The OL Plan

Hyak · Mar 1, 2017

Schneider certainly hinted that the Seahawks would like to add a veteran OL to the mix, presumably at one of the tackle spots. At the same time, he certainly went out of his way to praise Cable as an OL coach and to point out the importance of a cohesive unit that can stay together long term.

I totally get the continual hand wringing about the OL play but I can make an argument that their final OL lineup did show some potential to play well and it's not a stretch to project improvement in years 2/3 for the young players and even Britt given center was a new position for him.

The Seahawks offense produced 21.8 points/game, which ranked 14th in the NFL in 2016.

In the first 6 games where Sowell was the LT and Webb was the primary RG, the Seahawks averaged 18.5 offensive points/game. In fairness, Wilson was playing at probably 60% health and Michaels was the primary RB.

Fant started in game 7. Britt missed game 11 versus TB entirely in the infamous 5 point game (2 came on a defensive safety). Gilliam got benched in game 11 after 3 plays and didn't get his job back until early in game 14 versus the Rams.

Trends

In games where the final OL lineup played all or most of the game (Fant, Glowinski, Britt, Ifedi, Gilliam), the offense scored 25.8 points/game, which would have been 6th best overall.

In games where Britt was the center and Fant was the LT, they averaged 25.2 points/game.

Granted, they have plenty of room to improve but it may not be quite as bad as some think. I do think they could add a veteran but it may be someone they view as a long term starter (i.e. first time unrestricted FA) as opposed to a vet with only a couple of years to go career wise.

Uncle Si · Mar 1, 2017

Very encouraging post. Couple that with the strong class of DBs in the draft and the team might be trending upwards after all. Next two months will be fun.

West TX Hawk · Mar 1, 2017

JTB":1r7yi0ou said:
Schneider certainly hinted that the Seahawks would like to add a veteran OL to the mix, presumably at one of the tackle spots. At the same time, he certainly went out of his way to praise Cable as an OL coach and to point out the importance of a cohesive unit that can stay together long term.

I totally get the continual hand wringing about the OL play but I can make an argument that their final OL lineup did show some potential to play well and it's not a stretch to project improvement in years 2/3 for the young players and even Britt given center was a new position for him.

The Seahawks offense produced 21.8 points/game, which ranked 14th in the NFL in 2016.

In the first 6 games where Sowell was the LT and Webb was the primary RG, the Seahawks averaged 18.5 offensive points/game. In fairness, Wilson was playing at probably 60% health and Michaels was the primary RB.

Fant started in game 7. Britt missed game 11 versus TB entirely in the infamous 5 point game (2 came on a defensive safety). Gilliam got benched in game 11 after 3 plays and didn't get his job back until early in game 14 versus the Rams.

Trends

In games where the final OL lineup played all or most of the game (Fant, Glowinski, Britt, Ifedi, Gilliam), the offense scored 25.8 points/game, which would have been 6th best overall.

In games where Britt was the center and Fant was the LT, they averaged 25.2 points/game.

Granted, they have plenty of room to improve but it may not be quite as bad as some think. I do think they could add a veteran but it may be someone they view as a long term starter (i.e. first time unrestricted FA) as opposed to a vet with only a couple of years to go career wise.

Good analysis and a well thought out post. Agreed that FA help is needed to at a minimum, add depth and foster competition for Fant and Gilliam. Ideally though we need significant upgrade at both tackle spots but of course, that's much easier said than done.

If we're truly in win-now mode to maximize our window, a FA like Whitworth could be a missing piece. In that sense, a high-priced vet that you know what you're getting for a couple years is worth the gamble and cap space even at 35.

Jimjones0384 · Mar 2, 2017

West TX Hawk":2ozo042o said:
JTB":2ozo042o said:

Schneider certainly hinted that the Seahawks would like to add a veteran OL to the mix, presumably at one of the tackle spots. At the same time, he certainly went out of his way to praise Cable as an OL coach and to point out the importance of a cohesive unit that can stay together long term.

I totally get the continual hand wringing about the OL play but I can make an argument that their final OL lineup did show some potential to play well and it's not a stretch to project improvement in years 2/3 for the young players and even Britt given center was a new position for him.

The Seahawks offense produced 21.8 points/game, which ranked 14th in the NFL in 2016.

In the first 6 games where Sowell was the LT and Webb was the primary RG, the Seahawks averaged 18.5 offensive points/game. In fairness, Wilson was playing at probably 60% health and Michaels was the primary RB.

Fant started in game 7. Britt missed game 11 versus TB entirely in the infamous 5 point game (2 came on a defensive safety). Gilliam got benched in game 11 after 3 plays and didn't get his job back until early in game 14 versus the Rams.

Trends

In games where the final OL lineup played all or most of the game (Fant, Glowinski, Britt, Ifedi, Gilliam), the offense scored 25.8 points/game, which would have been 6th best overall.

In games where Britt was the center and Fant was the LT, they averaged 25.2 points/game.

Granted, they have plenty of room to improve but it may not be quite as bad as some think. I do think they could add a veteran but it may be someone they view as a long term starter (i.e. first time unrestricted FA) as opposed to a vet with only a couple of years to go career wise.

Click to expand...

Good analysis and a well thought out post. Agreed that FA help is needed to at a minimum, add depth and foster competition for Fant and Gilliam. Ideally though we need significant upgrade at both tackle spots but of course, that's much easier said than done.

If we're truly in win-now mode to maximize our window, a FA like Whitworth could be a missing piece. In that sense, a high-priced vet that you know what you're getting for a couple years is worth the gamble and cap space even at 35.

Yep, I think it is a must to address the line in fa or even better, a trade. Even if they are able to get one of the good tackles, or even guards in the draft, I think they need to try to get an upper tier free agent lineman. The line is too young and inexperienced as is, they can't replace one of em with a rook, unless they add experience. I like whitworth, or a Joe Thomas trade. I would be down with them signing a great guard, and try sliding ifedi out too.

It seems to me that pcjs are going to do something big. They both admitted that they were too young and inexperienced last year. Signing a lower tier player and drafting another lineman or 3 will not fix the problem. I think they see potential in the young guys and want to keep them around for the future. But they need a couple of seasons band aid. So in my mind, that's what they mean by continuity. They want to keep these young guys together, but want them to learn underneath a veteran or two. I think Gilliam is the only one that may need to be replaced permanently. Maybe move Gilliam back to te, or try him at fullback. If not, if priced right he would be a good backup.

Largent80 · Mar 2, 2017

Move Gilliam to WR and have Ryan at QB.

Pretty simple.

AgentDib · Mar 2, 2017

Remember that they signed Jahri Evans after the compensatory pick deadline last year. It's entirely possible that they go that route again if they don't think the value is there for guys like Whitworth, Reiff or Okung in early free agency.

Seymour · Mar 2, 2017

The plan seems clear to me.....

Hyak · Mar 2, 2017

Seymour":crqlxcoo said:
The plan seems clear to me.....

Ha. Listening to Pete talk today and with Schneider's comments yesterday, I think it's pretty clear that they are banking on the 1st year guys making a big leap in year 2. If I had to guess, Gilliam is the guy most likely to get replaced by a free agent signee or draft pick. Fant seemed to receive a lot more praise from both than Gilliam did.

I think a veteran addition will be more along the lines of Kahlil, or Joeckel as opposed to a first week guy who's going to get crazy money.

Sgt. Largent · Mar 2, 2017

I'd be more encouraged by Schneider's statements if the entire PC/JS/Cable era hasn't been an utter and complete failure when it comes to evaluating O-lineman and acquiring FA lineman.

So unless they drastically change how they're evaluating O-lineman, doesn't give me much hope that they'll all of a sudden do the right thing this year.

Or change their "let's spend all our money on the rest of the team and hope Cable can turn basketball players and defensive lineman into starting O-lineman" philosophy.

I'll take either option.

Seymour · Mar 2, 2017

Sgt. Largent":3aiei4rv said:
I'd be more encouraged by Schneider's statements if the entire PC/JS/Cable era hasn't been an utter and complete failure when it comes to evaluating O-lineman and acquiring FA lineman.

So unless they drastically change how they're evaluating O-lineman, doesn't give me much hope that they'll all of a sudden do the right thing this year.

Or change their "let's spend all our money on the rest of the team and hope Cable can turn basketball players and defensive lineman into starting O-lineman" philosophy.

I'll take either option.

Ultimately this is it. They could say it is top priority, and all available resources will be thrown at this problem area and I would still be luke warm (at best) on them getting to even an average pass blocking line. Mainly because that is a level Cable has NEVER made in all his attempts.

kf3339 · Mar 2, 2017

Sgt. Largent":1kc3p164 said:
I'd be more encouraged by Schneider's statements if the entire PC/JS/Cable era hasn't been an utter and complete failure when it comes to evaluating O-lineman and acquiring FA lineman.

So unless they drastically change how they're evaluating O-lineman, doesn't give me much hope that they'll all of a sudden do the right thing this year.

Or change their "let's spend all our money on the rest of the team and hope Cable can turn basketball players and defensive lineman into starting O-lineman" philosophy.

I'll take either option.

^this.

I'm also getting really tired of the O-Line games our front office has played the last few years.

chris98251 · Mar 2, 2017

I think they may sign CHANTEL OSAHOR she has all the tools Cable is looking for.

West TX Hawk · Mar 2, 2017

chris98251":14rvawqr said:
I think they may sign CHANTEL OSAHOR she has all the tools Cable is looking for.

She'd definitely be a good one. What about the Williams sisters too? Talk about SPARQ freaks-athleticism, quick feet, agility and most importantly, have never played football before. Put Venus at LT, Serena at RT and you're done. Cable would be salivating.

hawkfan68 · Mar 2, 2017

Great thread and post, JTB. The problem is they've been addressing the OL each year since Cable has been here. Each year it's been the weakest area of the team. That's pretty consistent. While they are saying they are focusing on it again this offseason, let's hope their focus and plan (if they have one) works out better than the previous years have.

ivotuk · Mar 2, 2017

I liked what Brock had to say about OLine improvement. Now we don't have the draft ammunition that the Titans had, but it's a good point.

Brock and Salk Blue 42

Which Huskies have the most to gain and lose at the combine?

Originally aired: Tuesday, February 28, 2017

How much better can the Seahawks' offensive line become next year? Which of the Huskies' NFL prospects have the most to gain and lose at the scouting combine? What will the Seahawks do with cornerback Richard Sherman?

http://sports.mynorthwest.com/category/ ... 0Blue%2042

WindCityHawk · Mar 2, 2017

What's he supposed to say? "Yeah we're really in the weeds here. Our coach is stuck to us like crap on a shoe and our payers are B- at best. We're desperate for help, somebody give us a good deal!"

Everyone's playing close to the chest and sticking to the script. September is a long way away.

That said, yeah, I have no faith anything will change, lol.
Bevell/Cable 2017!

hawkfan68 · Mar 3, 2017

IMO, unless there is a change made to the OL coaching, the results will be the same. The OL faces may be different but the results the same. The OL issues are a problem because of the coaching. Cable has been horrible with pass blocking throughout his career. Last season, they had to rely on the passing game. We saw the results. I'm not sure unless a "miracle" occurs there will be this improvement with OL. There are more questions than answers and the OL has been average to below avg during Cable's tenure. PC is a defense guy, they are not going to pour more money into the OL. They will shore up the defense. Especially since they feel this is a very good draft for defense. Thus it comes down to coaching....in that particular area, I'm not impressed with Cable or his results as the Seahawks OL coach. He needs to go for a change to occur.

Sgt. Largent · Mar 3, 2017

hawkfan68":54h6fpcj said:
Great thread and post, JTB. The problem is they've been addressing the OL each year since Cable has been here. Each year it's been the weakest area of the team. That's pretty consistent. While they are saying they are focusing on it again this offseason, let's hope their focus and plan (if they have one) works out better than the previous years have.

I know next to Bevell Cable is the easiest whipping boy on this forum, but IMO it's more of who Pete and John are drafting and acquiring expecting Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken crap................far more than an indictment on Cable's ability to coach.

Cable was brought here because he's an expert on the nasty physical run heavy zone blocking scheme, so those are the type of players we've tried to draft.

The problem is Pete, John and Cable have gotten too cute and gone after personality first, and talent second thinking Cable can work miracles technique wise. So now we've got a bunch of red asses that have horrible technique, which takes years to develop that.

Problem is we don't have 3-4 years when these guys get thrown into the fire as starters cause the cupboards are bare.

hawkfan68 · Mar 3, 2017

Sgt. Largent":ftc5ztr6 said:
hawkfan68":ftc5ztr6 said:

Great thread and post, JTB. The problem is they've been addressing the OL each year since Cable has been here. Each year it's been the weakest area of the team. That's pretty consistent. While they are saying they are focusing on it again this offseason, let's hope their focus and plan (if they have one) works out better than the previous years have.

Click to expand...

I know next to Bevell Cable is the easiest whipping boy on this forum, but IMO it's more of who Pete and John are drafting and acquiring expecting Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken crap................far more than an indictment on Cable's ability to coach.

Cable was brought here because he's an expert on the nasty physical run heavy zone blocking scheme, so those are the type of players we've tried to draft.

The problem is Pete, John and Cable have gotten too cute and gone after personality first, and talent second thinking Cable can work miracles technique wise. So now we've got a bunch of red asses that have horrible technique, which takes years to develop that.

Problem is we don't have 3-4 years when these guys get thrown into the fire as starters cause the cupboards are bare.

I don't buy your argument that PC/JS are drafting players without Cable's input. I believe that Cable has more input into the players being drafted and brought in via FA. He is part of the decision making team. The guys you see are his guys as much as they are PC/JS guys. If you were Tom Cable, why would you stick with an organization that gives you a pile of crap and puts you in a position to fail year after year? It doesn't make any sense. That's why I believe that Cable has tremendous amount of influence in the decisions they make regarding the OL.

Sgt. Largent · Mar 3, 2017

hawkfan68":16q0uacg said:
Sgt. Largent":16q0uacg said:

hawkfan68":16q0uacg said:

Great thread and post, JTB. The problem is they've been addressing the OL each year since Cable has been here. Each year it's been the weakest area of the team. That's pretty consistent. While they are saying they are focusing on it again this offseason, let's hope their focus and plan (if they have one) works out better than the previous years have.

Click to expand...

I know next to Bevell Cable is the easiest whipping boy on this forum, but IMO it's more of who Pete and John are drafting and acquiring expecting Cable to make chicken salad out of chicken crap................far more than an indictment on Cable's ability to coach.

Cable was brought here because he's an expert on the nasty physical run heavy zone blocking scheme, so those are the type of players we've tried to draft.

The problem is Pete, John and Cable have gotten too cute and gone after personality first, and talent second thinking Cable can work miracles technique wise. So now we've got a bunch of red asses that have horrible technique, which takes years to develop that.

Problem is we don't have 3-4 years when these guys get thrown into the fire as starters cause the cupboards are bare.

Click to expand...

I don't buy your argument that PC/JS are drafting players without Cable's input. I believe that Cable has more input into the players being drafted and brought in via FA. He is part of the decision making team. The guys you see are his guys as much as they are PC/JS guys. If you were Tom Cable, why would you stick with an organization that gives you a pile of crap and puts you in a position to fail year after year? It doesn't make any sense. That's why I believe that Cable has tremendous amount of influence in the decisions they make regarding the OL.

No, you're right...........Cable definitely has input into the lineman we've drafted.

I didn't mean to sound like he's not culpable in the state of our O-line. But the final call is Pete and John as to who we draft and acquire.

The OL Plan

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