Cutting him after the 2019 season


    Good question!

    The team saved $8,750,000 in 2019 and $10,225,000 in 2020 by cutting him when they did.

    If the team kept him around for the 2018 season and either traded or cut him in 2019, the team would have saved $5,262,500 ($3,487,500 less) and still $10,225,000 in 2020 so you can see why the move made sense.
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  • original poster wrote:
    JerHawk81 wrote:Good thread idea - thank you.

    I heard vague rumblings that cutting Bennett may be more about longer-term cap savings than 2018 cap savings. How much did cutting Bennett save us in 2019 and 2020 respectively, relative to:

    1: Cutting him after the 2018 season
    2: Cutting him after the 2019 season


    Good question!

    The team saved $8,750,000 in 2019 and $10,225,000 in 2020 by cutting him when they did.

    If the team kept him around for the 2018 season and either traded or cut him in 2019, the team would have saved $5,262,500 ($3,487,500 less) and still $10,225,000 in 2020 so you can see why the move made sense.


    In a world dominated by instant gratification and tunnel vision, it's nice to see posts that address more forward looking thinking and complete awareness. To the extent that there is sufficient interest in a complete understanding of cap considerations this thread will either thrive or die.

    Thanks for posting. :2thumbs: I'll be hoping for the best.
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  • Thanks Jville, appreciate it :2thumbs:
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  • Thanks for doing this OP!

    My question is regarding Thomas. If he is traded post June 1 or the trade is designated as such if possible can the cap savings on his dead money of $1.9 mil be prorated over this year and next? I've assumed the answer is no b/c this is the last year of his deal but wonder if I'm right. At present OTC says his cap number for this season is $8.5 million with $1.9 million in dead money, if traded he'd seemingly free up $6.6 million. if we were able to prorate as i ask it'd be $7.4 mil. He is a FA after this season and appears to want to move to Texas.

    This area, the cap rules and the calculations of cap numbers, is to some quite arcane our Hawkstorian is very knowledgable and quick to respond if you are ever stumpted, just saying. There are quite a few others here too.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:00 am
  • jammerhawk wrote:Thanks for doing this OP!

    My question is regarding Thomas. If he is traded post June 1 or the trade is designated as such if possible can the cap savings on his dead money of $1.9 mil be prorated over this year and next? I've assumed the answer is no b/c this is the last year of his deal but wonder if I'm right. At present OTC says his cap number for this season is $8.5 million with $1.9 million in dead money, if traded he'd seemingly free up $6.6 million. if we were able to prorate as i ask it'd be $7.4 mil. He is a FA after this season and appears to want to move to Texas.

    This area, the cap rules and the calculations of cap numbers, is to some quite arcane our Hawkstorian is very knowledgable and quick to respond if you are ever stumpted, just saying. There are quite a few others here too.


    :2thumbs:

    With a trade you couldn't do a post June 1st (actually the 12th May this year) to split the dead money over 2 years unfortunately. It makes no difference that he isn't under contract in 2019, even if he was the dead money would have to be absorbed in the year the trade was completed.

    I wouldn't be at all surprised if this is addressed in the next CBA in a couple of years though as fans love trades and making them more appealing in certain situations with teams can only benefit the league as a whole.

    Given the team would have very likely already paid the player his signing bonus (it's usually paid in either 2, 3 or 4 instalments) it would be a good move to allow teams to split the money over two years in certain scenarios (the JPP trade from the Giants today being a prime example!)
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Sun Mar 25, 2018 11:35 am
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  • 12forlife wrote:How much cap would we have available going into next season, if say Avril & Kam are either cut or retire, ET plays this year out & not extended, and we trade Britt for a draft pick?

    From cap's perspective, there must be reasons why we haven't released Kam and Avril?

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  • Wait, what. Going into next year if they do not come back and Kam retires we have over 84 million cap space.


    original poster wrote:
    12forlife wrote:How much cap would we have available going into next season, if say Avril & Kam are either cut or retire, ET plays this year out & not extended, and we trade Britt for a draft pick?


    $13,524,517

    (less than we currently have) and thats for a number of reasons -

    Kam would create a negative impact on the cap if he is released due to the structure in his contract with injury guarantees and signing bonus. (signing bonus is always 100% guaranteed in contracts).

    Avril would add $7,125,000 with only $500,000 in dead money

    Justin Britt would also have a negative impact on the cap due to his signing bonus and also the $5,000,000 option the team picked up a couple of days ago. Cutting or trading him would LOWER the cap by $2,583,334 as his cap number is $6,166,666 but his dead cap number is $8,750,000
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  • I would say who cares. Seattle has been terrable if the 4th round. They grabbed KJ and dare I say WT3. Other than that comlete busts, EJ Wilson, Kris Durham, Robert Turbin, Jaye Howard, Chris Harper, Marsh, Norwood, KPL, Poole, Glow,

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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:46 am
  • toffee wrote:
    12forlife wrote:How much cap would we have available going into next season, if say Avril & Kam are either cut or retire, ET plays this year out & not extended, and we trade Britt for a draft pick?

    From cap's perspective, there must be reasons why we haven't released Kam and Avril?


    Kam has injury guarantees in his contract that would make it very unwise to cut him this season.

    RE Avril, there doesn't really need to be any urgency there. They don't currently need the cap space the team would save ($7,125,000) so there's no real rush there. Expect it to happen, though.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:50 am
  • stang233 wrote:Wait, what. Going into next year if they do not come back and Kam retires we have over 84 million cap space.]


    As it stands right now it's around $80,000,000.

    However that doesn't account for any 2018 rookies, extensions etc.

    They have planned all of this. They have room to do absolutely anything they want next season. Extending Bobby Wagner and Russ will likely be priority number 1 and 2.
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  • original poster wrote:
    stang233 wrote:Wait, what. Going into next year if they do not come back and Kam retires we have over 84 million cap space.]


    As it stands right now it's around $80,000,000.

    However that doesn't account for any 2018 rookies, extensions etc.

    They have planned all of this. They have room to do absolutely anything they want next season. Extending Bobby Wagner and Russ will likely be priority number 1 and 2.




    Ok now that was more along the lines I was thinking, thought we may be upwards of 90 mil, but wanted to ask before sounding a fool. 80 mil will give us some serious leverage going into the next off season. I totally agree Wags & Wilson will be priority 1 & 2, with plenty left over to help fill any glaring wholes that remain. PC/JS really need to hit on these next 2 drafts!
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  • Yeah I can't remember off the top of my head but I think there's either 24 or 25 players under contract next season, too. :2thumbs:
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  • Any other questions chaps?

    I haven't talked about the cap in almost 3 days now, I'm starting to shake a little.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:33 am
  • original poster wrote:Any other questions chaps?

    I haven't talked about the cap in almost 3 days now, I'm starting to shake a little.


    I have another.

    Rapoport reported that we may release Malik in hopes that another team clears him. Why? Specifically, what is the cap savings of cutting Malik, and how would another team clearing/playing him impact our cap hit?
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:51 am
  • JerHawk81 wrote:
    original poster wrote:Any other questions chaps?

    I haven't talked about the cap in almost 3 days now, I'm starting to shake a little.


    I have another.

    Rapoport reported that we may release Malik in hopes that another team clears him. Why? Specifically, what is the cap savings of cutting Malik, and how would another team clearing/playing him impact our cap hit?



    There are certain clauses in the CBA whereby players can forfeit money due to NFI injuries, but they must be written into the contract.

    As it stands, assuming the team are not on the hook for his guaranteed base salaries on future years -

    normal cut -

    2018 cap hit - $2,398,857
    2019 cap hit - $0

    Post June 1 cut -

    2018 cap hit - $799,619
    2019 cap hit - $1,599,238

    However, if the team are on the hook for his guaranteed P5 base, things will get a whole lot more expensive.

    The guarantees in his P5 base salary are -

    2018 - $781,155 (all of it)
    2019 - $471,843 (42.99%)
    2020 - $0 (nothing guaranteed)

    In my opinion, the Malik news isn’t about the salary cap, it’s avout ridding the team of distractions and if that ends up costing the teams cap, so be it.

    I think the team know Cliff isn’t coming back so they’ve got ample cap space to deal with Malik this year and get the distraction off the team.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:22 am
  • If he were still designated NFI wouldn't the team be able to avoid paying any of his 2018 base salary, or a very reduced amount?
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:09 pm
  • jammerhawk wrote:If he were still designated NFI wouldn't the team be able to avoid paying any of his 2018 base salary, or a very reduced amount?


    That's whats throwing me, I cannot find a specific mention in the CBA.

    I suspect, despite all of his 2018 and about 50% of his base salary in 2018 and 2019, that the team won't be on the hook for it.

    They will almost certainly be on the hook for his signing bonus, though. That has very likely already been paid to him unless they staggered it into 4/8/12 payments over the year.

    They are 100% within their rights to try and get it back, though.
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  • ^ even Seattle Times has stated that they don’t know the details on Malik’s contract and specifically as it relates to activities allowed / not allowed.

    So to speculate that they are within their rights to try and get money back or on the hook for anything paid is just that - pure speculation.

    If his contract didn’t allow certain risky activities they would have a case. If it did not then they have no case as signing bonus is just that - payment for getting under contract.
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  • mikeak wrote:^ even Seattle Times has stated that they don’t know the details on Malik’s contract and specifically as it relates to activities allowed / not allowed.

    So to speculate that they are within their rights to try and get money back or on the hook for anything paid is just that - pure speculation.

    If his contract didn’t allow certain risky activities they would have a case. If it did not then they have no case as signing bonus is just that - payment for getting under contract.


    I'm querying his P5 base salary, not the signing bonus.

    The CBA is very clear about recouping signing bonuses, and Seattle will be well within their rights to get that back.
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  • His base salary is not guaranteed, thus if he is released the team has zero responsibility to pay it to him.

    In fact at present his contract tolled for 2017 and he is still under contractual obligation to Seattle for 4 seasons. If he's still PUP there is no duty to pay the base salary as he isn't playing even though his contract tolls and could toll again. The issue of whether the team could recover the prorated portion of his bonus is the big question here. I agree with the opinion the team likely could recover a portion of it they have not acquiesced to pay i.e.: last years portion. I don't think he got paid any base salary last season but could be wrong on that.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • jammerhawk wrote:His base salary is not guaranteed, thus if he is released the team has zero responsibility to pay it to him.

    In fact at present his contract tolled for 2017 and he is still under contractual obligation to Seattle for 4 seasons. If he's still PUP there is no duty to pay the base salary as he isn't playing even though his contract tolls and could toll again. The issue of whether the team could recover the prorated portion of his bonus is the big question here. I agree with the opinion the team likely could recover a portion of it they have not acquiesced to pay i.e.: last years portion. I don't think he got paid any base salary last season but could be wrong on that.


    No I don't think he got any base salary last year, either. Think they gave him something like $5K a week as a gesture of goodwill.

    I'm fairly sure a good portion of his base was guaranteed, though.

    IIRC it was all of 2017, all of 2018, 41% of 2019 and 0% of 2020.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:27 am
  • It's sad to ask this question (and ask it this way), but what do we gain when we cut Jon Ryan? Cap savings in 2018 and 2019? Any/How much dead money?

    And, how much do we pay a rookie punter taken in the 5th? What does that contract look like?
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:25 pm
  • JerHawk81 wrote:It's sad to ask this question (and ask it this way), but what do we gain when we cut Jon Ryan? Cap savings in 2018 and 2019? Any/How much dead money?

    And, how much do we pay a rookie punter taken in the 5th? What does that contract look like?


    Cutting Jon Ryan saves $2M in 2018 with $1.2M dead money.

    His contract will be as follows -

    Total value of $2,751,444 including a signing bonus: $291,444.

    2018 cap hit is $552,861 so the true cap savings, once the regular season starts and assuming he makes the team are $1,447,139.

    During the off-season his cap hit will be a mere $72,861.
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Re: Seahawks Salary Cap & Contracts - Q&A
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:48 pm
  • Well for now it's all gravy we will be fine and any Vets that get beat out by our younger players will add to it, next year will be a much easier management I think. That and only the top 52 I think count against the cap.
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  • With both Kam and McDowell wouldn’t it be the top 53?
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • No Wilson is 1 and the 52 below him :)
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  • Not sure Richard Sherman or Michael Bennett agree they were part of the 52 below him. Perhaps that’s why they aren’t here any more.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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