Re: Britt

King Dog

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I don't have the all-22 and don't pay a whole lot of attention to the OL during games except to curse them for pre-snap penalties or if we get owned.

Lots of talk early in the year that he was a bust at RT and a bust in general. How has he looked at G since the line has started to come together and he has had some time to acclimate to a new position?
 

Ad Hawk

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It's a good question. I can tell you without even looking at stats or replays that Russ isn't getting sacked or destroyed with the blitz in .25 secons like he was several weeks ago, and there are holes for Rawls to run through. That means Britt is doing his job.

But I'd love to hear an educated opinion from our resident experts.
 

Rob12

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I keyed in on him a few times today and he looked good to me. The entire line was solid, save the pre snap penalties.
 

Scottemojo

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Britt is going to be a damn good guard. He flashes it a bunch of times every game now. Especially as a run blocker.
 

Dizzlepdx

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I just finished re-watching the first half and some of the third and he was okay but definitely had some problems. 2nd drive, he blew his blocking assignment on the play where Russ got crushed, only to get bailed out by a questionable defensive holding. He wasn't much use in space on the two screen plays I saw; the first was the 20 yards Willson shake and bake and the second he was way too close to Okung and tripped over him/the guy he was guy trying to block.

His pass pro looked okay. At times he gets a little head heavy, which leaves him vulnerable to getting thrown. Run blocking was a mixed bag from the plays I saw. Front side plays-he had one really good 1v1 block, pushed the tackle off about 4 yards. The others were stalemates with nothing remarkable either way except on Rawls' TD run. He got pushed back a bit and lost leverage which is what forced the early cutback. When he was on the backside making cut blocks (which is very common in zone blocking schemes) he was, again, okay I guess. He always did enough to slow down the pursuit but only just. Ideally you're getting defenders all the way to the ground for bigger cut-back lanes (see the aforementioned Rawls TD).

So in summary, decent all around-doesn't often dominate and instead relies heavily on body positioning. Not gonna remind us of Hutchinson any time soon but given more recent history along the interior of the o-line (Max Unger excluded), I'll take him.
 

dopeboy206

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Off topic but Gary Gilliam sucks. He needs to be replaced in the off season asap.
 

Seafan

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dopeboy206":3vzadfbu said:
Off topic but Gary Gilliam sucks. He needs to be replaced in the off season asap.

Playing better than Britt last year. Seems like he'll be a starter for a while.
 

MysterMatt

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Gilliam isn't great, but he may become good enough. I sure hope so, because he'll be cheap for the next few seasons.
 

jammerhawk

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Britt is still a work in progress, he's quite inconsistent still but improving at his new position. He has moments where you say WTF is he doing, and then moments of reasonably good play. At times he looks to be quite physically dominant.

Gilliam is still a long way away from being an average RT, but is also getting better and flashes extremes of being awful and being not too bad. As a rookie at his RT position like Britt is at LG we can expect varied success. However if the progress continues with these two and Lewis the Hawks will have an OLine returning core that is basically acceptable to move ahead with next season.

I'm wondering what they will do with Sweezy and Okung this offseason?
 

Hawks46

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Good post Jammer.

Britt wasn't what you'd call a "bust" last year at RT; he was one of the best run blocking RT's in the league last year, but his pass pro left a lot to be desired. Color me shocked that a rookie coming from college needs a year to adjust to the speed and power of the NFL.

It's laughable how some people want to pull the plug on players right away. Is it lack of football knowledge or just our "we have to have everything now" information age ? "I can't wait for the 5 o'clock news, i have to have it on twitter every 30 seconds" type of stuff. Gilliam has never played RT. That he's not getting blown off the field when he's had no game reps at RT that I've ever heard about (or read about) before this year is a statement in itself. Some poster just said Gilliam was a bust and he needs to be cut now". Good grief.

I liken it to Irvin. People were ripping on him his first year as well, when the guy had never played LBer before, at ANY level. Now he's one of the best 4-3 OLB's in the league. He had 3 impact plays vs. Minn that were very good; one on a screen and two more on runs where he caused a negative or no gain play. Incidentally, that's 3 more plays I saw than Wagner produced, who's getting 10 m/year.

Gilliam will be fine. He'll end up playing somewhere else because we won't be able to afford him, or won't want to pay an OLman that much. Watching him play, he'll end up being that good, and probably our future LT.
 

theENGLISHseahawk

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Still some issues IMO -- with the occasional fantastic block thrown in too.

Case in point -- against minnesota on one play their linebacker showed blitz but actually just stood at the LOS and didn't even move (literally). Britt was totally confused. He watched his guy, a defensive lineman, just run straight into the backfield (Wilson had to throw it away) and focused on the standing linebacker. His body language said it all -- there was a total look of panic.

Hopefully greater experience will put an end to plays like this. I suspect most of his issues come when teams get a little exotic and present different challenges. Personally I'd still like to see them spend a reasonable draft pick on a college tackle who can challenge Britt in the summer for the LG spot.
 

v1rotv2

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Positions most targeted by defenses are those that are manned by rookies and this includes the Oline. Rookie tackles make for great weak points in the Oline and that's why they look so bad the first year or two. It's like judging a team's draft. You really have to wait 3 years to get a good evaluation. I'm not saying you have to wait 3 years to grade a rookie lineman but at least 2 years of solid snap counts is the minimum in my opinion.
 

Dizzlepdx

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theENGLISHseahawk":3gdqvaxm said:
Still some issues IMO -- with the occasional fantastic block thrown in too.

Case in point -- against minnesota on one play their linebacker showed blitz but actually just stood at the LOS and didn't even move (literally). Britt was totally confused. He watched his guy, a defensive lineman, just run straight into the backfield (Wilson had to throw it away) and focused on the standing linebacker. His body language said it all -- there was a total look of panic.

Do you remember when in the game this was? I'm interested in seeing it.
 

Jville

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Last year, Justin Britt was a lightening rod for many an impatient critic. Position theory states that an offensive line is only as strong as its' weakest link. The post of "v1rotv2" addresses the subject of rookies as probable opportunities of weakness. So with all the Wilson love and the time honored tradition of beating up a linemen over a missed or defeated block, there was little surprise that Britt would be heavily targeted by critics. In year two there seems to be plenty of evidence of a carry over effect from his rookie year at right tackle to his first year at left guard. I think carryover criticism is and was predictable. Justin Britt has made good progress in learning the left guard position. I suspect he has yet to zero in on his best playing weight. Britts' best games are clearly in his future. Tom Cable needs some year to year continuity in the line. Britt looks like he can continue to provide that while upgrading his game.

An important trait that impatient critics overlook is flexibility, durability and resilience. Justin Britt has logged the most snaps, among offensive linemen, again this year. JR Sweezy follows with the second most snaps for two consecutive years. And this year, Garry Gilliam has moved into the #3 spot for most logged snaps in his first year as a starter. Considering that Gilliam acknowledged that he was under strength, I find his durability both remarkable and encouraging.

With regards to Garry Gilliam, the early season weakness in run (power) blocking off of right tackle was, IMO, noticeable. However to Bevell's credit, play calls remained true to the principle of minimizing tendencies by resisting the temptation of avoiding a weak link or direction. That gave Gilliam the necessary opportunities to learn and build on his strength and technique. Off season photos of Gilliam showed a fit and taunt athlete that looked, to my eye, like a jumbo tight end. Last Sunday one could see a hint of a lineman's belly. To my eye he continues to add mass and strength as the season progresses. He continues to make good progress in his transition into a NFL starting tackle. His ceiling has become a bit of an unknown for me. But, I have little doubt his best games are in his near future.
 
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King Dog

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Dizzlepdx":9h5cuzr4 said:
theENGLISHseahawk":9h5cuzr4 said:
Still some issues IMO -- with the occasional fantastic block thrown in too.

Case in point -- against minnesota on one play their linebacker showed blitz but actually just stood at the LOS and didn't even move (literally). Britt was totally confused. He watched his guy, a defensive lineman, just run straight into the backfield (Wilson had to throw it away) and focused on the standing linebacker. His body language said it all -- there was a total look of panic.

Do you remember when in the game this was? I'm interested in seeing it.

This one I assume lol
AriW65Y
 

Hawks46

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v1rotv2":3aooqk20 said:
Positions most targeted by defenses are those that are manned by rookies and this includes the Oline. Rookie tackles make for great weak points in the Oline and that's why they look so bad the first year or two. It's like judging a team's draft. You really have to wait 3 years to get a good evaluation. I'm not saying you have to wait 3 years to grade a rookie lineman but at least 2 years of solid snap counts is the minimum in my opinion.

A very valid point. I remember when I played LBer, some schemes would have a Guard pulling. They would have a minor seal block, but mostly this was to draw the LBer out of the middle. Your read as a LBer is to flow down the line and follow the Guard, then scrape off behind him to catch the RB.

Teams do thing to confuse players. It's not always about lining up a guy head up and just plain beating him. In that specific Minn example, I can see Minn basically "wasting" that LBer to get Britt to read the wrong thing and let the DLman go free, which is exactly what happened.
 

LickMyNuts

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dopeboy206":r152jfug said:
Off topic but Gary Gilliam sucks. He needs to be replaced in the off season asap.


Would you go so far as to call Gilliam a Glorified Defensive End Manager?
 

Scottemojo

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HawkNuts":2cbdogse said:
dopeboy206":2cbdogse said:
Off topic but Gary Gilliam sucks. He needs to be replaced in the off season asap.


Would you go so far as to call Gilliam a Glorified Defensive End Manager?
Funny as hell. Would read again.
 

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