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Is Jimmy Graham Soft?

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Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 3:48 pm
  • Man, I hate to even suggest this given what he's been through, but I felt there were some plays where Jimmy didn't quite give it his all and was bracing for contact rather than fighting for every yard. Keanu Neal is a Kam Chancellor-esque beast, so maybe we're just seeing what other teams have been dealing with when Bam Bam's been out there, but it seemed like he was playing a little scared out there.

    While it didn't count due to an OPI call, the play on the goal line pass to Jimmy sticks out to me. I think he could've reached the ball out to get it over the line but instead he braced himself. IDK, I'm not sure how tough other TEs are in those situations and I can't imagine how much those hits hurt. What do y'all think?
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 3:56 pm
  • Jimmy had two go tos - purpose
    1 jump with eyes backward out verticalling his cover
    2 catch a ball stretched wide in gallop facing forward

    He's not a power back, nor a te, nor a wide receiver. He does what he does well but he doesn't do a lot of things.

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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:03 pm
  • NOLAHawk wrote:Jimmy had two go tos - purpose
    1 jump with eyes backward out verticalling his cover
    2 catch a ball stretched wide in gallop facing forward

    He's not a power back, nor a te, nor a wide receiver. He does what he does well but he doesn't do a lot of things.

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    Wilson still doesn't know how to throw the jump ball to him like Brees did. It requires a lot of precision to place the ball where only Graham can get it. Wilson hasn't mastered that yet.

    Mostly, Wilson tries to hit Graham right in the breadbox or he throws a wild jump ball that pretty much no one could catch.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:12 pm
  • I'd say he's somewhere right in the middle of being tough as nails (Greg Olsen) and soft as tissue paper (Jordan Reed). For someone of his build, he certainly doesn't show his tough side much, though.

    A little off topic, but I really wish Vannett was more involved in the offense.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:54 pm
  • Idk last night he looked tough, because he was taking some brutal hits. Even when the Atlanta defender twisted Graham’s ankle around and he went out, he came back in.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:55 pm
  • hawknation2017 wrote:
    NOLAHawk wrote:Jimmy had two go tos - purpose
    1 jump with eyes backward out verticalling his cover
    2 catch a ball stretched wide in gallop facing forward

    He's not a power back, nor a te, nor a wide receiver. He does what he does well but he doesn't do a lot of things.

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    Wilson still doesn't know how to throw the jump ball to him like Brees did. It requires a lot of precision to place the ball where only Graham can get it. Wilson hasn't mastered that yet.

    Mostly, Wilson tries to hit Graham right in the breadbox or he throws a wild jump ball that pretty much no one could catch.


    Frankly, don't care given how many TDs they have scored together as of late. Interesting though how we went from a topic of Graham and yet someone made it a negative on Wilson.

    My feeling is yes, he dropped a TD and then got stopped a 1 yard short of one by a DB he is way bigger than. So sometimes he is.
    Last edited by Anthony! on Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:55 pm
  • Ask Bennett...I would say for a TE yes...but he is more of WR than TE.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:08 pm
  • For a 6'7" 265lb man with a build like him I would say yes. He just does not generate power. You can see it with his blocking, you can see it with his jumping, you can see it when he takes a hit. However, Jimmy does not need to be beast mode at TE to be successful.

    As for that goal-line catch last night, I would have liked him to plow over that DB for the TD but the ball did cross the plane.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:17 pm
  • One of my biggest gripes is how he jumps to catch balls that would hit him in the numbers and instead he has to reach down to catch it with a defender blazing /flying into him.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:22 pm
  • Anyone else notice he changed gloves quite a few times last night?
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:57 pm
  • Yes he is soft. He is a basketball forward playing tight end. A champion rebounding forward.

    Brees knew how to throw to a rebounder. High where the defenders can not get it. Russell knows this intellectually, but has not practiced that throw enough to put it into muscle memory. He does throw jump balls to our short quick receivers, but until recently has not tried those throws to Jimmy. I attribute this to Pete and Bevell, and not particularly to Russell.

    Until very recently, Jimmy was in Pete's doghouse, because he was not trying hard enough to block, and so they punished him by routing him into the middle for four yard gains, and setting him up to take a beating. Physical punishment for not blocking hard enough. That is my theory, and I made it up.

    But I did hear from a knowledgeable source that Pete sat Jimmy down for a serious conversation about 3-4 weeks ago, and then Jimmy started to turn it around.

    I think Jimmy is very good at catching high balls, because of his rebounding training, and not nearly so good at low balls. It is as if he must jump to catch a pass. I guess his body is just trained to do that.

    I think it is stupid to throw him balls at his numbers where DBs can get their quicker hands into to defend the ball. The opportunity is up high where the DBs can not compete with him.

    This is not rocket science, but basic basketball. Toss the high pass to Kareem, or to Shaq, or to Malone. There is no good way to defend that except with comparable height.

    In summary, yes he is soft, but he is also an almost unique talent, which so far the coaches have squandered in order t teach him a lesson, and to punish him for not complying with their orders for him to block.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:24 pm
  • I swear I saw him get arm tackled by a DB the other week.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:46 pm
  • I think Jimmy can appear soft cause you expect so much out of a guy his size but he's also a huge target for guys to go after out there. If he's not hit in full stride it takes him a while to get up to speed so when he's stationary catching a ball and turning up field he's not gonna turn on a dime and run someone over, most likely he's gonna get clobbered before he can get rolling as they're the ones coming up on him with full momentum. He ends up looking bad bouncing off a smaller guy going down but he's going in the ugly parts of the field making catches taking some big licks and bouncing up, give the guy some credit, he's a baller.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:53 pm
  • Soft as what?

    I mean he would beat the breaks off us. And he held onto the ball getting popped.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:28 am
  • He takes the biggest hits on this team. The routes over the middle are tough because you know you are getting popped as soon as you catch it.

    The hit by Neal was a big one, but it was simple law of physics, he had a full head of steam with like 5 steps against 88 who's momentum was going laterally. He still broke the plane with the ball, which I believe we would have won with a challenge if not for the OPI.

    His blocking gets overblown, he's not a mauler but he's been a lot better in the last 6-8 games. They are finally using him like they should be in the red zone, he's 2nd in the league in TDs.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 5:56 am
  • Not soft, but I’m Jimmy has always been a bit of a finesse player. I think of him as a more physically gifted Julius Thomas.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:18 am
  • Sort of related, but also fighting for every extra yard isn't always the smart play, especially as you age in this league.

    Of course Gronk is a beast, but fighting for every last yard and playing reckless has, in my opinion, impacted his career. He's missed what amounts to 1.5 years of football (24 games) in his career with various injuries. I'd be surprised if he lasted 10 years in the league, especially with his off the field behavior.

    One of the best traits you can have is availability. Tony Gonzalez and Jason Witten are known as very smart players because they know when to go down and how to avoid injuries. They weren't/arent mauling players over but know that longevity is paramount. Tony G missed 3 games in 15 years, Witten 1 game in 15 years. Greg Olsen, I view as similar, with before this year only missed 2 games in the first 10 years. Graham has missed 7 in 8 years, that included a recovery in 10 months of a typically career ending injury.

    I hate the word soft, there's not a single player in the NFL that is. If they were, they wouldn't be in the league, let alone play for 8+ years.




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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:56 am
  • The guy who came back early from a devastating knee injury? Soft is definitely the wrong word.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:44 am
  • He is not a physical player, soft is different.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:45 am
  • chris98251 wrote:He is not a physical player, soft is different.


    this
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:53 am
  • When you are able to make a living by catching balls over the middle, you are not soft.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:59 am
  • I've seen him hold onto enough balls over the middle while taking huge hits to call him soft. He's not built like a blocking TE though. He's super lean in the lower body which doesn't bode well for his ability to anchor unless he already has a size advantage.

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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:18 am
  • flmmkrz wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:He is not a physical player, soft is different.


    this


    Yes. He doesn't use his size advantage very well. He has no power at the point of contact unless he has a full run up to a defender. Even then he can only over power smaller db's. To me someone is physical when they can win heads up with someone the same size or larger then them. Jimmy absolutely can't. He also takes contact with his pad level way too high. I've never seen him play basketball, but watching him on a football field he strikes me as a guy on the court who plays several inches shorter than he actually is. Some players just don't understand leverage all that well and some naturally have it. He doesn't
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Fri Nov 24, 2017 12:32 am
  • I always said he was soft in NO, so, I'm not going to walk it back now. Great to see that his production is up lately.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Fri Nov 24, 2017 4:44 am
  • You should probably ask him and let us know how it turns out.
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Re: Is Jimmy Graham Soft?
Fri Nov 24, 2017 1:37 pm
  • hawkfan1975 wrote:You should probably ask him and let us know how it turns out.


    Chances are he would take a Flyer on the question :)
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