hawks need to use saints WR formula

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hawks need to use saints WR formula
Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:41 pm
  • I love our WR's they fight for the ball/yards like no other group in the NFL in my opinion but they are missing size. Russell Wilson throws alot of jump balls, they can go get the jump ball but they have to fight like hell to get it done and i think it's wearing them down. Seattle NEEDS some size WR's that at least are in the 6'3-6'6 ft tall range. Wilson throws alot of balls high becuase of his size and throwing over a big line to avoid getting passes batted down so he needs some players that can handle the high balls better and with less effort. By comparison Drew Brees has 4 WR's over 6'2 and the hawks tallest reciever is Lockette at 6'2. I thought the need was O-line but the last few games should me WR core needs size and depth.

    Not many players have declared for the Draft yet but here are a few seniors who have the physical potential and should be around when the hawks pick at the end of the first round:

    Brandon Coleman- 6'6 220 Rutgers WR.
    Everyone probably knows him and i think he has the physical tools the hawks are looking for if all the top DT's are gone i would take Coleman with the 1st rounder he played with a weak armed QB who did'nt put it up for Coleman to go get it won't be a problem with Wilson.

    Devin Street- 6'4 190 PITT WR.
    He's another tall WR with length in the arms and decent speed. Street needs to add strength and weight to his frame but has potential the seahawks don't have on the roster. Street has also been used in the slot so he should have better agility than Coleman but not the raw physical tools Coleman has.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:46 pm
  • We have attempted to go big and tall, they just have not made the squad becasue the short and quick can catch the damn ball when big and tall can't.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:49 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:We have attempted to go big and tall, they just have not made the squad becasue the short and quick can catch the damn ball when big and tall can't.

    This....or they got hurt, or whatever. They're still looking, and if a good one is there in the draft, I'm sure they'll bite.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:03 am
  • Well FA hasn't worked and the later round picks haven't exactly been great either so it's time to draft one early if there's a good one there. Wilson needs weapons.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 6:54 am
  • I expect this to be a big point of emphasis this year.

    They are going to have to get over their love of 40 times if they want that big posession guy.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:09 am
  • I'm personally expecting an Allen Robinson pick. 6'3, 210, and there's a good chance he's there late.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:37 am
  • Duron Carter (son of Cris), current Montreal Alouette. He's the big and fast WR this team needs.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:20 pm
  • I expect them to address the position this year. It's a deep draft and there should be good prospects available outside of round 1.

    Although we have to remember, we in essence used our #1 pick last year to add Harvin. You can't really afford to keep going back to the well on one position year after year. That's not the Saints model. That's the Detroit Lions model.

    I'd also mention, that the Saints and the Seahawks aren't the same kind of team. Our ways of competing and winning are not compatible. More than anything, Seattle needs talent to fit how they want to win games. It's easy to look at other rosters and pine for the talents they have. But it is absolutely a zero sum argument. Getting those players means not getting some of the guys we have.

    We are a defensive team first. The talents that translate to that aim have the greatest impact for us. Secondly, we are a running team. The talents that improve that function similarly have greater impact for us. Receivers for many teams are their "One player away" kind of prospect. For us, spending significant draft capital for a guy who is likely to only see the ball maybe 5 times a game has much lesser impact.

    I would not expect a WR in round one unless a particular player falls. And given the likely teams picking ahead of us in the latter part of round one, I don't really see one falling at all. It can happen sure. But I don't think the fit or the talent will conspire to meet in round 1.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:23 pm
  • drrew wrote:Duron Carter (son of Cris), current Montreal Alouette. He's the big and fast WR this team needs.


    He's got size at 6'5 and 205 pds but from all reports he has terrible work-ethic. He wouldn't fit in with this Seahawk team because of the superb work-ethic the players on the team are. All the talent in world doesn't replace hard work. Plus it has also been reported that he's a cancer and causes problems. He does have pretty good CFL numbers though.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:44 pm
  • hawkfan68 wrote:
    drrew wrote:Duron Carter (son of Cris), current Montreal Alouette. He's the big and fast WR this team needs.


    He's got size at 6'5 and 205 pds but from all reports he has terrible work-ethic. He wouldn't fit in with this Seahawk team because of the superb work-ethic the players on the team are. All the talent in world doesn't replace hard work. Plus it has also been reported that he's a cancer and causes problems. He does have pretty good CFL numbers though.



    So Mike Williams 2.0 but younger, if he doesn't self destruct, this team looks under every rock so if there is a chance of upgrade and they see something they will look at him.

    If he's a Lendale White they will show him the door.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 3:41 pm
  • Alshon Jeffery had a huge breakout season and he was compared to Big Mike Williams coming out of college. I think the Mike Williams experiment kind of made Pete wary of slower WRs, and JS has known nothing but fast receivers as Green Bay has a long history under Thompson of drafting nothing but speedsters and YAC guys. Given that JS was Thompson's protege, it's not surprising we've seen the same mentality translate here.

    I'm not following the draft closely at all this year. It appears Brandon Coleman had a tough season this year. He was a beast in 2012 though. Hit and miss, but in the games he played well, he looked like a unanimous Heisman winner. IIRC he had something unbelievably insane, like 19 yards per target or something, for a good long stretch that season. He has speed and a ton of size. Rob compared him to Megatron, but I see him as Stephen Williams plus plus plus. Incredibly inconsistent, but when he's on, he's the best player on the field. Those are the kinds of players PC/JS love to death. Guys who flash greatness but have issues that delegate them to the bargain bin.

    Remember how giddy JS was to sign Stephen Williams? I imagine he'll be positively ecstatic to nab Coleman wherever his draft stock puts him.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 4:37 pm
  • If the Seahawks desire a big WR, this draft can play into their hands. There are several options for big WRs - Cody Huffman, Kasen Williams, Allen Robinson, Tony Richardson, Brandon Coleman, Devin Street, Jared Abbederis, etc. They can grab a nice WR. After seeing this WR group, they don't need a #1 WR. They need someone who can be big, physical and help move the chains. Plus be a threat in the redzone. They need someone to complement Baldwin, Tate, Harvin, and Kearse. Especially if they decide to part ways with Rice.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Mon Dec 30, 2013 6:07 pm
  • The Seahawks need to draft a big WR like Kris Durham or Chris Harper or someone like that!
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 2:27 am
  • I LOVE Abrederris(sp?)! I would be jazzed if we drafted him and think he would make one he'll of a difference on this team. Iirc, RW was throwing to him at Wisconsin.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 8:54 am
  • McGruff wrote:The Seahawks need to draft a big WR like Kris Durham or Chris Harper or someone like that!


    Good point, they'd be much better off spending another first on Carpenter, or jaye howard in the 4th, john moffit in the 3rd perhaps? Id love another ej Wilson how about you guys? Lol.

    I love how these are the sort of comments people always make in reference to there disdain towards getting bigger wrs.. b-bu-but this one guy in the 4th didnt turn out...yeah alot of positions in the late rounds don't, we're spoiled here.

    And yeah js seems to like the faster guys, unfortunately harvin is our only fast wr on our roster outside of lockette.ive never seen tate or baldwin straight up out run someone in my life. Wrs just one of those positions you can't cheap out on usually. Btw disclaimer for homers, I love tate.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 12:58 pm
  • Baldwin UDFA and has decent speed, got him on the cheap if I remember. You can always go and try out Koren Robinson or Reggie Williams, Roy Williams,Charles Rogers,Bryant Johnson,Braylon Edwards, who isn't bad just a head case.Troy Williamson,Mike Williams, Ted Ginn Jr, Craig Davis, Anthony Gonzalez,Kenny Britt,Darrius Heyward-Bey,Jonathan Baldwin,A.J. Jenkins,Tavon Austin, All guys I look at that have been taken in first round and either never lived up to value, way under performed, or are head cases and more a problem for their teams then worth. I look at the odds as worse then a franchise QB. I only went back to 2003 but used Koren as an example here.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 1:24 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:Baldwin UDFA and has decent speed, got him on the cheap if I remember. You can always go and try out Koren Robinson or Reggie Williams, Roy Williams,Charles Rogers,Bryant Johnson,Braylon Edwards, who isn't bad just a head case.Troy Williamson,Mike Williams, Ted Ginn Jr, Craig Davis, Anthony Gonzalez,Kenny Britt,Darrius Heyward-Bey,Jonathan Baldwin,A.J. Jenkins,Tavon Austin, All guys I look at that have been taken in first round and either never lived up to value, way under performed, or are head cases and more a problem for their teams then worth. I look at the odds as worse then a franchise QB. I only went back to 2003 but used Koren as an example here.


    True. There have been a lot of duds at WR position in the first round. There also have been quite a number of good ones too. How about Andre Johnson, Dez Bryant, Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald, Hakeem Nicks, AJ Green....all have been solid to great WRs. So it cuts both ways.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 1:33 pm
  • No it doesn't really for every hit there seems to be 3 or 4 misses. Although the last two draft classes have been more hit then miss.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 2:12 pm
  • Actually I've wanted them to get a big receiver for years, and they've made a valiant effort with BMW, Durham, Harper, Williams . . . Even guys like Terrell Owens . . . I was just trying to make the point that getting one of those guys is easier said than done, and at the end of the day if the choice is between a small guy who can catch and a big guy who can't, well . . .
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 2:41 pm
  • First time I've seen him play this year, but ole Miss WR Donte Moncrief looked like someone we should target. 6'3 225 with 4.4 speed. He looked great yesterday.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 4:46 pm
  • CPHawk wrote:First time I've seen him at this year, but ole Miss WR Donte Moncrief looked like someone we should target. 6'3 225 with 4.4 speed. He looked great yesterday.

    Yeah, good mention. I looked at this guy for the first time about a month ago and he looks intriguing. Not sure yet, but I imagine he could be in the mix of the bigger WR's they'll take a look at. My younger son (a knowledgeable football player himself) said the Hawks should draft Moncrief because he's awesome.
    I'm interested to watch Jared Abbrederis play tomorrow in the Florida Citrus Bowl. He's a very productive player with a great attitude. He's as close to a can't miss prospect as players can get, imo. I think he would be the ideal choice (projected in the 2-3 round now, but could rise during evaluations), but what do I know? ;)
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 5:22 pm
  • TeamoftheCentury wrote:
    CPHawk wrote:First time I've seen him at this year, but ole Miss WR Donte Moncrief looked like someone we should target. 6'3 225 with 4.4 speed. He looked great yesterday.

    Yeah, good mention. I looked at this guy for the first time about a month ago and he looks intriguing. Not sure yet, but I imagine he could be in the mix of the bigger WR's they'll take a look at. My younger son (a knowledgeable football player himself) said the Hawks should draft Moncrief because he's awesome.
    I'm interested to watch Jared Abbrederis play tomorrow in the Florida Citrus Bowl. He's a very productive player with a great attitude. He's as close to a can't miss prospect as players can get, imo. I think he would be the ideal choice (projected in the 2-3 round now, but could rise during evaluations), but what do I know? ;)



    They said he is the fastest player on The team, so he might be faster than 4.4 even.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:26 pm
  • IMO the two best big WR that are great jump ball WR are Florida St K.B. and Arizona St Jaelen Strong, but they have not declared yet. One of my favorite WR in the draft, outside of Kelvin Benjamin, is Saginaw Valley State University WR Jeff Janis. Janis is a WR that we have mentioned before and that I find highly intriguing. He is 6-3 218 lbs., he has good quickness and speed. Small school stud that could be had somewhere in the first three rounds.



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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:50 pm
  • Saginaw Valley State University WR Jeff Janis, we have seen what competition from there translates to the NFL, he had better have freak numbers to consider him.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Wed Jan 01, 2014 9:22 am
  • chris98251 wrote:Saginaw Valley State University WR Jeff Janis, we have seen what competition from there translates to the NFL, he had better have freak numbers to consider him.


    Scouts have to look under every rock to find NFL prospect, be it the Canadian Football League (Brandon Browner and Cameron Wake) or Division II schools (WR Vincent Jackson, OG Jahri Evans, OT Jared Veldheer).

    Level of competition always has to be considered in evaluating prospects, which is why Janis is not a 1st round prospect. Had he put up his big stats in a conference like the Pac-12 then he would be a household name. There are only two players from Division II schools playing in the Senior Bowl and Janis is one of the two, so he is defiantly high on NFL scouting radars. Janis has the production, size at 6-3 218 lbs., and he supposedly runs a 4.40 or even 4.3 40-yard. The Senior Bowl practices and the game itself will give Janis a great opportunity to show scouts how well he can play against the best college football players in the nation. I'm hoping that he is the real deal and blows everyone away during Senior Bowl week, the more proven WR talent in this year's draft the better for the Seahawks.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Wed Jan 01, 2014 11:28 am
  • I think the Hawks need a legit big body WR, who isn't just a possession guy. Part of the reason the OL has struggled is because we don't have threats on the perimeter which allows the defense to focus more on the LOS.

    I love Golden and Baldwin, but they do not require game planning. They are damn good players, but they just don't propose a legitimate threat on the perimeter.

    I think some of you will be amazed about the progress the OL makes this post season if/when Harvin gets on the field. Even with Harvin, I still think we owe it to RW and his development to get him a bigger body, legit #1/2 WR.

    I still think we need another good OL, but chances are we can get a premiere WR in the 1st round, as opposed to looking at a 2nd round talent at OL (at the same pick). OL always gets over drafted, while positions like WR fall a little more. Take advantage of that and help out our young, soon to be elite QB.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Wed Jan 01, 2014 5:36 pm
  • cover-2 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Saginaw Valley State University WR Jeff Janis, we have seen what competition from there translates to the NFL, he had better have freak numbers to consider him.


    Scouts have to look under every rock to find NFL prospect, be it the Canadian Football League (Brandon Browner and Cameron Wake) or Division II schools (WR Vincent Jackson, OG Jahri Evans, OT Jared Veldheer).

    Level of competition always has to be considered in evaluating prospects, which is why Janis is not a 1st round prospect. Had he put up his big stats in a conference like the Pac-12 then he would be a household name. There are only two players from Division II schools playing in the Senior Bowl and Janis is one of the two, so he is defiantly high on NFL scouting radars. Janis has the production, size at 6-3 218 lbs., and he supposedly runs a 4.40 or even 4.3 40-yard. The Senior Bowl practices and the game itself will give Janis a great opportunity to show scouts how well he can play against the best college football players in the nation. I'm hoping that he is the real deal and blows everyone away during Senior Bowl week, the more proven WR talent in this year's draft the better for the Seahawks.



    Just hoping we don't have a Lamar King again.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Thu Jan 02, 2014 4:35 am
  • Watching the vid of Janis,I'm not feeling what others are,I notice he doesn't seperate from coverage and yet he's supposed to have this 4.3 speed?He also seems easy to tackle..I'll give him props for good hands but I can't see more than a possesion type wr out of him..Def wouldn't draft him higher than 4-5th rd..If even that sorry...
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Thu Jan 02, 2014 8:49 am
  • Janis will be one to watch in the Senior Bowl. He'll match up with better competition there.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Thu Jan 02, 2014 5:43 pm
  • IndyHawk wrote:Watching the vid of Janis,I'm not feeling what others are,I notice he doesn't seperate from coverage and yet he's supposed to have this 4.3 speed?He also seems easy to tackle..I'll give him props for good hands but I can't see more than a possesion type wr out of him..Def wouldn't draft him higher than 4-5th rd..If even that sorry...


    It's waaay too early to be giving prospects final draft grades especially the small school prospects. It is difficult to really get a feel for his speed because 1) it's not the greatest video and most importantly 2) the level of competition he is playing against.

    If you are like me and enjoy watching the Senior Bowl practices and the game itself, then Janis is defiantly a player to watch. Lets see if his quickness and speed stand out OR is he "just a guy" nothing special.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:27 am
  • cover-2 wrote:
    IndyHawk wrote:Watching the vid of Janis,I'm not feeling what others are,I notice he doesn't seperate from coverage and yet he's supposed to have this 4.3 speed?He also seems easy to tackle..I'll give him props for good hands but I can't see more than a possesion type wr out of him..Def wouldn't draft him higher than 4-5th rd..If even that sorry...


    It's waaay too early to be giving prospects final draft grades especially the small school prospects. It is difficult to really get a feel for his speed because 1) it's not the greatest video and most importantly 2) the level of competition he is playing against.

    If you are like me and enjoy watching the Senior Bowl practices and the game itself, then Janis is defiantly a player to watch. Lets see if his quickness and speed stand out OR is he "just a guy" nothing special.

    I think the guy (Janis) will be exposed in that S.Bowl how is he going to wow against tougher players when he can't in that vid ???Just blow up the vid and you clearly see he is no 4.3 speedster against weaker players..I'm usually open minded but I have to see something in that player first..At best he will be an Austin Collie and far from Eric Decker..There are no more Steve Largents and haven't been since he left..Decker might be the closest and he's far back lol...
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Fri Jan 03, 2014 5:44 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:
    cover-2 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:Saginaw Valley State University WR Jeff Janis, we have seen what competition from there translates to the NFL, he had better have freak numbers to consider him.


    Scouts have to look under every rock to find NFL prospect, be it the Canadian Football League (Brandon Browner and Cameron Wake) or Division II schools (WR Vincent Jackson, OG Jahri Evans, OT Jared Veldheer).

    Level of competition always has to be considered in evaluating prospects, which is why Janis is not a 1st round prospect. Had he put up his big stats in a conference like the Pac-12 then he would be a household name. There are only two players from Division II schools playing in the Senior Bowl and Janis is one of the two, so he is defiantly high on NFL scouting radars. Janis has the production, size at 6-3 218 lbs., and he supposedly runs a 4.40 or even 4.3 40-yard. The Senior Bowl practices and the game itself will give Janis a great opportunity to show scouts how well he can play against the best college football players in the nation. I'm hoping that he is the real deal and blows everyone away during Senior Bowl week, the more proven WR talent in this year's draft the better for the Seahawks.



    Just hoping we don't have a Lamar King again.

    Well, Russell Wilson didn't turn out to be another Chris McIntosh. :Dunno:
    Janis has skills. Has the potential to be a draft steal.
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Re: hawks need to use saints WR formula
Fri Jan 03, 2014 8:36 pm
  • IndyHawk wrote:
    cover-2 wrote:
    IndyHawk wrote:Watching the vid of Janis,I'm not feeling what others are,I notice he doesn't seperate from coverage and yet he's supposed to have this 4.3 speed?He also seems easy to tackle..I'll give him props for good hands but I can't see more than a possesion type wr out of him..Def wouldn't draft him higher than 4-5th rd..If even that sorry...


    It's waaay too early to be giving prospects final draft grades especially the small school prospects. It is difficult to really get a feel for his speed because 1) it's not the greatest video and most importantly 2) the level of competition he is playing against.

    If you are like me and enjoy watching the Senior Bowl practices and the game itself, then Janis is defiantly a player to watch. Lets see if his quickness and speed stand out OR is he "just a guy" nothing special.

    I think the guy (Janis) will be exposed in that S.Bowl how is he going to wow against tougher players when he can't in that vid ???Just blow up the vid and you clearly see he is no 4.3 speedster against weaker players..I'm usually open minded but I have to see something in that player first..At best he will be an Austin Collie and far from Eric Decker..There are no more Steve Largents and haven't been since he left..Decker might be the closest and he's far back lol...


    Well you are entitled to your opinion, and maybe Janis will get exposed at the Senior Bowl. But, being a "youtube scout" or "stat sheet scout" is lazy IMO. Giving definite statements on a highlight clip is a bit ridiculous. While I also have questions about his 4.4 or 4.3 speed, I want to see how he stacks up against better competition. WR is a need so I'll be looking at all the WR's at the Senior Bowl practices.
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