Our SB winning formula is toast

Seymour

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This started in another thread about Kam and his contract hit we will now be soaking up. In that thread the Wilson contract was brought up and it's effects on the team. In signing Duane Brown they pushed back money from 2017 to 2018 and 19 to the sum of over $6M to sign Brown.

Now we are going to pay up the ying yang to keep Wilson (and others as you will see) because Pete and John swung for the fences and whiffed.

Here is what our core now costs us compared to in 2013 when we won it all.

Wilson was 526K now 2018 $23.8M and 2019 $25.2M (this is up near $9.2M over 2017 cap hit!!)
Sherman was 555K now $13.2M
Earl was $2.0M now $10.4M
Wagner was 585K now $13.6M
Baldwin was 555K now $11.9M.

So here is the point. To field these very same players next season, we go from paying them a total of $4.2M in 2013 to $72.9M in 2018. That is an increase of $68.7M to keep the very same players!

In 2013 we took that and bought the highest paid oline in the NFL, blew some on Percy, and had a top 5 RB in Lynch.
That is how we won, we hit on a couple of drafts, hit top 5 players in their position, and had to pay next to nothing at that time.

Now we are in complete cap hell with Chancellor taking $9.5M, and these contracts that now 2 have pushed back $$ in Baldwin and Wilson to swing for the fences in 2017 and whiffed.

I don't have an answer other then to unload some of those contracts above and get what you can get. What I do know is we need to hit a couple of consecutive drafts to reproduce that success and have at least a few great players playing for cheap or you will not put together a SB winning team IMO. Not here under Pete at least.

Thread is open to all players contracts, what to do from here, and what you think we need to do to get back to the SB and win.
 

kidhawk

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To be fair, the team spending limits have also increased quite substantially (although not at the same rate). It was about $123 million in 2013 and jumped to $167 million last year. That's $45 million and that number continues to rise every year.

Also using Wilson's cap hit in comparison to 2017 is also a misnomer. He lowered his cap hit in 2017 and moved it into future years to help save the team some needed cap space this season.
 

Scorpion05

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I don't agree with this point at all. The problem with our team is really because some of our players aren't playing at a high enough level. A healthy Seahawks team this year makes a Super Bowl run, period. With Carson, with Kam, with Sherman, and others

In my opinion, we need to hit big in the draft on an RB, and on DL depth. Yes, we won a SB with one formula...but that's why most teams never become a dynasty. They try to repeat the same formula and teams catch up to it. In order the Eagles to keep up their success, they will have to adapt. Heck, as much as I hate the Patriots...they've won their 5 Super Bowls in several different ways. With defense, with offense, with all 3 phases. That's coaching. If we had the Eagles talent we'd still fail because of coaching
 

Jerhawk

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The team needs to unload Bennett and Chancellor, then draft smart and hope they can get at least 2-4 good quality players
 
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Seymour

Seymour

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kidhawk":3jm5rquu said:
To be fair, the team spending limits have also increased quite substantially (although not at the same rate). It was about $123 million in 2013 and jumped to $167 million last year. That's $45 million and that number continues to rise every year.

Also using Wilson's cap hit in comparison to 2017 is also a misnomer. He lowered his cap hit in 2017 and moved it into future years to help save the team some needed cap space this season
.

Agree, and the very reason I brought that up is now we are paying the price for "swinging for the fences" with money we did not have. That was short sighted and now we get to pay for that mistake.

The question is, what to do now.

Wilson is my favorite Hawk, and this cap situation makes me now question if we can live with his contract given our run first mentality.
 

Hawkfish

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It would seem to me that Russell Wilson is essentially on a 2 year prove it deal. if the Hawks are not going anywhere, I think paying him 25+ million per year on a new contract would be prohibitive. At that point, we likely are need of a major rebuild and quite likely Pete Caroll would retire necessitating hiring a new coach who may or may not feel Wilson is his guy.
 
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sdog1981

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Seymour":1g9jqau2 said:
Jerhawk":1g9jqau2 said:
The team needs to unload Bennett and Chancellor, then draft smart and hope they can get at least 2-4 good quality players

Getting rid of Chancellor and Bennett this year actually costs more money than it saves. That is why I left them out.
I'll let someone else explain that if you don't believe me....or you can read this. We save $3M to release Bennett.

https://www.seattlepi.com/sports/se...-contract-was-worst-extension-in-12499124.php


Then how would them not getting cleared to play affect your plan? Something like Zac Orr he wanted to play after his neck injury but was never cleared by medical staff.
 

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Seymour have a look at the 2019 cap, it looks far brighter.

They went for it all in 2017 at the expense of 2018 and it didn’t work out.

Nobody on this planet would have been unhappy with it had it worked, and it very easily could have done if it wasn’t for a number of factors outside of their control.
 
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Seymour

Seymour

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original poster":n7e355kp said:
Seymour have a look at the 2019 cap, it looks far brighter.

They went for it all in 2017 at the expense of 2018 and it didn’t work out.

Nobody on this planet would have been unhappy with it had it worked, and it very easily could have done if it wasn’t for a number of factors outside of their control.

I appreciate the upbeat post, but we go from 46 players under contract to 22 players under contract in 2019 and have lost draft picks due to poor moves (actually 19 players if you remove McDowell, Lane, Chancellor) I see that as a whole different problem, not necessarily better for building a winning team. Also, many of those left will be near their careers end.

We will have an average of $2.6M per player to fill those 31 spots to make the 53.
 

Jerhawk

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Seymour":10n4ozja said:
Jerhawk":10n4ozja said:
The team needs to unload Bennett and Chancellor, then draft smart and hope they can get at least 2-4 good quality players

Getting rid of Chancellor and Bennett this year actually costs more money than it saves. That is why I left them out.
I'll let someone else explain that if you don't believe me....or you can read this. We save $3M to release Bennett.

https://www.seattlepi.com/sports/se...-contract-was-worst-extension-in-12499124.php

You're exactly right Seymour. And those extensions never should've happened. I'll go to my grave saying that.
The team will be in cap hell this year, but 2019 should be a breath of fresh air.
 

TwistedHusky

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I pointed out in another thread that we shouldn't even be setting or expecting the SB as a goal.

This team has a QB that COULD potentially be great enough to carry a team to the SB, Aaron Rodgers style. But it would require going all in on offense and having an offensive coordinator that could push this team over by leveraging our greatest assets (Wilson, Baldwin, etc).

However, Pete has a philosophy that does not jibe with that approach so I highly doubt we take it.

But, you don't have to win the SB to enjoy a team. It was only squandering of opportunities that was frustrating. I don't see us as some organization with transcendent talent that is being held back by overly unproductive coaching decisions. I DID see that 1-2 years ago and was frustrated.

While we have a chance at being a contending team by focusing on the QB, remember that GB is the best example of that and they aren't going to SBs either.

We no longer have a great defense. We have a very good defense. But you cannot expect to get to a SB with a very good defense and a very average offense. I don't see that changing overnight especially with our cap situation and our draft picks pretty much gone.
 
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Seymour

Seymour

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So we get one bite of lobster tail with butter and garlic and your telling us to never have that as a goal for dinner again?

LOL @ that. How many teams start the season and concede they are not going to be contenders?

I don't expect it. I just want it, especially with Wilson here. But ya, we can bow down and play the Jeff Fisher Rams and win one against the "tough guys" each year to bolster the spirit if that suites you I suppose.
 

NJlargent

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We are not going to a SB with our OL. You can’t run the ball with that line.
 
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Seymour

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NJlargent":25i9ldb8 said:
We are not going to a SB with our OL. You can’t run the ball with that line.

Exactly what I said the last 2 years with Cable here calling the shots and signing rejects to huge deals. At least we have a prayer with Solari here now. Even without the injuries in 2017, we were held back from greatness with the OL anchor in tow IMO.
 

jammerhawk

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Every season the SB formula for winning changes for every team except the Patriots. They have a formula that the rest of the league wishes they could copy.

That said I don't think the formula for the team winning XVIII and getting to the final play of XLIX was anything more than playing suffocating D and being able to run the ball some. Getting back to that formula will return the winning.

At present the the OLine has held the team back and the defensive core has gotten less hungry and more injury prone.

Getting rid of Cable/Bevell will now force a change of direction that could be a positive. The anchors have been hauled abord. Time will tell. More accountability will certainly be important going forward. Ending unforced errors and playing smart football will also be a big part of it too. The Oline has some talented players here they needed better coaching and different approach.

The coaching for the Hawks was not held accountable after XLIX and the team developed the malaise of thinking they were what their press clipping said they were. To remove/weaken the D core to injury made things clear they were not an elite team then, but could have been. The change of direction with the coaching may be the harbinger of real change that returns the hunger to win.

I think the team is closer to being a winner than a few here want the majority to believe. Things are not as bad as some want to believe.
 
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Seymour

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jammerhawk":s9l5i5rb said:
Every season the SB formula for winning changes for every team except the Patriots. They have a formula that the rest of the league wishes they could copy.

That said I don't think the formula for the team winning XVIII and getting to the final play of XLIX was anything more than playing suffocating D and being able to run the ball some. Getting back to that formula will return the winning.

At present the the OLine has held the team back and the defensive core has gotten less hungry and more injury prone.

Getting rid of Cable/Bevell will now force a change of direction that could be a positive. The anchors have been hauled abord. Time will tell. More accountability will certainly be important going forward. Ending unforced errors and playing smart football will also be a big part of it too. The Oline has some talented players here they needed better coaching and different approach.

The coaching for the Hawks was not held accountable after XLIX and the team developed the malaise of thinking they were what their press clipping said they were. To remove/weaken the D core to injury made things clear they were not an elite team then, but could have been. The change of direction with the coaching may be the harbinger of real change that returns the hunger to win.

I think the team is closer to being a winner than a few here want the majority to believe. Things are not as bad as some want to believe.

As far as how they build their team I would agree. But one thing we all have in common is the same and I'll say it again. The cap is depressing but is not even our biggest problem IMO. Consistancy in drafting and not 1 top 5 player at his position in 5 years is our biggest problem. And i see nothing that was done to improve that area myself.

As far as "wanting" to believe we are in trouble that is not the case with me. I wanted to not believe it, but after looking closer at the cores cap numbers in their final couple of years it kinda jumps out and bites you that what they have done to win came at a steep cost of the future.
 

TwistedHusky

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Hence the reason all this 'get rid of this guy to get under the cap' conversation is pointless.

We don't get solid replacements for stars, we hardly get serviceable players at an above average rate.

Our hit rate on drafted players is horrendous but we haven't really had a 1st round pick since something like 2013 anyway.

We also love to trade away our 2nd rd picks.

We cannot draft well now. We don't do tremendously well in FA acquisitions. I suppose getting under the cap would help if we did those things. But we really just depend on the few successful draft picks (that most are getting older) to keep producing.
 
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