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OL movements and adjustments under Solari??

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  • I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?
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  • There’s so so many possible variations, intrigued to hear people’s different takes, good topic.

    I heard that the whole OL is expendable barring Brown so no doubt we see some kind of shuffle.

    Will Ifedi be moved to guard?

    Will Ifedi even be a starter?

    Will Pocic be the C after a Britt trade/cut?

    Do they try and draft early (again)?

    Be very interesting to see how it pans out. I’m now totally confident in the coaching. No doubt the 5 starters in week 1 will still be the starters in week 6 excluding the obvious potential for injuries.
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  • toffee wrote:I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?


    Has there been any update on Fant? Maybe he kicks over to the other side at RT?
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  • Ace_Rimmer wrote:
    toffee wrote:I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?


    Has there been any update on Fant? Maybe he kicks over to the other side at RT?


    Not that I’m aware of and there’s no doubt he will at least be in the conversation for a job at RT. He doesn’t stand a chance at LT, at least this year.
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  • Ace_Rimmer wrote:
    toffee wrote:I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?


    Has there been any update on Fant? Maybe he kicks over to the other side at RT?


    Fant's first season was a bit unreal, ie someone never played OL at any level starting as LT. In the end, he was the worst LT in the league. SO his achievement was remarkable, the result was bad, very bad. He constantly needed help so we had to sacrifice something to provision help that Fant needed.

    He sat out the second season due to injury, at that moment, he is a total unknown. I don't think we should bet on him to make the team.
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  • toffee wrote:
    Ace_Rimmer wrote:
    toffee wrote:I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?


    Has there been any update on Fant? Maybe he kicks over to the other side at RT?


    Fant's first season was a bit unreal, ie someone never played OL at any level starting as LT. In the end, he was the worst LT in the league. SO his achievement was remarkable, the result was bad, very bad. He constantly needed help so we had to sacrifice something to provision help that Fant needed.

    He sat out the second season due to injury, at that moment, he is a total unknown. I don't think we should bet on him to make the team.


    He was looking good in camp and pre season before he went down, and he also packed on weight, so I am hoping he can make it back to see what they have with this guy.
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  • On this site I read an article saying Schottenheimer likes mauling guards and more athletic types at the tackles.

    To me that means we're a guard short, but:

    LT - Brown
    RG - tbd
    C - Britt
    LG - Ifedi
    RT - All-Rookie Honoree Ethan Pocic

    Would fit that bill.
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  • Ace_Rimmer wrote:He was looking good in camp and pre season before he went down


    Which honestly means very little against Arizona's linebackers.

    People should probably brace for Solari to take one look at Fant and label him a career backup. He's the same as Ifedi: all physicality and tools, no technique.
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  • Ace_Rimmer wrote:
    toffee wrote:
    Ace_Rimmer wrote:
    toffee wrote:I suspect Joeckle won't be back, at least not for $8mil. LT and C position was set, the rest are fluid. Ifedi may face demotion now that Cable is gone, Fant is still fairly unknown. Will we have two new guards?

    Thoughts?


    Has there been any update on Fant? Maybe he kicks over to the other side at RT?


    Fant's first season was a bit unreal, ie someone never played OL at any level starting as LT. In the end, he was the worst LT in the league. SO his achievement was remarkable, the result was bad, very bad. He constantly needed help so we had to sacrifice something to provision help that Fant needed.

    He sat out the second season due to injury, at that moment, he is a total unknown. I don't think we should bet on him to make the team.


    He was looking good in camp and pre season before he went down, and he also packed on weight, so I am hoping he can make it back to see what they have with this guy.


    We shall see about Fant.

    Last summer, I was a bit unsure about his weight gain .... without sacrificing quickness and mobility. I found it hard to wrap my arms around someone gaining 50+ lbs of muscle in a very short period of time (eating mama's food as it was labelled), and somehow those 50+lbs of muscle has no effect on his forms, and quickness.

    Fant was a feel good story, we all wish him success. So far, he did make Cable looked like some genius ... for awhile.
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  • Own The West wrote:On this site I read an article saying Schottenheimer likes mauling guards and more athletic types at the tackles.

    To me that means we're a guard short, but:

    LT - Brown
    RG - tbd
    C - Britt
    LG - Ifedi
    RT - All-Rookie Honoree Ethan Pocic

    Would fit that bill.

    I would go:

    LT-Brown
    LG- Odiambo
    C- Britt
    RG- Ifedi
    RT-Pocic

    Pocic should compete at C if Fant shows up.
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  • gmor wrote:
    Own The West wrote:On this site I read an article saying Schottenheimer likes mauling guards and more athletic types at the tackles.

    To me that means we're a guard short, but:

    LT - Brown
    RG - tbd
    C - Britt
    LG - Ifedi
    RT - All-Rookie Honoree Ethan Pocic

    Would fit that bill.

    I would go:

    LT-Brown
    LG- Odiambo
    C- Britt
    RG- Ifedi
    RT-Pocic

    Pocic should compete at C if Fant shows up.


    IMHO, if we want this line to work we need to bring in a veteran at LG that has a mean streak and is a solid football player.
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  • I think to fully leverage Pocic, he ought to be our #1 backup, as he has the skill set to fill in at so many positions. Besides, he is still not big enough to be an every down linemen, may take a few years to bulk up.
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  • Pocic was a center at LSU. You really think he has the footwork and quicks to be a RT?
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  • There’s no way there’s not a few new pieces in the starting lineup going into 2018. We solidified a weakness in CB this year. Now all assets have to go to OL, Edge Rusher, and Sam LB
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  • How about this curve ball........Maybe the master of the "Fant project" will want to make a trade for him. :snack:
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  • seahawkfreak wrote:
    gmor wrote:
    Own The West wrote:On this site I read an article saying Schottenheimer likes mauling guards and more athletic types at the tackles.

    To me that means we're a guard short, but:

    LT - Brown
    RG - tbd
    C - Britt
    LG - Ifedi
    RT - All-Rookie Honoree Ethan Pocic

    Would fit that bill.

    I would go:

    LT-Brown
    LG- Odiambo
    C- Britt
    RG- Ifedi
    RT-Pocic

    Pocic should compete at C if Fant shows up.


    IMHO, if we want this line to work we need to bring in a veteran at LG that has a mean streak and is a solid football player.


    Agreed. Odi couldn't hold his ground in pass pro, let alone road grade.
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  • Own The West wrote:
    seahawkfreak wrote:
    gmor wrote:
    Own The West wrote:On this site I read an article saying Schottenheimer likes mauling guards and more athletic types at the tackles.

    To me that means we're a guard short, but:

    LT - Brown
    RG - tbd
    C - Britt
    LG - Ifedi
    RT - All-Rookie Honoree Ethan Pocic

    Would fit that bill.

    I would go:

    LT-Brown
    LG- Odiambo
    C- Britt
    RG- Ifedi
    RT-Pocic

    Pocic should compete at C if Fant shows up.


    IMHO, if we want this line to work we need to bring in a veteran at LG that has a mean streak and is a solid football player.


    Agreed. Odi couldn't hold his ground in pass pro, let alone road grade.


    Got to wonder if Odi's problem was due to lack of strength or skill, on some tapes, looked like he lack lower body strength? On other tapes, his hand technique was inadequate.
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  • I don't think you have to do anything with Fant at all. Leave him behind Brown and continue training. Brown is gone in a year anyway.

    Roos showed up fairly well. He needs to compete at both gaurd spots. Unlike Joekel and Pocic, he actually posesses the strength to play the position. It goes without saying that Joekel is gone. He's a vet whos neithet strong enough nor athletic enough while also being a little slow mentally. Pocic needs to hit the weight room REALLY hard, not unlike Fant needed to.

    Ifedi does have the makings of a guard. The false starts are a constant problem because he doesn't have the best kick drop to widen out on the speed rush and he tries to anticipate and jumps the gun.

    LT - Brown, Fant, Beavers, Battle
    LG - Roos, Odi, Beavers,
    C - Britt, Hunt, Pocic
    RG - Ifedi, Roos
    RT - Pocic, Beavers, Battle, Tobin?

    One thing I do know is that Joekel and Aboushi can't play gaurd sufficiently. They just flat out aren't strong enough.

    It's possible you try Fant at RT, I guess, but the kid has played one year of football. Battle was said to been practicing at RT even though he seems more like LT type. Maybe he just doesn't do well on the left side like how Odi plays like he stepped on his shoelaces when he's on the right side. Beavers was sypposed to have LT starter potential out of college. Can he play on the right? In theory, a LT kicking down to LG isn't uncommon and he's got the body for it.

    Is Tobin going to be here? He's yet another tackle in my opinion because again, he's light in the arse for guard, but I don't know his contract status and we did actually trade for him.

    We need prospects at guard, IMO. We'll probably add 3 of them.
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  • I don't know what kind of chemistry Wilson and Britt have, but I'd like to see Pocic get some looks at Center, which he seemed good at at LSU. That would free up Britt to take a Guard position.
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  • Any news on Jordan Roos? Did he play at all last season other that FB cameo? Off topic, for a backup, he is keep up appearance:
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  • Considering who we have, and who we had coaching them, I vote to give all of them a clean slate and allow Solari to sort it out. Might even want to look into bringing back some of the last 3 years cuts/releases.
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  • True, I have no true feelings on any of these guys. They all looked not together and though britt gets alotta hype around here he was clearly part of the problem.
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  • I am sure Solari is watching all the film he can get on our guys already and has been, they have to hit the ground running, I can imagine a lot of phone calls to guys telling them that they need to do something to change their body or review a new technique.

    OTA's will be a whole lot different for a lot of players, nobody has a safe job, all you have to do is look at the Coaching staff to know.
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  • STARTERS
    LT Brown - LG Free Agent Vet - C Britt - RG Pocic/Roos - RT Ifedi

    RESERVES
    Roos/Pocic
    Fant
    Drafted Rookie
    Some other guy
    -----

    1) I expect Pete Carroll to hype up all the returning starters they have coming back.

    2) Guys like Roos are going to have to kill it in the competition to get a starting spot. If it is anywhere close they will choose to stick with the returning starter.

    3) Fant unfortunately is coming off an ACL. They are not going to throw him to the lions and start him day 1. They are going to give him time to recover further, and let him develop more behind Brown. Changing systems isn't going to help him either. Week 8 or so they will look to insert him as a starter potentially if Ifedi continues to struggle. The only way he gets in earlier than that is injury. Depending on how he looks they may just keep him behind Brown the whole year. Have to see what he looks like first.

    4) Overall a real stabilization of the line can happen with 4 returning starters, and an upgrade at LG over Joeckel.

    5) You will see less whiffs, less penalties, and more clean pockets.

    6) Expect more variation to the run game besides inside zone, outside zone, rinse & repeat.
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  • I'd like to see them beef up Pocic. That dude is a little light in the ass.
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  • original poster wrote:There’s so so many possible variations, intrigued to hear people’s different takes, good topic.

    I heard that the whole OL is expendable barring Brown so no doubt we see some kind of shuffle.

    Will Ifedi be moved to guard?

    Will Ifedi even be a starter?

    Will Pocic be the C after a Britt trade/cut?

    Do they try and draft early (again)?

    Be very interesting to see how it pans out. I’m now totally confident in the coaching. No doubt the 5 starters in week 1 will still be the starters in week 6 excluding the obvious potential for injuries.


    As long as we recruit Football players and play the players we recruit in the positions they've proven to be sucessful. Bye Fant, Ifedi better figure out how to cut the penalties, Keep Britt and Pocic. Draft a BTF for left tackle. I'll take some heat for this, but adios brown, we can get decent protection for half your price.
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  • Fade wrote:STARTERS
    3) Fant unfortunately is coming off an ACL. They are not going to throw him to the lions and start him day 1. They are going to give him time to recover further, and let him develop more behind Brown. Changing systems isn't going to help him either. Week 8 or so they will look to insert him as a starter potentially if Ifedi continues to struggle. The only way he gets in earlier than that is injury. Depending on how he looks they may just keep him behind Brown the whole year. Have to see what he looks like first.


    In best case scenario, Fant can spare Brown with some snaps. That could prolong Brown's wear and tear and also allow Fant to gain some valuable experience. That's assuming Fant is up to it.
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  • Hopefully we target some actual good o'linemen.
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  • I'm not oppose to bringing Joeckel back on a lesser deal, he didn't set the world on fire but he wasn't horrible. I have to think they'll move Ifedi back inside and start Fant at RT. Pocic looks like a tackle so maybe they give him a shot out there too.
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  • getnasty wrote:I'm not oppose to bringing Joeckel back on a lesser deal, he didn't set the world on fire but he wasn't horrible. I have to think they'll move Ifedi back inside and start Fant at RT. Pocic looks like a tackle so maybe they give him a shot out there too.


    I'd take him in the $3-4M range. Maybe $5M at a push.
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  • Solari has a hell of a job ahead of him a lot of bad habits to coach out of these guys. It will be interesting to see them draft a guard to play guard for once and a tackle who can only play on one side of the field.
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  • May be Solari will give Joey Hunt and Jordan Roos some looks? Those two are undersized by Cable standard but prototype size for C and G according to Solari. Hopefully, Roos can become our RG.
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  • With all due respect to Fant--I have nothing against the guy personally--but I would expect almost any other O-line coach to ask what the hell a college basketball player is doing in his offensive line room.

    It's clear that Cable's logic was on another planet, so who the hell knows who Solari even wants to keep. Though since he can't turn over the whole roster, I guess he's stuck with these guys.

    That said, I hope to God Solari can make starters out of Pocic and Ifedi, otherwise that's two more high draft busts wasted on the O-line. I'd like to see Pocic take over at center, and Britt and Ifedi at guard. With Brown on the left, that only leaves the right tackle spot open to whoever earns it.
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  • WindCityHawk wrote:I don't know what kind of chemistry Wilson and Britt have, but I'd like to see Pocic get some looks at Center, which he seemed good at at LSU. That would free up Britt to take a Guard position.


    This is my preference as well.
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  • Mojambo wrote:
    WindCityHawk wrote:I don't know what kind of chemistry Wilson and Britt have, but I'd like to see Pocic get some looks at Center, which he seemed good at at LSU. That would free up Britt to take a Guard position.


    This is my preference as well.


    Yeah interesting idea. I like it.

    I’d hazard a guess that Pocic at C & Britt at G is better than Britt at C and Pocic at G.
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  • Boy, the thought of Britt moving back out to guard, where he found so little success, is a little hard to imagine at this point. He always struck me as a guard, and I thought he was horribly miscast at tackle. Maybe in a new system, he will find the success at guard, that many of us thought he would have.

    I suppose it would be appropriate to keep moving him left, guard this year, and our all-pro LT next. :sarcasm_off:

    I still like Ifedi, and I have high hopes for him. I think a move inside would be best.

    I don't see our right tackle on the roster, and I think we end up drafting for this position. I don't think Orlando Brown falls to us, and I'm not sure I want him. Some have McGlinchey going late in the first, and I would be pretty happy with that. He is potential franchise LT material. I wouldn't mind picking him up and starting him at RT this year, with an eye toward moving to the left side when we part ways with Duane Brown.

    Joeckel seems like dead weight to me. We have plenty of capable guards that give us more than 90% of what he does, and they cost 1/10th them amount.

    Fant? Man, that kid better show this offseason. I still don't know what we have in him. He didn't have a particularly stellar start, and who knows what he would have done last year. I haven't seen anything to make me think he deserves a place on the line, and I think the Hawks did him a big dis-service by trying to convert him. Much as I hate to do it, I don't see a place for him next year.

    I'm guessing it looks something like this.
    Brown - Pocic - Britt - Ifedi - Draft Pick.

    I could see Pocic and Britt switching places in that lineup.
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  • Whatever happens, I’m a LOT more confident we will have the best 5 guys in the most suited position under Solari than under Cable.
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  • Total curve ball here:

    I would prefer to have a shorter C and a pair of shorter Gs, that would help Wilson a little bit. C and G do not need length like T, no particular advantage to have 6'6" or 6'7" dudes playing those positions especially in our case.

    Solari seems to favor shorter G for leverage, Solari coached and learned with Bobb McKittrick, who favored quickness over bulk. (From 1979 to 1999, McKittrick coached the San Francisco 49ers offensive line. During his 21 years with the 49ers, the team won five Super Bowls (Super Bowl XVI, Super Bowl XIX, Super Bowl XXIII, Super Bowl XXIV, and Super Bowl XXIX) and 13 NFC West championships.[1] McKittrick is one of only four coaches, the others being George Seifert, Ray Rhodes and Bill McPherson, to be a part of all five of the 49ers' Super Bowl-winning teams.

    McKittrick's success derived from his ability to get the most effect out of unheralded talent. The 49ers' offensive line that won the various Super Bowls consisted of only one player drafted in the first round.
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    So if Hunt is adequate, I will start Hunt at C with Pocic as backup, Similarly Roos at RG. Trade Britt since he has trade value, hope and pray that Ifedi improve enough under new coaching to hold down RT. Brown back to his probowl self at LF. All we need is a LG.

    My "hahaha" shortie lineup:
    LT - Brown; Fant
    LG - draft pick or free agent; Pocic
    C - Hunt, Pocic
    RG - Roos, Pocic
    RT - Ifedi, Fant
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  • I would like to point out the team has recently gone through hell with young O-Lineman.

    Which adds another point in Britt's favor to stay on the team.

    I also think it will lead SEA to being fairly aggressive in Free Agency to add a starting caliber O-Lineman. They don't want to feel the pressure of having to come away with a starter in the upcoming draft.

    Potential targets:

    G Justin Pugh - Solari had him in NY. I expect him to be Seattle's #1 target.
    G Andrew Norwell - Probably more of a pipe dream than anything, he will be the most expensive.
    G Zach Fulton - 4 yr starter at Guard. Still only 26.
    G Josh Kline - More of a consolation prize if they miss out on the top tier Guards.
    G Jahri Evans - If Seattle misses out on the guys they wanted entirely, Jahri Evans could fill in fine as a 1 yr rental.

    These guys are potential targets only if Ifedi is moved to Guard. Which I don't see happening, but I might as well list them in case they choose to go that route.

    RT Ja'Wuan James - Huge upgrade over Ifedi, but will also bring a huge price tag. Young.
    RT Cameron Fleming - Can also start at LT. Young.
    RT Chris Hubbard - 1 yr starter with Pittsburgh, did well. Young.


    I stand by my OP in this thread on what I think Seattle will do.

    Personally though I would target: Pugh, Norwell, Ja'wuan James, & Cameron Fleming. Come away with 2/4. (1 Guard, 1 Tackle) Cut/Trade Britt to save cap space, move Pocic to Center. Extend Duane Brown which would lower his cap number in 2018.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Pocic - RG Ifedi/Roos - RT Fleming

    I think Seattle will go this route though.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Britt - RG Pocic/Roos - RT Ifedi
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  • Seanhawk wrote:I'd like to see them beef up Pocic. That dude is a little light in the ass.


    I find it funny saying that a man who’s over 300 pounds, he’s a little light in the ass.
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  • Fade wrote:LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Pocic - RG Ifedi/Roos - RT Fleming

    I think Seattle will go this route though.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Britt - RG Pocic/Roos - RT Ifedi


    I like the Pugh+Fleming lineup, Britt is adequate but not great enough to be untouchable.
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  • Just a quick thumbup to Coffee and Fade. Good thoughts.

    It’s been so long since we’ve struck line gold in free agency, that I totally forgot to even consider that possibility.

    May have to rethink, although I’m still on the move Ifedi inside and draft a right tackle (future L tackle) train for now.

    There are a couple of decent prospect that I think will fall to us.
    Fire Tom Cable

    Did Chip Kelly assume roster management duties for the Seahawks this year? I must have missed the announcement.
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  • Fade wrote:Personally though I would target: Pugh, Norwell, Ja'wuan James, & Cameron Fleming. Come away with 2/4. (1 Guard, 1 Tackle) Cut/Trade Britt to save cap space, move Pocic to Center. Extend Duane Brown which would lower his cap number in 2018.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Pocic - RG Ifedi/Roos - RT Fleming

    I think Seattle will go this route though.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Britt - RG Pocic/Roos - RT Ifedi


    They were gonna roll with Fant as the starting LT before he got hurt, so won't they feel good about him starting at RT?

    Liking the idea of trading Britt for cap room and going with Pocic.

    Norwell/Pugh and Brown on the left side with Carson and Guice/Ronald Jones/Chubb ect would be a game changer on offense. :179417:

    Image

    Ja'Wuan James isn't a free agent until 2019 though.
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  • massari wrote:
    Fade wrote:Personally though I would target: Pugh, Norwell, Ja'wuan James, & Cameron Fleming. Come away with 2/4. (1 Guard, 1 Tackle) Cut/Trade Britt to save cap space, move Pocic to Center. Extend Duane Brown which would lower his cap number in 2018.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Pocic - RG Ifedi/Roos - RT Fleming

    I think Seattle will go this route though.

    LT Brown - LG Pugh - C Britt - RG Pocic/Roos - RT Ifedi


    They were gonna roll with Fant as the starting LT before he got hurt, so won't they feel good about him starting at RT?

    Liking the idea of trading Britt for cap room and going with Pocic.

    Norwell/Pugh and Brown on the left side with Carson and Guice/Ronald Jones/Chubb ect would be a game changer on offense. :179417:

    Image

    Ja'Wuan James isn't a free agent until 2019 though.


    Pugh is a huge upgrade over Joeckle.
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  • Now we have this...

    GO HAWKS!!!

    Visit my Seahawks blog at 17power.blogspot.com!
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  • Pugh had to play at RT this year because of injuries, which affected his grade. He is much better at LG.

    He still did way better than anything Seattle has rolled out at RT since Sean Locklear.

    Pugh is a good player, but in the context of this O-Line, he is a massive upgrade.

    Here's hoping.
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  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:Now we have this...



    Very interesting. If Walter Jones said it, then you know it's true.
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  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:Now we have this...


    Walter Jones seems to have confidence that our existing OL could produce better result? In another words, Cable was the problem.
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  • Any news on George Fant? That would impact if we need to draft a Brown successor unless Fant's the future of LT.
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