Cable threw a change up.

With our Offensive Line being large and very athletic, some of the more studied posters here have been clamoring for a change in run blocking scheme. The Zone blocking system is great for smaller, quicker OLmen. It gives them an advantage on larger DL's and also gets the DL running side to side a lot, thus wearing them down later in the game. Also, combo blocks help control the line of scrimmage while a guy peels off and grabs a LBer.

Problem this year seems to be that the ZBS we're running is too complicated for our younger guys. We're not getting beat physically, but mentally. It's blown assignments not physical mismatches that have caused our woes.

Well, Cable must have heard us. I saw a lot more iso and power run blocking this last game. On Rawls TD in particular, you saw Ifedi just walling his guy off and Britt making a really nifty seal on the NT, sealing him inside. Glowinski had at least 3 blocks where he just manned up and put his guy on skates, sometimes for 4 or 5 yards.

I'd like to see this going forward. Atlanta has a smallish DL that isn't stout at the point of attack. We can (and should) physically beat them, not let them use speed to penetrate gaps caused by missed assignments and create issues.

So the question would be: what took so long to make the adjustment? Was the coaching staff just waiting for the playoffs ? if so, that's seriously wicked on Pete's part. Think about this from Atlanta's DC's viewpoint: you now have a game on tape that has a bunch of ZBS stuff on it, and we just iso'd up on Detroit and gave you a bunch of things you haven't seen out of us.

Noticeable change in blocking this weekend. I thought they did the exact same thing in the Cards game a couple weeks ago after halftime. Looked completely different...and more importantly effective!

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

So Cable didn't throw a change up, our lineman just had a really good game.........and Rawls as well of course.

Now was this a product of the linemen? Or was this a product of Detroit not having a very good defense. IMO it's a mixture of both, but give the line credit, they had their best game of the year.

Also as many of us pointed out, NONE of the remaining teams in the playoffs from the NFC have dominant front 7's, so this is something our line should be able to sustain in Atlanta and hopefully the next week as well.

I've been critical of Cable but I have to give him credit because it was brilliant to switch it up a little. It really helps a guy like Ifedi and allows him to play to his strength, which ironically is strength.

Sgt. Largent":2vzqhjfh said:

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

So Cable didn't throw a change up, our lineman just had a really good game.........and Rawls as well of course.

Now was this a product of the linemen? Or was this a product of Detroit not having a very good defense. IMO it's a mixture of both, but give the line credit, they had their best game of the year.

Also as many of us pointed out, NONE of the remaining teams in the playoffs from the NFC have dominant front 7's, so this is something our line should be able to sustain in Atlanta and hopefully the next week as well.

Click to expand...

So he's being sneaky Pete and I love it. Answers that question.

He can deny it all he wants, the stuff I saw was iso and power. Evidently, FG's just put out an article saying the same thing...with a former NFL Tackle verifying it as well.

Like coorslighthawk said a couple posts up, there have been a few elements and plays before, but I noticed a larger shift this game. It's brilliant either way. If the OL is able to go with both, you could have ZBS stretch runs on one play, then line up and have Ifedi, Glowinski and Britt fire off the ball into their guys the next. It's really hard to scout that and play against it, because there won't be any formation "tells" to let you know how your OL mirror is going to block you.

Sgt. Largent":cdf555sm said:

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

So Cable didn't throw a change up, our lineman just had a really good game.........and Rawls as well of course.

Now was this a product of the linemen? Or was this a product of Detroit not having a very good defense. IMO it's a mixture of both, but give the line credit, they had their best game of the year.

Also as many of us pointed out, NONE of the remaining teams in the playoffs from the NFC have dominant front 7's, so this is something our line should be able to sustain in Atlanta and hopefully the next week as well.

Click to expand...

Let's see if they can put the same type of effort together vs a fairly similar poor defense, the big diff is we're on the road.

I can't help but think about an adage from the NBA. Your roll players can and usually do play much better at home, but when out on the road you need your super stars to take over.

Hawks46":3gr3l0jh said:

Sgt. Largent":3gr3l0jh said:

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

So Cable didn't throw a change up, our lineman just had a really good game.........and Rawls as well of course.

Now was this a product of the linemen? Or was this a product of Detroit not having a very good defense. IMO it's a mixture of both, but give the line credit, they had their best game of the year.

Also as many of us pointed out, NONE of the remaining teams in the playoffs from the NFC have dominant front 7's, so this is something our line should be able to sustain in Atlanta and hopefully the next week as well.

Click to expand...

So he's being sneaky Pete and I love it. Answers that question.

He can deny it all he wants, the stuff I saw was iso and power. Evidently, FG's just put out an article saying the same thing...with a former NFL Tackle verifying it as well.

Like coorslighthawk said a couple posts up, there have been a few elements and plays before, but I noticed a larger shift this game. It's brilliant either way. If the OL is able to go with both, you could have ZBS stretch runs on one play, then line up and have Ifedi, Glowinski and Britt fire off the ball into their guys the next. It's really hard to scout that and play against it, because there won't be any formation "tells" to let you know how your OL mirror is going to block you.

Click to expand...

Maybe, I'm not some sort of film nerd that breaks down every run play looking for drastic changes to blocking schemes and playcalling.


Now what I did see was finally a CONCERTED effort to run the damn ball, and IMO they could have run it even more. After Rawls was ripping off 5-10 yards a carry in the 1st half I was screaming at the TV to stop trying to throw it and just ram it down the Lion's throat cause they couldn't stop it.

I think Pete is being smart and not admitting to much. I'm not a line expert either but a guy on twitter(I know) broke it down and was convinced they did do things a little differently and limited lateral movement and some of the ZBS stuff that we normally do.

Certainly we've been sprinkling in more man/power plays.

We do still do the ZBS thing. But there are a few wrinkles I'm seeing.

1. Reece is a vastly improved FB lead option.

While I loved Truck-a-foo, the reality was that despite that size, he really didn't block well on the move, and he didn't really do a good job of identifying his blocks and hitting them. Reece is just nailing the right guys, and doing it a lot quicker and harder. He's executing his blocks in the hole on the plus side of the LOS. If you can rewatch the game, just look at the number of plays Reece is on. And watch him specifically. He is a massive upgrade execution wise. You can easily see that the FB is now part of the main plan with Reece in the game -- where it was almost completely abandoned the last year.

2. The Zone stretch run is not getting called as much.

It was our staple run for years. Although recall that it took some time for Lynch to finally master reading that. I don't think Rawls really is adept at reading that play quite yet. He's a pretty frantic runner and doesn't yet appear to have the patience required to execute it properly.

3. OL just getting organically better

It's been exceptionally difficult to plot the progress on this OL. I think most fans would be comfortable with the assessment that they've been inconsistent. Sometimes good, other times a dumpster fire. It has seemed however that our instances of dumpster fire just happen to coincide with facing really good defensive lines. It's a shame we face the Rams and Cardinals twice a year in high leverage/important contests.

As inconsistent as this OL is, I actually like how they match up against average or worse DLs. I'm still really hopeful that this OL as is shows what should be the expected level of improvement with a second training camp.

I think overall the impression is that the OL takes one step forward and one step back on a week to week basis. But I do think that not enough credit is bestowed on the talent of the opposition. And that when you look at the struggles -- I think the case can be made that it's opponent talent driven. I do still expect that delta in quality to narrow next year.

I don't know that it's taken this long. Since we've been remarking on the increased use of power blocking plays over the course of the season. Even before Fant was installed at LT.

I do have to wonder though, if we even return to the zone stretch bread and butter that we used with Lynch. This OL seems to be well suited for the 'power' runs that were Marshawn's stated favorite plays. Seems this OL is naturally inclined to do well with just blowing guys out of the hole in the A and B gaps. Adding Reece seems to have kind of put the cherry on top of that run play, getting better ability to get past the linebackers.

Good post!

Its crystal clear they changed up something's because it worked I said that they should go to a more power scheme to suit our lineman
We got a powerhouse linemen.

austinslater25":2guaxt8b said:

Good post!

Click to expand...

^ + 1 ^ :2thumbs:

Sgt. Largent":23rb412f said:

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

Click to expand...

And he said last year that there were no real changes to the passing game, just players executing better. Wasn't true.. There were a bunch of spread concepts and timing changes that weren't there before, and the offense looked completely different as a result.

Pete's an expert BSer. He believes in empowering and tooting his players, so he wouldn't want to talk too much about scheme being the pivot of the offense. But there were changes last year, and there were changes last week. Anyone with an eye for football can see that.

And as OP said, yep, it was fun watching Glowinski in particular. He looked positively Walter Jones-like on a couple of Rawls' longer runs.

Also agree on Reece. He played a big role out of the I-formation - when he hits a linebacker, that linebacker is done for the play. I haven't seen that on this team in years. If he's out next week, it will be a major loss.

I've seen no changes to the ZBS at all. The OL are still firing off at an angle and trying to generate movement in that fashion. What I am seeing is more I form and heavy fronts on average like we used to do in 2013 when we had Mike Rob. Reece has been key in this. From 2014 on we've seen more and more 3 WR sets up until we got Reece. I think we did see the height of 3 WR sets last year even with Tuku playing both FB and move TE.

ZBS hasn't changed. The changes are in formation mostly and I'm a big fan of it. I don't like pussyfoot pass first spread offenses as your base offense and especially not in the playoffs. It fails every time unless you have Tom Brady OR the OL and Faulk that the greatest show on turf had. There ar3 a couple of exceptions, but being passive in the playoffs generally means most teams will lose at least at some point during the playoff run. Someone will punch you in th3 mouth and you'll lose.

Good post Attyla.

Although I'm inclined to disagree with your 3rd point, the one thing I'd say is that overall, our OL has pass protected much better than they did last year (it doesn't seem like it, but the numbers support it...the improvement the last half of the year was scheme based as Montana mentioned). This is just more of an impression and the "eyeball" test, but it seems like the OL hasn't gotten better per assignments and when we give guys like Ifedi a target and a "go get em boy!" he identifies and blows them up.

ZBS has it's strong points, but when you get a physically talented enough OL, power and iso are typically better. As Seahawks fans we should agree with this after watching Holmgren's teams in the early and mid 2000's. It also doesn't make any sense: if you have a dominant OLman, why tell him to go fall down on the ground and hopefully take a guy down with him, instead of staying on his feet, mauling the guy, and physically dominating him ? (also the mental aspect of just getting physically whooped can't be understated either....look at the 4th quarter of the Lions game as the most recent example).

Look at Britt, Glowinski and Ifedi; the meat of our line and all SPARQ'd up athletes that are physically talented and strong as hell. In Britt's and Ifedi's case, they're athletic enough to play on the edge. Pete and John specialize in finding special athletes and good ways to use them, not just guys for their system. We've done that (athletically) on the OL and I'm happy that they've finally gone in the direction of the personnel's strengths.

A la Lynch and Mike Rob. "Now I got my eyes back" - Lynch referring to Mike Rob

Carroll praised the play of Reece, who joined the team last month following an eight-year career in Oakland.
“He’s really a consistent player, he’s smart, and he has learned over the years how things fit,” Carroll said. “One of the big deals about the fullback position is fitting right. The fullback actually runs the play for the tailback and the tailback reads off of the fullback when he’s leading him. So whatever cuts he makes, the tailback follows, then creates from there. Marcel has good instincts, so he fits things up really nicely. The old-style fullback of just bloodying the guy’s nose, that’s part of it, but that’s not the part of it’s that most important. We need to fit on the correct guy so we’ve covered up the right defender, then the running back takes off from there.
“He’s a good pass catcher, he moves well, he has good instincts about the passing game, he has a good sense for it. He has a little spark out there, and there are special things we can do with him because Tom (Cable) had him in his background, and they’ve got some familiarity we can draw from. He has jumped in to help us right away.”

Sgt. Largent":3ub86wdv said:

Hawks46":3ub86wdv said:

Sgt. Largent":3ub86wdv said:

Pete said in his post game presser there were no adjustments to their gameplanning or schemes, the lineman just finally put a good game together.

So Cable didn't throw a change up, our lineman just had a really good game.........and Rawls as well of course.

Now was this a product of the linemen? Or was this a product of Detroit not having a very good defense. IMO it's a mixture of both, but give the line credit, they had their best game of the year.

Also as many of us pointed out, NONE of the remaining teams in the playoffs from the NFC have dominant front 7's, so this is something our line should be able to sustain in Atlanta and hopefully the next week as well.

Click to expand...

So he's being sneaky Pete and I love it. Answers that question.

He can deny it all he wants, the stuff I saw was iso and power. Evidently, FG's just put out an article saying the same thing...with a former NFL Tackle verifying it as well.

Like coorslighthawk said a couple posts up, there have been a few elements and plays before, but I noticed a larger shift this game. It's brilliant either way. If the OL is able to go with both, you could have ZBS stretch runs on one play, then line up and have Ifedi, Glowinski and Britt fire off the ball into their guys the next. It's really hard to scout that and play against it, because there won't be any formation "tells" to let you know how your OL mirror is going to block you.

Click to expand...

Maybe, I'm not some sort of film nerd that breaks down every run play looking for drastic changes to blocking schemes and playcalling.


Now what I did see was finally a CONCERTED effort to run the damn ball, and IMO they could have run it even more. After Rawls was ripping off 5-10 yards a carry in the 1st half I was screaming at the TV to stop trying to throw it and just ram it down the Lion's throat cause they couldn't stop it.

Click to expand...

Whats with you?

We get it, you don't think they did anything different and somehow for some reason just started playing well.

However as many have pointed out, that isn't the case.

If people saw power and iso, thats what they saw, you yourself said youre not a film nerd that breaks down every play.

Thanks for your post Hawks46 its good to see some quality content reads.

Hawks46":rxfkbe0q said:

With our Offensive Line being large and very athletic, some of the more studied posters here have been clamoring for a change in run blocking scheme. The Zone blocking system is great for smaller, quicker OLmen. It gives them an advantage on larger DL's and also gets the DL running side to side a lot, thus wearing them down later in the game. Also, combo blocks help control the line of scrimmage while a guy peels off and grabs a LBer.

Problem this year seems to be that the ZBS we're running is too complicated for our younger guys. We're not getting beat physically, but mentally. It's blown assignments not physical mismatches that have caused our woes.

Well, Cable must have heard us. I saw a lot more iso and power run blocking this last game. On Rawls TD in particular, you saw Ifedi just walling his guy off and Britt making a really nifty seal on the NT, sealing him inside. Glowinski had at least 3 blocks where he just manned up and put his guy on skates, sometimes for 4 or 5 yards.

I'd like to see this going forward. Atlanta has a smallish DL that isn't stout at the point of attack. We can (and should) physically beat them, not let them use speed to penetrate gaps caused by missed assignments and create issues.

So the question would be: what took so long to make the adjustment? Was the coaching staff just waiting for the playoffs ? if so, that's seriously wicked on Pete's part. Think about this from Atlanta's DC's viewpoint: you now have a game on tape that has a bunch of ZBS stuff on it, and we just iso'd up on Detroit and gave you a bunch of things you haven't seen out of us.

Click to expand...

Very good observations. Was working, missed the game, and DVR didn't record, so I haven't watched it. If they did change schemes, I'm happy to hear it worked. My guess is that because it's the playoffs, they had to do something. I doubt they held it in their back pockets for now.

Brock was saying yesterday that for the most part things were the same but that they definitely threw some wrinkle in and featured a two back set a lot more then they have this year. I want to say he said they and 33 plays out of a 2 back look compared to 116 the rest of the year combine.