Fieldgulls - new angle on Wilson talks (multiple sources)

I know, I know, mods, it's yet another thread.

But this introduces such a new element to the contract holdout between Wilson and the Seahawks - actually claims to be the real reason Wilson's holding out for more money - that I thought it might be worth its own thread. Or at least, I haven't seen this particular angle discussed anywhere. (I did look.)

Basically it's not about the amount of guaranteed money but the way it's guaranteed. Most teams don't ACTUALLY guarantee money to players - they make guarantees but only actualize them on a per-year basis. Wilson wants all of his guaranteed money, for the entire duration of his contract, put in escrow for him right now. And that's not how NFL teams do things.

Basically, Wilson is trying to get Paul Allen to break a precedent amongst owners.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/2015/6/29/886 ... teed-money

This is total nitpicking I know but 'hold out' seems like a bad phrase for this. He hasn't come close to implying he wouldn't be on the field giving 100%. Semantics I guess just 'hold out' in football usually means something different.

Is RW attempting to be the next Curt Flood?

Interesting.

seedhawk":1gymdgd1 said:

Is RW attempting to be the next Curt Flood?

Click to expand...

He at least wants to push them on it. We won't know for a little while whether it's something he will go to the mat for. Everything you hear makes i sound like it just isn't "possible" (not literally, but that it won't happen). It's not completely hard to understand his perspective, work hard for a decade to get to a first big contract and know a huge portion can disappear in 1 injury. But, the teams perspective is quite clear too, unless everyone was doing this or there was no salary cap it's pretty tough. Unless they had some wacky formula that told them RW injury risk was next to nothing and they could just do it to make him happy then I don't think it can happen.

Good luck with that. Allen makes money by having money, and this demands that Allen give up his money early.

Won't happen due to it opening the pandoras box for the rest of the league and the other owners. Once one player gets it others will want that too so its best to keep that from happening. I am sure there is some form of collusion among the owners when it comes to this scenario.

Could well be RW and his agent are trying to kill 2 birds with 1 rock. First bird is guarantees, how they are paid, when they are paid, etc. Second bird is, RW has been grossly underpaid on his rook deal because the vets in the NFLPA , and the owners wanted a rook scale so more of the "you have to spend it" cap went to vets instead of high pick rooks. Are they looking to bury that provision, or just get something added so a really good young player who totally outperforms his contract can move up his negotiate a new deal timeline?

And let's not forget something else: If RW wins and Allen blinks, now the Seahawks HAVE to give him an Oline that protects their investment. And if Allen wins and RW blinks, that crap oline could end RW's career in a heartbeat.

If I were RW, I'd demand it too. I wouldn't blink. He can't. The oline is just that bad.

Id like to see Wilson's agent blacklisted if this is the case.

Paul Allen's not going to blink on this one... he can't.

Russell and his agent are essentially asking for the moon.

It won't happen... but begs the question, what is their strategy if Allen won't cave?

How long do they stay the course? ... through 2015?... through 2016?

How much money is Wilson willing to fore go in this essentially futile attempt to change NFL contract guarantees?

Perhaps he's setting himself up to be the NFLPA Executive Director for when he retires. Who knows what is his ultimate end game is.

It's all negotiations nonsense. The article of course is speculation.

And none of it matters. Certainly there is speculation that the baseball agent is trying to change football. They have no real leverage but if you don't ask for the moon....

Actually, when a player signs a contract for a ton of guaranteed money, the owner is supposed to write a check for the guaranteed portion and put that in escrow. The wording in the CBA is actually pretty shady on the matter stating that "the NFL may require" the team to put the money into escrow. It's actually the angle the NFLPA is using to try to prove collusion and have the CBA thrown out.

( More here. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...-contends-funding-rule-constitutes-collusion/
and here http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/10/suhs-60-million-will-be-fully-guaranteed/)

Might be a calculated move by the agent in order to push the NFLPA's case, and PA has to toe the line with the owner's guild. It's not like he's not good for it. Anyways, I find it HIGHLY unlikely this is the actual holdup in the contract negotiations.

I don't see how this happens. There are just far too many broader implications for the NFL if Allen caves.

RW has a bit of a crusader mentality in him that has served him well over the years. He's broken numerous barriers and he does not shy away from difficult issues.

My concern is that we won't break tradition and pay him guaranteed money, but that someone else will once he rides out this season. So many desperate teams that need QB help, you'd think some maverick owner who needs victories to pump up his team's value would consider it. Imagine if the Raiders decided they wanted him? They'd reform their image with their fans and have their QB for the next ten years, all because they broke rank.

A tempting proposition for Mark Davis I am sure...if he's anything like his old man anyway.

We'd lose him and he'd still get his guaranteed money. That's really tough to swallow for a player this franchise has waited it's entire existence for!

I don't know why this would be a hill to die on for RW? He's only missed one practice in his career and it was due to a funeral. To me, this seems to be more about Mark Rodgers than RW. I think this is Mark Rodgers trying to be the godfather of the guaranteed contracts movement in the NFL. He's trying to take his one NFL client and make a mark. He's trying to be historic for his benefit "and his clients".

I could see if this was almost any other position which are much more injury prone looking for this type of guaranteed contract, but it's just not the way things work in the NFL.

People, see Salk, who keep playing up the idea that Rogers is driving this to make a point or finagle his own place in NFL contracts are missing the point that Rogers is less Russell's agent and more his mentor and friend. I'm sure he advises Russell, but I don't see Russell being led around by the nose.

Whats wrong with asking? Honest question.....

Guys it's not even July 1 yet. We're still months away from the season. there is no harm in RW asking right now. Now when it comes time for him to lace the cleats up at 1.5 million. I bet you he'll be singing a different tune. But right now its a negotiation. Have you guys ever negotiated anything before? You start your ask high they start their offer low. you work towards the middle. Stop getting caught up in it. God I hate the 24 hour news cycle.

1) Many contracts are done with fully guaranteed portions

I think the real issue is the large amount that would be fully guaranteeed BUT

2) as linked above Suh's $60 million came ahead of RW

Now the escrow thing is stupid but the owner's could borrow the money from banks / investors (seriously what bank would not lend money to an NFL team). Sure they will pay some interest probably 5%-8% but that interest shouldn't go against the salary cap so that part would not be a negative

It wouldn't surprise me if this issue of wanting to change how NFL deals are guaranteed is all just a very clever, calculated negotiating tactic.

But, I could also see Russell someday wanting to be able to say "this was for all the players that come after me; for all the contracts that come after mine...", etc. I could see being an innovator as being important to him, as it has been in several other aspects of his career.

Many thought that given what we'd seen from him, his contract would be easy to get done. However, I think this news of him attempting to stare down the guarantee structure, and the overall approach to his deal, is right in line with the personality and competitive nature we've seen.

It's not surprising to me that he's super competitive and looking for new angles in his contract negotiations, just as we've seen from his play, preparation, commitment to charity, etc. etc.

He's a tenacious competitor, stubborn in his convictions, and has a knack for spinning the media. We're seeing all of that play out in his contract negotiations as well.

Regardless of how this plays out, he's here next year on the rookie deal, and the next two on the franchise tag. Possibly even a 4th year if they had to franchise him a 3rd year in a row. He's a Hawk for along period of time.