Tom Cable Week 5 Press Conference

Tom Cable Week 5 Press Conference >>> [urltargetblank]http://www.seahawks.com/video/2017/10/05/tom-cable-week-5-press-conference[/urltargetblank]

Audio Only Link >>> [urltargetblank]http://prod.video.seahawks.clubs.nfl.com/SEA/videos/dct/video_audio/2017/10-October/171005-CABLE-32k.mp3[/urltargetblank]

Partial Transcript Link >>> [urltargetblank]http://www.seahawksmedia.com/transcripts/cable-tom-10-05-17/[/urltargetblank]

(On how he’s seen newly acquired offensive linemen Isaiah Battle and Matt Tobin develop so far with the team and what he likes about each of them) “Matt [Tobin], again, like Oday [Aboushi], like Luke [Joeckel], there’s an experience factor there that you can never replace. With Isaiah [Battle], you’re getting a big, long athlete that really does well in one-on-one pass-protection. There’s no substitute for all of the reps and time that they’ve missed, so every day, you’re catching up. You have to be careful not to overload them, obviously, Matt’s [Tobin] a little bit ahead on that, but Isaiah is on the come. It’s just really catching them up to where the group’s at and you can’t replace the spring, and training camp, and all of those things, there’s just no way to do it. You just kind of keep building each day with them and try to stack them up.”

Click to expand...

Above quote highlighted as a friendly reminder that putting it all together is a continuing process.

It needs to stop being a continuing process that starts out at the very beginning every year, though.

I think it telling that they have conceded the need to protect developmental projects by carrying a 10th lineman on the protected roster. I expect that to be the annual allocation for Seattle's offensive line until if and when the college supply side skills somehow improves.

EDIT: Cable currently has 3 offensive tackles on injured reserve and one undersized center on the practice squad.

Cable's FO deliberately pays their OLine the lowest of any team in the NFL.

In case this thread continues to be an attack of Coach Cable it is well to remember that the FO has made decisions not to pay several guys like Okung, Sweezey, Carpenter, Unger, Giacomini, and few more more as the return on investment is seen to be not worth the cost of the investment. This of course will be something a few here will disagree with but it is nevertheless an active philosophy of the FO to pay low for OLinemen until they show they should be retained (like Britt just was). if an OLine does come together before Wilson gets ruined this could be the beginning of a new direction for few team's in the league, i.e.: grow your own OLinemenand exercise patience in allowing for their development as long as they aren't costing a huge part of the cap.

Meanwhile the protection isssues for RW will contine to be the source of continuing disatisfaction to many here, and probably to RW and more than a few on the team. Is this directly Cable's fault? Maybe, but there is no location where cheap and capable OLinemen can be obtained at will. Should the blame be placed elsewhere?

jammerhawk":3mzrpia5 said:

Cable's FO deliberately pays their OLine the lowest of any team in the NFL.

Click to expand...

This is a completely false belief that has been speculated and repeated so much that people just started believing it as truth. First of all they had the highest paid offensive line in football in 2013. So clearly that was not the case back then, 4 years into using their philosophies to build the team...

In the process, the Seahawks went from a team that ranked first in the NFL in spending on the offensive line in 2013 — the year they won the Super Bowl — to now bringing up the rear.

But for those who think this has been a calculated strategy to go cheap on the offensive line, general manager John Schneider said again Thursday that’s not the case.

Click to expand...

“We didn’t go into this thing saying, ‘We’re gonna financially scrimp on the (offensive) line or anything,’’’ Schneider said.

Click to expand...

https://www.seattletimes.com/sports...crimping-on-offensive-line-was-not-by-design/

And if people are trying to say that this "Spending cheap on the offensive line" is a new philosophy, I don't buy that either. Just this offseason they paid (overpaid by many opinions) Joeckel 7m+, and they offered TJ Lang over 8M per year on a long term deal. The year before they reportedly offered Okung over 8M per year on a real contract (not one structured with team options that screws the player). Sure they didn't pay Sweezy but that's only because the Bucs overpaid for him (which they have admitted by having him restructure his deal last April).

So please people, stop spreading false information about the FO having a "philosophy of purposely not spending on the Oline". It's just simply not true. To recap: They have spent (the most in the league) in the past on Oline, they have attempted to sign some of the biggest free agents (that fit their system) in Free Agency, and they have even personally come out and said they do not have a plan to spend cheap at Oline.

#FakeNews

So notwithstanding JS' protest to the contrary, noticeably from last season after the team didn't keep Okung or Sweezy prior the commencement of their first season of paying the least in the league, the same reality exists again this year. Is it intentional? Well they find themselves in a bind as far as cap is concerned and really don't have much choice without some changes elsewhere to players being paid. So it's not "fake news", it's factual reality. The team pays thir OLine the least in the league. The many one year deals the team will need to sort through may help reorganizing the cap crunch they presently face. At that stage the apparent forced but intentional underpaying of their OLine will likely change towards the median pay rates if keeper type players are found or developed.

Sure they paid Joeckel who they got as consolation prize after Lang signed in Detroit, and they have now paid Britt but still pay their OLine the least. Yes Sweezy was overpaid and if you read my post you'd have noticed I think they are prepared to pay players the believe have talent, but they have chosen to develop their own talent. Is the raw material present? Opinions vary, but I think they are trying and there are a few guys here who have potential. Reality is they still are paying the least for their OLine and the results up to now are quite ragged. It is a deliberate policy but one forced upon them by reason of other personnel decisions. So it isn't fake news at all but rather a deliberate choice forced upon them. Reality is they have gone young b/c it's cheaper and so far have not found the talent. I do think the loss of Fant to an unlucky injury was kick in the teeth for their plan. Few teams, if any have significant starter quality depth at OT waiting for a chance to play. Finding replacement players late in the preseason isn't easy or ever very affordable.

Quite frankly my belief is Okung was overpaid for a injury riddled < 75% attendance rate, something that has improved in Denver and now with the LAC. I doubt the team would have even considered paying him the money he's being paid now even if they'd had it to pay. I don't know if Sweezy was even in the budget but he certainly has not paid off for the team that paid him,(Tampa?), but he too has been injured and out. I'd have questioned re-signing Carpenter as he was unavailable too much; and I would have made the trade of Unger as he was costly and had become unreliable as well with injuries. Sadly the trade has not given the hoped benefit from Graham as the O has not yet been able to maximize the use of his talent.

The point of my post was to make it clear the uneven results or even poor results obtained from the OLine or the past few seasons are not all on the OLine coaching staff. The team has scrimped on the OLine intentionally. This situation has happened in a time period where the available draft talent has been constrained by draft position as well limited available talent in the draft. Pointing the finger at just Coach Cable is not something done in an appreciation of the whole picture.

I am encouraged by the incremental improvement of the OLine game to game. Like others I'm not excited by their play but it's encouraging to see their slow improvement.

jammerhawk":20q4qy9x said:

Sure they paid Joeckel who they got as consolation prize after Lang signed in Detroit.

Click to expand...

Joeckel was not a consolation prize, he was signed BEFORE Lang came to visit. Overpaying for Joeckel was part of the reason we didn't up our offer for Lang. Its decisions like this that are the reason our OL is so bad. Decisions like cutting Jahri Evans while keeping Bradley Sowell and Jamarcus Webb in 2016. We could have Lang and Evans, and still be at the bottom of the NFL in spending on OL if we hadn't cut Evans and hadn't signed Joeckel. Cable has a say in who they go after and who keep on the OL, so he has to take some of the blame for the personel.

If youre going to scrimp on spending, you better have the talent evaluation and coaching to pull it off. I believe that both of these things fall on Cable, and he has utterly failed.

jammerhawk":144pnksu said:

...Sure they paid Joeckel who they got as consolation prize after Lang signed in Detroit,

Click to expand...

Incorrect.
Just to keep the record straight on that, they signed Joeckel BEFORE attempting to sign Lang not after. And yes that matters.

Edit..I see someone beat me to it, I hadn't read that yet...

Thanks for the correction, my usually reliable recollection was wrong.

However, it is a reality the team is not paying their OLine in line with the rest of the league and the one year rather significant deal with Joeckel didn't change things only made it less obvious. Yes they would have paid Lang but that still would have only taken them not that significantly above the bottom of the league in paying the OLine.

What is paid frankly is something of a red herring as it is talent that is what is important. Here that seems to related to the experience of the players who can play at a reasonable level to justify them starting. Sadly the team has not had recent success in acquiring keeper level talent or talent that that can stay healthy enough to justify paying.

Placing all the blame on Cable is short sighted.

Thanks Jville for posting the coaches press conferences.

I think the OL problems for the Seahawks have more to do with the stubbornness of sticking to their philosophy. That's on JS/Pete/Cable. Cable himself has said that players coming out college are not prepared for the scheme they use. There's a big learning curve in the process. By the time players become more accustomed to the scheme, example Sweezy, their contracts are up and they aren't resigned. Therefore, the process starts all over again.

Cable could be correct in saying that college lineman aren't ready. However, instead of adapting to a simpler scheme (which the players may be able to learn quicker), they choose to continue with something that takes tremendous amount of time to learn. Other teams have been able to adapt to the OL market better. It's not about how much you spent but how wisely you spend it and what are the plans to invest in developing it (coaching, strategy, etc) . As mentioned by many posters above, Seahawks have not spent their money wisely when it comes to OL.

(On if he is liking the way the right side of the offensive line has come together the last few games) “Yeah, I think, like the group, we’re seeing some growth and development with Germain [Ifedi] in terms of protection where he’s fitting his helmet in the running game. We need to get that better and continue to get his pad-level down, but those two [Germain Ifedi and Oday Aboushi] seem to be on the same page now two weeks in a row. We haven’t had any free-runners or hitters that way, and that’s important in o-line play. If you’re just targeting the right people, and then it comes down to fundamentals with feet, hands, pad-level, and all of those things. I think they’re growing.”

Click to expand...

It takes time to turn 2-point college linemen into Seahawk linemen. We saw that with Britt. We are watching similar progress with Ifedi. As well as with the resurrection of the career of Luke Joeckel. That's the reoccurring message for those listening. They have to be taught fundamentals ...... foot and hand placement ... as well as pad-level and helmet fitting ... as well as handing off pro level rushers. It is the impatient fan that would be best advised to listen and adjust their expectations to the reality of today's NFL game. Coaches and players are hard at work and making progress.

Jville":nibli5mg said:

(On if he is liking the way the right side of the offensive line has come together the last few games) “Yeah, I think, like the group, we’re seeing some growth and development with Germain [Ifedi] in terms of protection where he’s fitting his helmet in the running game. We need to get that better and continue to get his pad-level down, but those two [Germain Ifedi and Oday Aboushi] seem to be on the same page now two weeks in a row. We haven’t had any free-runners or hitters that way, and that’s important in o-line play. If you’re just targeting the right people, and then it comes down to fundamentals with feet, hands, pad-level, and all of those things. I think they’re growing.”

Click to expand...

It takes time to turn 2-point college linemen into Seahawk linemen. We saw that with Britt. We are watching similar progress with Ifedi. As well as with the resurrection of the career of Luke Joeckel. That's the reoccurring message for those listening. They have to be taught fundamentals ...... foot and hand placement ... as well as pad-level and helmet fitting ... as well as handing off pro level rushers. It is the impatient fan that would be best advised to listen and adjust their expectations to the reality of today's NFL game. Coaches and players are hard at work and making progress.

Click to expand...

Again if you read above a simpler scheme if your not investing dollars in the positions would make more sense, the players seem to perform well in a power run scheme or at least much better when we go to it. It's something they have a handle on already. They don't have to think as much and can play more down hill and use their physical advantage. Not to mention as I have said in another post our Lineman are not the proto types physically any more for the ZBS and the rules have changed that made it so much of advantage to use and.

Denver got away with the cheap no name guys and the scheme before it became popular. ( and yes they became known because of success but not initially) Our guys are not quick, nimble and agile, they are more power guys, also the preference is for highly intelligent guys to be able to see who and what they are going to do on the fly and hand off assignments and pick them up. I am sure these guys are not dumb but quick thinking ehhh not so much. Smart lineman and I will use Holmgrens Line in Jones, Hutchinson, Tobeck, Gray and the right tackle any given year did not commit stupid penalties game after game, did not have false starts game after game and multiples per game. That's a focused group that executed.

chris98251":7clx1vqs said:

Jville":7clx1vqs said:

(On if he is liking the way the right side of the offensive line has come together the last few games) “Yeah, I think, like the group, we’re seeing some growth and development with Germain [Ifedi] in terms of protection where he’s fitting his helmet in the running game. We need to get that better and continue to get his pad-level down, but those two [Germain Ifedi and Oday Aboushi] seem to be on the same page now two weeks in a row. We haven’t had any free-runners or hitters that way, and that’s important in o-line play. If you’re just targeting the right people, and then it comes down to fundamentals with feet, hands, pad-level, and all of those things. I think they’re growing.”

Click to expand...

It takes time to turn 2-point college linemen into Seahawk linemen. We saw that with Britt. We are watching similar progress with Ifedi. As well as with the resurrection of the career of Luke Joeckel. That's the reoccurring message for those listening. They have to be taught fundamentals ...... foot and hand placement ... as well as pad-level and helmet fitting ... as well as handing off pro level rushers. It is the impatient fan that would be best advised to listen and adjust their expectations to the reality of today's NFL game. Coaches and players are hard at work and making progress.

Click to expand...

Again if you read above a simpler scheme if your not investing dollars in the positions would make more sense, the players seem to perform well in a power run scheme or at least much better when we go to it. It's something they have a handle on already. They don't have to think as much and can play more down hill and use their physical advantage. Not to mention as I have said in another post our Lineman are not the proto types physically any more for the ZBS and the rules have changed that made it so much of advantage to use and.

Denver got away with the cheap no name guys and the scheme before it became popular. ( and yes they became known because of success but not initially) Our guys are not quick, nimble and agile, they are more power guys, also the preference is for highly intelligent guys to be able to see who and what they are going to do on the fly and hand off assignments and pick them up. I am sure these guys are not dumb but quick thinking ehhh not so much. Smart lineman and I will use Holmgrens Line in Jones, Hutchinson, Tobeck, Gray and the right tackle any given year did not commit stupid penalties game after game, did not have false starts game after game and multiples per game. That's a focused group that executed.

Click to expand...

I've seen your post about schemes. It's a valid subject and I think reasonably well explained as a subject onto itself. However, the subject link of this thread specifically addresses the evolution of the 2017 offensive line. The population of talent available during the heyday of Holmgren or Gibbs was superior to what colleges have produced in recent years. What we have now is a different talent environment. I'm posting and remarking on a different subject. The subject of lengthier development time for today's raw college products. Today's graduates are not as far along with their fundamentals. The subject addresses the effort of improving fundamentals as the season goes on. No scheme is successful without good consistent execution of fundamentals. Tom Cable has and will continue to take advantage of a mix of schemes. We saw that last year and we see it again this year. But the first games of any season is focused on improving fundamentals and combinations. That was the point of my post and purpose of the highlighted quote.

Getting better one day at a time is a process.

Jville":2192fwl3 said:

chris98251":2192fwl3 said:

Jville":2192fwl3 said:

(On if he is liking the way the right side of the offensive line has come together the last few games) “Yeah, I think, like the group, we’re seeing some growth and development with Germain [Ifedi] in terms of protection where he’s fitting his helmet in the running game. We need to get that better and continue to get his pad-level down, but those two [Germain Ifedi and Oday Aboushi] seem to be on the same page now two weeks in a row. We haven’t had any free-runners or hitters that way, and that’s important in o-line play. If you’re just targeting the right people, and then it comes down to fundamentals with feet, hands, pad-level, and all of those things. I think they’re growing.”

Click to expand...

It takes time to turn 2-point college linemen into Seahawk linemen. We saw that with Britt. We are watching similar progress with Ifedi. As well as with the resurrection of the career of Luke Joeckel. That's the reoccurring message for those listening. They have to be taught fundamentals ...... foot and hand placement ... as well as pad-level and helmet fitting ... as well as handing off pro level rushers. It is the impatient fan that would be best advised to listen and adjust their expectations to the reality of today's NFL game. Coaches and players are hard at work and making progress.

Click to expand...

Again if you read above a simpler scheme if your not investing dollars in the positions would make more sense, the players seem to perform well in a power run scheme or at least much better when we go to it. It's something they have a handle on already. They don't have to think as much and can play more down hill and use their physical advantage. Not to mention as I have said in another post our Lineman are not the proto types physically any more for the ZBS and the rules have changed that made it so much of advantage to use and.

Denver got away with the cheap no name guys and the scheme before it became popular. ( and yes they became known because of success but not initially) Our guys are not quick, nimble and agile, they are more power guys, also the preference is for highly intelligent guys to be able to see who and what they are going to do on the fly and hand off assignments and pick them up. I am sure these guys are not dumb but quick thinking ehhh not so much. Smart lineman and I will use Holmgrens Line in Jones, Hutchinson, Tobeck, Gray and the right tackle any given year did not commit stupid penalties game after game, did not have false starts game after game and multiples per game. That's a focused group that executed.

Click to expand...

I've seen your post about schemes. It's a valid subject and I think reasonably well explained as a subject onto itself. However, the subject link of this thread specifically addresses the evolution of the 2017 offensive line. The population of talent available during the heyday of Holmgren or Gibbs was superior to what colleges have produced in recent years. What we have now is a different talent environment. I'm posting and remarking on a different subject. The subject of lengthier development time for today's raw college products. Today's graduates are not as far along with their fundamentals. The subject addresses the effort of improving fundamentals as the season goes on. No scheme is successful without good consistent execution of fundamentals. Tom Cable has and will continue to take advantage of a mix of schemes. We saw that last year and we see it again this year. But the first games of any season is focused on improving fundamentals and combinations. That was the point of my post and purpose of the highlighted quote.

Getting better one day at a time is a process.

Click to expand...

We would not need a 2015, 2016, 2017 evolution thread if we could build a cohesive line and then keep them, this is the black eye of our current regime and will be the career ender for Wilson.

chris98251":36akhlrq said:

Jville":36akhlrq said:

chris98251":36akhlrq said:

Jville":36akhlrq said:

It takes time to turn 2-point college linemen into Seahawk linemen. We saw that with Britt. We are watching similar progress with Ifedi. As well as with the resurrection of the career of Luke Joeckel. That's the reoccurring message for those listening. They have to be taught fundamentals ...... foot and hand placement ... as well as pad-level and helmet fitting ... as well as handing off pro level rushers. It is the impatient fan that would be best advised to listen and adjust their expectations to the reality of today's NFL game. Coaches and players are hard at work and making progress.

Click to expand...

Again if you read above a simpler scheme if your not investing dollars in the positions would make more sense, the players seem to perform well in a power run scheme or at least much better when we go to it. It's something they have a handle on already. They don't have to think as much and can play more down hill and use their physical advantage. Not to mention as I have said in another post our Lineman are not the proto types physically any more for the ZBS and the rules have changed that made it so much of advantage to use and.

Denver got away with the cheap no name guys and the scheme before it became popular. ( and yes they became known because of success but not initially) Our guys are not quick, nimble and agile, they are more power guys, also the preference is for highly intelligent guys to be able to see who and what they are going to do on the fly and hand off assignments and pick them up. I am sure these guys are not dumb but quick thinking ehhh not so much. Smart lineman and I will use Holmgrens Line in Jones, Hutchinson, Tobeck, Gray and the right tackle any given year did not commit stupid penalties game after game, did not have false starts game after game and multiples per game. That's a focused group that executed.

Click to expand...

I've seen your post about schemes. It's a valid subject and I think reasonably well explained as a subject onto itself. However, the subject link of this thread specifically addresses the evolution of the 2017 offensive line. The population of talent available during the heyday of Holmgren or Gibbs was superior to what colleges have produced in recent years. What we have now is a different talent environment. I'm posting and remarking on a different subject. The subject of lengthier development time for today's raw college products. Today's graduates are not as far along with their fundamentals. The subject addresses the effort of improving fundamentals as the season goes on. No scheme is successful without good consistent execution of fundamentals. Tom Cable has and will continue to take advantage of a mix of schemes. We saw that last year and we see it again this year. But the first games of any season is focused on improving fundamentals and combinations. That was the point of my post and purpose of the highlighted quote.

Getting better one day at a time is a process.

Click to expand...

We would not need a 2015, 2016, 2017 evolution thread if we could build a cohesive line and then keep them, this is the black eye of our current regime and will be the career ender for Wilson.

Click to expand...

You have my sympathies. We all have choices. I chose not to live under self imposed fears. Enjoy the game.

Gear up for more of the same in 2018. Joeckel won't likely be back, if Fant returns it will be after a year of rehab, and isn't likely aboushi is the answer at RG. New/returning players at 3/5 of the line is a guaranteed slow start at best.